[Politics] Tory meltdown finally arrived [was: incoming]...

[abc]

As if a political party virtually guaranteed to be elected into government in around 6 months time wouldn't have a plan?

Cons only going after the idiot vote

They are indeed (almost) guaranteed to win but there is no sign of a plan. Looking at the 10 policies posted earlier, they are all good sound bites but supported with few numbers or crucially the policies that will produce the funding required. If this was the Tory top 10 policies, they would rightly get ripped to shreds on here.
Not being the Tories will win them the election and that’s a very good thing, but given the likelihood of a large majority they have the opportunity to offer up a coordinated plan that goes into areas that are necessary for the long term good of the country but will be short term unpopular with many. Instead, they are largely offering more of the same but (hopefully) without the corruption or lies.
I’m not angry, just very disappointed.

 

[Chicken Run]

That’s what I find so depressing. This new breed of Conservative delights in misinformation and outright taking the voters for mugs.

I might not always have agreed with the Conservatives of the past, but you felt their views were sincerely held, even if you felt they pointed in the wrong direction or failed to take account of reality.

The current crop will say anything, happily lying through their teeth as long as they think it will score a point with their ever shrinking far right voter base.

I’m not always a fan of Rory Stewart and Alistair Campbell on The Rest Is Politics, but Rory in one of the episodes pointed out that it was a wasted effort in the Conservatives lurching even further right, as parties such as Reform/Britain First can always move further right than them, and they lose vote share in the (more numerous) centre ground by doing so.

This Conservative Party are owned by a highly unpleasant cabal of far-right grifters pushing Braverman, Truss et al into our public life against a mostly resistant British public. Oh for a Kenneth Clarke or a Michael Heseltine, even a Theresa May looks appealing against the current crop.

I fear that like Trump and his backers have irreversibly contaminated the Republican Party, this current bunch of donors and grifters have potentially destroyed one of our two main political parties.

The same was said about Momentum destroying the Labour Party after the 2019 GE, a few years later and we are on the verge of a Labour Government with a huge majority, 24 hours is a long time in Politics…..

 

[Gabbiano]

The other benefit of a Tory wipeout is that many of the current cabal of far righters will lose their seats. Particularly this is true as these are in many cases the same people who were parachuted in to win the red wall seats in 2019.

The longer serving, more stable Tories in the safest seats of all will remain, and will be the ones to drive their direction after the next election.

I hope they can see that moving further to far right vitriol is what lost them the most support.

 

[chickens]

The same was said about Momentum destroying the Labour Party after the 2019 GE, a few years later and we are on the verge of a Labour Government with a huge majority, 24 hours is a long time in Politics…..

You are, of course, absolutely right. It feels like a long way back from here though, especially with Braverman et al still pushing the party to tack further right.

 

[nwgull]

They are indeed (almost) guaranteed to win but there is no sign of a plan. Looking at the 10 policies posted earlier, they are all good sound bites but supported with few numbers or crucially the policies that will produce the funding required. If this was the Tory top 10 policies, they would rightly get ripped to shreds on here.
Not being the Tories will win them the election and that’s a very good thing, but given the likelihood of a large majority they have the opportunity to offer up a coordinated plan that goes into areas that are necessary for the long term good of the country but will be short term unpopular with many. Instead, they are largely offering more of the same but (hopefully) without the corruption or lies.
I’m not angry, just very disappointed.

They’ll almost certainly have a plan, but the strategy is to keep their powder dry until an election is actually called.

 

[Hugo Rune]

The other benefit of a Tory wipeout is that many of the current cabal of far righters will lose their seats. Particularly this is true as these are in many cases the same people who were parachuted in to win the red wall seats in 2019.

The longer serving, more stable Tories in the safest seats of all will remain, and will be the ones to drive their direction after the next election.

I hope they can see that moving further to far right vitriol is what lost them the most support.

I wish Labour and Lib Dems could create an Alliance for the next election to achieve one goal. For the Lib Dems to become the official opposition.

There are many seats that if Labour or the Lib Dems stood aside, a Tory may fall. Like this one:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fareham_(UK_Parliament_constituency).

Labour need to be challenged on things like the Environment and closer ties with the EU. The Lib Dems are best placed to do this.

Let the Tories continue on their path to the hard right and become the 3rd or 4th largest party.

 

[Bob!]

I wish Labour and Lib Dems could create an Alliance for the next election to achieve one goal. For the Lib Dems to become the official opposition.

There are many seats that if Labour or the Lib Dems stood aside, a Tory may fall. Like this one:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fareham_(UK_Parliament_constituency).

Labour need to be challenged on things like the Environment and closer ties with the EU. The Lib Dems are best placed to do this.

Let the Tories continue on their path to the hard right and become the 3rd or 4th largest party.

And they can get proper PR in and keep the Tories out forever

 

[Chicken Run]

You are, of course, absolutely right. It feels like a long way back from here though, especially with Braverman et al still pushing the party to tack further right.

