[Politics] Tory meltdown finally arrived [was: incoming]...

[Neville's Breakfast]

You are making the mistake of assuming that because you are educated and voted Leave this makes you representative of (an identifiable minority, even if a minority it may be) Leave voters. I work at one of the top 5 universities in the UK, and have chatted with hundreds of colleagues about Brexit and none of them (claim to have) voted Leave. Of my wider acquaintance I know only one Leave voter, and he now regrets his vote as all the business red tape he was expecting to melt has reproduced, hydra-like.

When I was a working class lad and got my first sensible job (between degrees) I read the Daily Mirror and Private Eye. My line manage (who read The Times and Private Eye) couldn't get his head around me. I was under no illusions that I was representative of anything. And there is no need to be, albeit when we find we are it can seem comforting.

As far as elitism is concerned, I'm in favour of those with a good education and working mind to take the lead on issues. The day I start looking to gobshites, cretins and Nigel Farrage for inspiration is the day I hold up my hand and admit to the early signs of vascular dementia.

I would also add that yes Starmer has declared he won't reverse Brexit. Despite the short-term gain I suspect this may have the potential to be a hostage to fortune. However it is expedient to make such a declaration, and it is far less a mendacious assertion than most of those made that persuaded the likes of educated you to vote for Johnson. I suspect you are right in that some sort of settled Brexit arrangements will emerge (even though I cannot immediately see how - NI) and this will truly be a dead issue. But it isn't quit, yet. We shall see.

Enjoy your weekend. At the end of the day it's a wonderful thing to be alive .

Yes indeed to your last sentence

I don’t doubt your experience but mine includes speaking privately to a fair number of teachers who duck out of Brexit conversations because they voted Leave and didn’t need the hassle. I don’t think I am representative of anything. Just making the point that it is a bit jarring to read contemptuousness towards certain groups considering how I spend my days.

 

[Machiavelli]

It's there for all the world to see.

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When questioned, the mantra is getting on with the job. What job are they actually getting on with? Answers on a postage stamp.

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It's a disgrace that she's been made Education Minister, but hardly a surprise. I've got plenty of criticisms of Blair, but one thing you can't accuse him of as not making education a priority. This is in stark contrast for the past 12 years of Tory governments, which has run down education spending, and diverted too much of what was left to the free schools nonsense. At one point this week, there was nobody left in the Education department, we've had three Education Secretaries this week too. Gavin Williamson was Education Secretary for about three years, for crying out loud.

 

[schmunk]

He admitted on the news this morning that it was made clear to him that he had nowhere near the support needed. That's why he is now behind thick joint Braverman.

She may have some rather distasteful beliefs, but she's not thick.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Ben Wallace isn’t running.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

You're a teacher? crikey

Lovely

 

[Machiavelli]

You are making the mistake of assuming that because you are educated and voted Leave this makes you representative of (an identifiable minority, even if a minority it may be) Leave voters. I work at one of the top 5 universities in the UK, and have chatted with hundreds of colleagues about Brexit and none of them (claim to have) voted Leave. Of my wider acquaintance I know only one Leave voter, and he now regrets his vote as all the business red tape he was expecting to melt has reproduced, hydra-like.

When I was a working class lad and got my first sensible job (between degrees) I read the Daily Mirror and Private Eye. My line manage (who read The Times and Private Eye) couldn't get his head around me. I was under no illusions that I was representative of anything. And there is no need to be, albeit when we find we are it can seem comforting.

As far as elitism is concerned, I'm in favour of those with a good education and working mind to take the lead on issues. The day I start looking to gobshites, cretins and Nigel Farrage for inspiration is the day I hold up my hand and admit to the early signs of vascular dementia.

I would also add that yes Starmer has declared he won't reverse Brexit. Despite the short-term gain I suspect this may have the potential to be a hostage to fortune. However it is expedient to make such a declaration, and it is far less a mendacious assertion than most of those made that persuaded the likes of educated you to vote for Johnson. I suspect you are right in that some sort of settled Brexit arrangements will emerge (even though I cannot immediately see how - NI) and this will truly be a dead issue. But it isn't quit, yet. We shall see.

Enjoy your weekend. At the end of the day it's a wonderful thing to be alive .

Yes, indeed. 91% of university staff voted Remain. There was a clear educational divide between the Leave-Remain votes (although that was in part explained by the age demographics of both votes). All of this is laid out in several publications, the most interesting of which (although ultimately I disagree with too much of it) is The Road to Somewhere by David Goodhart -- which is the inspiration of the citizens of nowhere/somewhere analogy Theresa May used in her inaugural address on Downing St.

 

[Machiavelli]

Yes indeed to your last sentence

I don’t doubt your experience but mine includes speaking privately to a fair number of teachers who duck out of Brexit conversations because they voted Leave and didn’t need the hassle. I don’t think I am representative of anything. Just making the point that it is a bit jarring to read contemptuousness towards certain groups considering how I spend my days.

I'd add that the 'bit thick' accusation is hardly going to work in persuading people round to your point of view.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Sunak doesn't know anyone working class.

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[TomandJerry]

Ben Wallace will not join race to become leader
The defence secretary, who had been an early front-runner, now says he does not wish to run as leader. Instead, he says his focus should remain on “keeping this great country safe”.

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[mikeyjh]

Has put the anti-woke agenda at the forefront of her campaign.

