UFO's - Do you believe that Extraterrestrials have visited/are visiting this planet?

[Hungry Joe]

and continue to believe the bible to simply be a book af fables put together by superstitious goat herders several thousand years ago.

I struggle to understand how anyone can consider the bible as anything other than a collection of allegorical fables. I often wonder what the writers would make of their tales being taken so literally and being used as excuses to abuse and kill each other for centuries.

 

[One Love]

Not at all imo. We sceptics and non-believers have many times said what would convince us to change our minds. For me you could easily get me to believe in god if you showed me a fossilised bunny in the pre-cambrian layer. No such thing has ever been found and so I continue to be a sceptic about any sky daddy and continue to believe the bible to simply be a book af fables put together by superstitious goat herders several thousand years ago.

As for aliens. Simples. Show me scientific evidence that the earth is subject to extra-terrestrial visitations. Instead of using conspiracy theory rubbish use science and the scientific method. Do that and prove using those methods that aliens visit us and I will recant my scepticism on this subject and believe.

Now, what will convinice you that your believes are wrong?

Firstly, great example of what we've been talking about with the "sky daddy" and continuing disparaging remarks.

I would be convinced that my beliefs were wrong if I had another explanation for my experiences or was convinced by something/someone that they were not what I thought.

I try to have more and more awareness in my daily life so I can learn the truth.

 

[Hungry Joe]

Firstly, great example of what we've been talking about with the "sky daddy" and continuing disparaging remarks.

I would be convinced that my beliefs were wrong if I had another explanation for my experiences or was convinced by something/someone that they were not what I thought.

I try to have more and more awareness in my daily life so I can learn the truth.

The language and arrogance are the biggest problems I have with a lot of the sceptics, even when I lean towards their arguments. Shame really as most of them are obviously intelligent enough not to need to descend into disparaging remarks. At then end of the day you believe what you believe, and that's your right. If you see supernatural meaning in a book where I just see tales of morality then that's your choice. I might struggle to understand it, but that doesn't mean I'm right.

 

[readingstockport]

But sciene has continually over the years chipped away at the god of the bible and other faith books. There is a reason that atheists and other sceptics refer to the god of the gaps. Each time somehting is scientifically explained those of faith point at the ever shrinking gap and say 'h, but you cant explain that gap CAN YOU - therefore god' And then that gap is closed by science so the next, even smaller, gap is seized on and claimed to be proof of god.

And I'm sorry - genuinely in truth - that you find sky daddy disparaging. I do not believe in the supernatural deity and this is a phrase I have used for over 35 years to refer to the comfort blanket that some of faith use.

Anyway I'm off again to watch the cycling and archery. Have a good day people and watch out for all the illuminati symbolism during the various events today.

 

[beorhthelm]

The language and arrogance are the biggest problems I have with a lot of the sceptics,.

exacly the same can be said for the conspiracists. if you dont believe them, you're blinkered, naive, sheep, too stupid to see the "evidence". and in the case of religion they have a track record of persecution of non-believers.

 

[readingstockport]

The language and arrogance are the biggest problems I have with a lot of the sceptics, even when I lean towards their arguments. Shame really as most of them are obviously intelligent enough not to need to descend into disparaging remarks. At then end of the day you believe what you believe, and that's your right. If you see supernatural meaning in a book where I just see tales of morality then that's your choice. I might struggle to understand it, but that doesn't mean I'm right.

Ok, one last reply and then I am off. The 'disparaging' remarks stem from total frustration.

Time and time again ct'ers have had it explained to them why they are wrong. Witnes the argument I had with (I think it was) dingdan who claimed all sorts of things about planes not knowing I hold a pilots licence and when I pointed out he was simply wrong he ignored what I said and claimed that despite taking exams on aviation I did not know what I was talking about.

And time and time again those of faith have the contradictions in their faith(s) pointed out to them. Time and time again it is explained to them why ther deity is either non-existant or if extant then it can not be considered either loving nor merciful. And time and time again they ignore things. Take for example 2 Kings 2:23-24. How can a deity that send she bears to tear apart children be considered either loving or merciful but I have yet to hear a christian explain to me why my reading of the verses is wrong.

So, frustration causes the - at times - short and bad temper. Willfull ignorance is a terrible thing and that is what I consider the vast majority of ct'ers and those of faith to be practicing.

 

[Hungry Joe]

exacly the same can be said for the conspiracists. if you dont believe them, you're blinkered, naive, sheep, too stupid to see the "evidence". and in the case of religion they have a track record of persecution of non-believers.

Fair point.

 

[Hungry Joe]

Ok, one last reply and then I am off. The 'disparaging' remarks stem from total frustration.

Time and time again ct'ers have had it explained to them why they are wrong. Witnes the argument I had with (I think it was) dingdan who claimed all sorts of things about planes not knowing I hold a pilots licence and when I pointed out he was simply wrong he ignored what I said and claimed that despite taking exams on aviation I did not know what I was talking about.