Difference being that the Momentum autopsy was after the GE not before.

 

[Hugo Rune]

And they can get proper PR in and keep the Tories out forever

A good deal for the Lib Dems. The compromise would be a version of STV perhaps rather than PR.

 

[Randy McNob]

The same was said about Momentum destroying the Labour Party after the 2019 GE, a few years later and we are on the verge of a Labour Government with a huge majority, 24 hours is a long time in Politics…..

i'm not sure that's a like for like comparison. I think it's simple case the Tories lurched right and allowed Labour to take the centre ground which is where most of the electorate are, although let's be clear, this is a right of centre Labour party, a neccesary evil to get elected. Hopefully Starmer will slowly pull them back to the left when in office

 

[BrianB]

They’ll almost certainly have a plan, but the strategy is to keep their powder dry until an election is actually called.

The reason the tories want Labour too declare their plans is so they can either steal or wreck them - National Insurance being a current target .

 

[chickens]

Difference being that the Momentum autopsy was after the GE not before.

True, but the Conservative Party autopsy seems to be coming to the conclusion that they haven’t moved right enough, which leaves those who prefer a sane centre right party with the Liberal Democrats as their only option.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

The first deportee to Rwanda, has disappeared from the Hope Hostel (that we're paying for) already.

 

[The Clamp]

They are indeed (almost) guaranteed to win but there is no sign of a plan. Looking at the 10 policies posted earlier, they are all good sound bites but supported with few numbers or crucially the policies that will produce the funding required. If this was the Tory top 10 policies, they would rightly get ripped to shreds on here.
Not being the Tories will win them the election and that’s a very good thing, but given the likelihood of a large majority they have the opportunity to offer up a coordinated plan that goes into areas that are necessary for the long term good of the country but will be short term unpopular with many. Instead, they are largely offering more of the same but (hopefully) without the corruption or lies.
I’m not angry, just very disappointed.

You are simply incorrect. There is a plan. There are solid policies . And there is a plan to fund and implement.


Stop being so deliberately lazy and do some research.

Here, I’ll spoon feed you one last time.

https://labour.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/Funding-Britains-Future.pdf

 

[Bob!]

You are simply incorrect. There is a plan. There are solid policies . And there is a plan to fund and implement.


Stop being so deliberately lazy and do some research.

Here, I’ll spoon feed you one last time.

https://labour.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/Funding-Britains-Future.pdf

Is that current?
It's a John McDonnell document

 

[jcdenton08]

You are simply incorrect. There is a plan. There are solid policies . And there is a plan to fund and implement.


Stop being so deliberately lazy and do some research.

Here, I’ll spoon feed you one last time.

https://labour.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/Funding-Britains-Future.pdf

I’m not disagreeing with your point per se, but the example you used was a document from almost seven years ago, which talks about numerous points which have been either walked-back or outright scrapped.

I’ll be voting Labour (short of an absolutely insane manifesto, which won’t happen) but they’re playing cards close to chest on lots of issues to be fair. And I don’t blame them. Keep quiet, win comfortably, THEN make policy.

 

[The Clamp]

I’m not disagreeing with your point per se, but the example you used was a document from almost seven years ago, which talks about numerous points which have been either walked-back or outright scrapped.

I’ll be voting Labour (short of an absolutely insane manifesto, which won’t happen) but they’re playing cards close to chest on lots of issues to be fair. And I don’t blame them. Keep quiet, win comfortably, THEN make policy.

Ah. Apologies. My mistake. Should be more observant.

 

[The Clamp]

One thing they have stated, which I believe is already quite widely known is their aim to close tax avoidance loopholes to raise money.

How Will Labour Fund their 2024 Pledges: Tax Avoidance Clampdowns - ChamberUK

How has Labour proposed they will fund their pledges?

chamberuk.com

We shall see.

 

[Randy McNob]

I’m not disagreeing with your point per se, but the example you used was a document from almost seven years ago, which talks about numerous points which have been either walked-back or outright scrapped.

I’ll be voting Labour (short of an absolutely insane manifesto, which won’t happen) but they’re playing cards close to chest on lots of issues to be fair. And I don’t blame them. Keep quiet, win comfortably, THEN make policy.

It seems you are giving credence to the idea that a major political party, virtually given a free pass to form the next government have not even thought about what policies they would introduce once the inevitable transfer of power happens? That Kier Starmer would take the podium after his glorious victory and announce "sorry we didn't have a plan, we will go away and think about what to do now, sorry"

Really?

 

[jcdenton08]

It seems you are giving credence to the idea that a major political party, virtually given a free pass to form the next government have not even thought about what policies they would introduce once the inevitable transfer of power happens? That Kier Starmer would take the podium after his glorious victory and announce "sorry we didn't have a plan, we will go away and think about what to do now, sorry"

Really?

Oh, you again expecting rdodge and the other one to be along shortly

Where did I say any of that? Oh, and it’s Keir Starmer who will be the next PM - not Kier.

Re-read my post big boy!