It's quite remarkable that in this post Brexit, post Johnson world that nastiest of parties think it's okay to have someone who will openly campaign against something so basic as being aware of prejudice and discrimination. Then we have someone who thinks it's okay to give the middle finger to a group of people protesting outside Downing St, (people who will have absolutely no idea who she is by the way) a senior ministerial position - That's elitism by the way, if some people need to be educated on the word, telling the great unwashed where to go.

 

[WATFORD zero]

You are making the mistake of assuming that because you are educated and voted Leave this makes you representative of (an identifiable minority, even if a minority it may be) Leave voters. I work at one of the top 5 universities in the UK, and have chatted with hundreds of colleagues about Brexit and none of them (claim to have) voted Leave. Of my wider acquaintance I know only one Leave voter, and he now regrets his vote as all the business red tape he was expecting to melt has reproduced, hydra-like.

When I was a working class lad and got my first sensible job (between degrees) I read the Daily Mirror and Private Eye. My line manage (who read The Times and Private Eye) couldn't get his head around me. I was under no illusions that I was representative of anything. And there is no need to be, albeit when we find we are it can seem comforting.

As far as elitism is concerned, I'm in favour of those with a good education and working mind to take the lead on issues. The day I start looking to gobshites, cretins and Nigel Farrage for inspiration is the day I hold up my hand and admit to the early signs of vascular dementia.

I would also add that yes Starmer has declared he won't reverse Brexit. Despite the short-term gain I suspect this may have the potential to be a hostage to fortune. However it is expedient to make such a declaration, and it is far less a mendacious assertion than most of those made that persuaded the likes of educated you to vote for Johnson. I suspect you are right in that some sort of settled Brexit arrangements will emerge (even though I cannot immediately see how - NI) and this will truly be a dead issue. But it isn't quit, yet. We shall see.

Enjoy your weekend. At the end of the day it's a wonderful thing to be alive .

I do think it strange that Starmer has announced that he is going to follow the same logical cul de sac on NI, import controls, export costs etc and is currently thinking 'shit, I should have left it another week'. It may well get Labour votes back from Brexit supporters, possibly at the cost of losing voters to the Lib Dems, but the main issue is of course, it offers no solution to Northern Ireland, Import controls and the hammering that exporters are still taking.

I suspect that any Lib/Lab coalition (which is still the only realistic alternative to a Conservative majority, exactly the same as 2.5 years ago) will have the Libs insisting on re-opening the single market debate as part of the coalition agreement and then Labour can claim is wasn't them

And as I mentioned before, someone closer to all this than me, suggested a few weeks back that it may well be the conservatives who re-opened the single market discussions. With the leadership debates coming up, it will give one of them the opportunity to resolve Northern Ireland and the Import Controls in one foul swoop, whilst offering some sort of economic recovery to thousands of struggling companies, against the oncoming economic storm. I'm beginning to regret telling him he was talking bollox

But one thing is for sure, anyone who thinks that 'it is done' and no longer an issue obviously doesn't understand what 'it' is

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

Ben Wallace isn’t running.

Shame. He's one of the better ones.

 

[peterward]

Ben Wallace isn’t running.

I am gutted about this tbh, with the situation in Ukraine too being very close to my familes heart.

He was the only decent individual in the field, who also had a good chance. The rest are either chancers like Javid, useless like Shapps and Hunt or just greasy 2 faced snakes like Sunak.

Wallace is a straight talking man of integrity imho, he was by far the best of a rotten bunch. His departure from the race guarantees another shit PM for next 2 years.

Im sure autocue Kier will be delighted....... if his script writer allows him to be!

 

[vegster]

Shame. He's one of the better ones.

Right move for Wallace though. Someone else will have to try to sort the shitstorm of the last few years out and try to put on a bold front for the very difficult next election....I'm sure he will be far more ready to step up in 2-3 years time.

 

[studio150]

She may have some rather distasteful beliefs, but she's not thick.

Although she doesn't have the legal knowledge required for her position.

 

[TomandJerry]

The minister who was seen shouting and sticking her middle finger up to crowds outside Downing Street earlier this week has said she was “standing up for herself” after receiving death threats.

Footage of Andrea Jenkyns showed her sticking her middle finger up to protesters as she entered Downing Street, and then shouting at them as she left after watching Boris Johnson’s resignation speech on Thursday.

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[Bry Nylon]

The minister who was seen shouting and sticking her middle finger up to crowds outside Downing Street earlier this week has said she was “standing up for herself” after receiving death threats.

Death threats?! I doubt it. Heckled, jeered? Undoubtedly, but that has always been part of politics. And if your leader is Boris Johnson then I’m afraid you reap what you sow.

But credible death threats? Don’t think so. What disrespect to Jo Cox and David Amos to try and weasel out of this by saying she was receiving death threats. Just more lies to try to excuse bad behaviour. It’s such entrenched and engrained behaviour they just can’t help themselves now, can they? Just lie upon lie upon lie.

 

[Mackenzie]

We need a latter day Guy Fawkes.

Total ****ing wankers the whole lot of them.

 

[crookie]

Right move for Wallace though. Someone else will have to try to sort the shitstorm of the last few years out and try to put on a bold front for the very difficult next election....I'm sure he will be far more ready to step up in 2-3 years time.

Yeah good point, I was hoping he'd get the gig, but on reflection it's going to be a hard grind for the next few years whoevers in charge. He's one of the very few who has enhanced his reputation as a serving member of this Govt.

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[clapham_gull]

Loving the in-fighting now. Quite how this cobbled together mess will function whilst briefing against each other is anyone's guess.

The wilderness beckons.