And time and time again those of faith have the contradictions in their faith(s) pointed out to them. Time and time again it is explained to them why ther deity is either non-existant or if extant then it can not be considered either loving nor merciful. And time and time again they ignore things. Take for example 2 Kings 2:23-24. How can a deity that send she bears to tear apart children be considered either loving or merciful but I have yet to hear a christian explain to me why my reading of the verses is wrong.

So, frustration causes the - at times - short and bad temper. Willfull ignorance is a terrible thing and that is what I consider the vast majority of ct'ers and those of faith to be practicing.

You don't need to try and convince me on any of that mate, I fully agree. All I'd say is try not to get frustrated to that point, it's not good for your Zen man

 

[One Love]

And I'm sorry - genuinely in truth - that you find sky daddy disparaging. I do not believe in the supernatural deity and this is a phrase I have used for over 35 years to refer to the comfort blanket that some of faith use.

The last part of this sentence is another example of the disparaging opinion you have. You just don't seem to be able to comment on these threads without showing that your lack of belief is so firmly rooted that there is absolutely NO room for consideration of an alternative. However you class yourself as a sceptic! A sceptic questions their beliefs and ideals. Do you? Really?

By the way, your first paragraph I don't agree with.

 

[BHAFC_Pandapops]

Yep, it comes originally from India and is more accurately named chan - it morphed into what is now known as Zen during it's journey from India, via China to Japan. And it is sod all to do with 'changing frequencies' whatever the hell that means.

On a slightly different, but slightly related, note I spent yesterday at the Olympic archery and I can tell you it is actually a damn fine sport to watch. And the archers acheive almost zen like calm immediately preceding the release but not one of them 'changed frequency'. Look up kyudo and watch the practitioners of that and you may begin to get the point.

edited for carp speeling.

i read into frequency change as to being when one alters state of mind in such a way so as to achieve something better than they could never achieve in a normal frame of mind and body.

 

[One Love]

Ok, one last reply and then I am off. The 'disparaging' remarks stem from total frustration.

Time and time again ct'ers have had it explained to them why they are wrong. Witnes the argument I had with (I think it was) dingdan who claimed all sorts of things about planes not knowing I hold a pilots licence and when I pointed out he was simply wrong he ignored what I said and claimed that despite taking exams on aviation I did not know what I was talking about.

And time and time again those of faith have the contradictions in their faith(s) pointed out to them. Time and time again it is explained to them why ther deity is either non-existant or if extant then it can not be considered either loving nor merciful. And time and time again they ignore things. Take for example 2 Kings 2:23-24. How can a deity that send she bears to tear apart children be considered either loving or merciful but I have yet to hear a christian explain to me why my reading of the verses is wrong.

So, frustration causes the - at times - short and bad temper. Willfull ignorance is a terrible thing and that is what I consider the vast majority of ct'ers and those of faith to be practicing.

By the way, I was on your "side" against the 911 plane thing and I don't follow the bible.

Yet you treat me online in your disparaging manner.

 

[Nibble]

I'm sorry if people are offended or feel it lessens my argument if I call someone a simpleton, dolt etc. I mean these in the most literal of terms and I believe that people who do not have an open enough mind to consider all possibilties and reject the frankly ludicrous ones are in my opinion, simple. I think anyone that has allowed themselves to be pursuaded into fervedly believing something that is so categorically fantastical is posessed of a weak mind. It's a point I feel I have made quite enough of.

I spent a fair bit of time in my late teens looking into alternative views of the universe, astral projection, meditation etc. Mainly because my older brother was very much into it (he later admitted it was hokum and that the group he was involved with made a lot of money from him and were taking advantage of the weak minded, he has since given up that nonsense and concentrates his efforts very much in the real world as a paramedic). I visited a lot of groups, did a lot of meditation and genuinely held an interest in such matters. I grew out of it and my interests changed. I still meditate as I found this to be the only aspect of that whole genre that had a practical use and health benefits. People should be less hasty in ascribing fantastical explanations to things that are just genuinely a simple, life affirming act, such as meditation.

My only real interest in the Bible would be to investigate a few of the aspects of it that may have roots in fact. You could say that would be "The Holy Grail" for anyone in my field of work, though British Mythology and legend has a vast wealth of unexplored history, that funnily enough sometimes crosses over with some of the more obscure beliefs held by posters on this forum.

 

[One Love]

I think anyone that has allowed themselves to be pursuaded into fervedly believing something that is so categorically fantastical is posessed of a weak mind. It's a point I feel I have made quite enough of.

So because you haven't experienced something it is fantastical? Do you really know how arrogant that sounds?

My wife has a friend who has known me for over 20 years. One day she asked me about my beliefs, I told her and her words were "What a load of bollocks!"

Afterwards she spoke to my wife and said she had dismissed my being stupid or weak-minded because she knew me quite well so the alternative for her was that I had been brain-washed!

FFS

 

[BHAFC_Pandapops]

I'm sorry if people are offended or feel it lessens my argument if I call someone a simpleton, dolt etc. I mean these in the most literal of terms and I believe that people who do not have an open enough mind to consider all possibilties and reject the frankly ludicrous ones are in my opinion, simple. I think anyone that has allowed themselves to be pursuaded into fervedly believing something that is so categorically fantastical is posessed of a weak mind. It's a point I feel I have made quite enough of.

I spent a fair bit of time in my late teens looking into alternative views of the universe, astral projection, meditation etc. Mainly because my older brother was very much into it (he later admitted it was hokum and that the group he was involved with made a lot of money from him and were taking advantage of the weak minded, he has since given up that nonsense and concentrates his efforts very much in the real world as a paramedic). I visited a lot of groups, did a lot of meditation and genuinely held an interest in such matters. I grew out of it and my interests changed. I still meditate as I found this to be the only aspect of that whole genre that had a practical use and health benefits. People should be less hasty in ascribing fantastical explanations to things that are just genuinely a simple, life affirming act, such as meditation.

My only real interest in the Bible would be to investigate a few of the aspects of it that may have roots in fact. You could say that would be "The Holy Grail" for anyone in my field of work, though British Mythology and legend has a vast wealth of unexplored history, that funnily enough sometimes crosses over with some of the more obscure beliefs held by posters on this forum.

frankly I'd rather someone thought outside the box about the mysteries of the universe than sit there making slander all those beliefs that sound to you like they may be fantastical.

the fact is everyone's guess is as good as each other's. Opinion is a whole different ball park when you start talking to people like they're missing a few million brain cells because you disagree.

 

[Nibble]

People,people,people, lets all keep our Alan's on and get a little perspective shall we? You have every right to get in a tizz over my opinion of you but the basic fact is that you believe in ludicrous things and are clearly bonkers. And no, not everyone's guess is as good as another. The person who presents to me the most educated, well thought out and above all most likely argument or theory is the better guess over spaze lizards, astral frequency alteration (christ!) and the thousand conspiract theories. I may give some of your beliefs some kudos if the same people didn't discredit themselves by falling hook line and sinker for conspiracy bollocks.

None of you have put up any convincing argument for your beliefs but time and time again have just said "It's what I believe". Well excuse me if I thnk you're full of bobbins and your entire philiosophy has come from loosely connected flummery gleaned from random google searches. I am first in line to defend your right to believe in whatever gets you through life and makes you happy but I am also first in line to tell you, you are head mental. That is all.

 

[Nibble]

frankly I'd rather someone thought outside the box about the mysteries of the universe than sit there making slander all those beliefs that sound to you like they may be fantastical.

the fact is everyone's guess is as good as each other's. Opinion is a whole different ball park when you start talking to people like they're missing a few million brain cells because you disagree.

Using shocking written English and structure like that doesn't help your flawed arguments either.

 

[BHAFC_Pandapops]

Using shocking written English and structure like that doesn't help your flawed arguments either.

there we go...

 

[Nibble]

there we go...

Sorry to offend but when building a general picture of people, so I can judge how reliable they might be when presenting a given subject, their basic grasp of their native language is high on my list. However badly or well written your argument, nothing in this case would alter my frequency enough to believe the utter twaddle that has been written on this thread from you and yours. I weep for the future.

 

[BHAFC_Pandapops]

Sorry to offend but when building a general picture of people, so I can judge how reliable they might be when presenting a given subject, their basic grasp of their native language is high on my list. However badly or well written your argument, nothing in this case would alter my frequency enough to believe the utter twaddle that has been written on this thread from you and yours. I weep for the future.

I think you've just resorted to nitpicking as another way to make yourself seem somehow superior to everyone else. First you belittle what people believe, then, when you're called out on it you do this.

I really don't get why people like you take every letter of every word of every sentence and nitpick a bit or all of it. It doesn't matter. It's the internet.

Evidently though you would take it that serious. Your post count says a lot about you.

Question. When (if) you jack an argument like this in real life, do you end up resorting to petty grammatical correction?

 

[Nibble]

I think you've just resorted to nitpicking as another way to make yourself seem somehow superior to everyone else. First you belittle what people believe, then, when you're called out on it you do this.

I really don't get why people like you take every letter of every word of every sentence and nitpick a bit or all of it. It doesn't matter. It's the internet.

Evidently though you would take it that serious. Your post count says a lot about you.

Question. When (if) you jack an argument like this in real life, do you end up resorting to petty grammatical correction?

Quite the opposite chap, I cannot take this conversation seriously at all but I'm stuck in with a chest infection and I just can't help posting on this arse of a thread for some reason!! I just see rushed,addled sentences as an indicator of one's mind. In the vast majority of life's debates I see it as having very little relavence. If I am invited to offer my opinion, as I was, on a matter such as people's beliefs I think it has some relevence. I think you have done ever so well in defending your position. However, ultimately all the petty comebacks, character study etc is pointless when faced with the cold, hard fact that you, dingodan and one love are mental.