[Politics] They say that everyone has their price

[maltaseagull]

It's easier to con people, than it is to convince people they have been conned.

The great lie of sovereignty - just 11% of our laws came from the EU, and were transposed into British law anyway, and 89% of our laws are British made. Parliament in Westminster is sovereign and always has been.

Very profound!

 

[Swansman]

His true colours (Alt Right) were revealed when he meddled in US politics, on the side of the racist. What was all that about?

I've a (Remainer!) colleague who always disagrees with me about Farage, with: "He's alright, he just a typical guy you'll find in the golf clubhouse" I'm told.

Which I quietly reinterprete as the opinionated/obnoxious clubhouse bore, who people would love to deck .

One of many reasons I dont play golf.

 

[A1X]

His true colours (Alt Right) were revealed when he meddled in US politics, on the side of the racist. What was all that about?

I've a (Remainer!) colleague who always disagrees with me about Farage, with: "He's alright, he just a typical guy you'll find in the golf clubhouse" I'm told.

Which I quietly reinterprete as the opinionated/obnoxious clubhouse bore, who people would love to deck .

I hope you don't work for some sort of Golf PR company with recommendations like that!

 

[Peteinblack]

His true colours (Alt Right) were revealed when he meddled in US politics, on the side of the racist. What was all that about?

I've a (Remainer!) colleague who always disagrees with me about Farage, with: "He's alright, he just a typical guy you'll find in the golf clubhouse" I'm told.

Which I quietly reinterprete as the opinionated/obnoxious clubhouse bore, who people would love to deck .

Sadly, I think he really is worshipped by many Brexiters as some kind of patriotic hero expressing the xenophobic views they feel they cannot say because of 'political correctness'. These people also still love racist 'comedians' like Jim Davidson and Bernard Manning, judging by their social media posts.

I've encountered 100s of them on Facebook over the last 5 years - the 'school of hard knocks, university of life, wear your-poppy-with-pride' brigade who all look like Phil Mitchell (Eastenders), with their permanently angry gnarled faces and snarling mouths telling 'Remoaners' to "F***-off and live in Brussels, so we can have our country back.'

I've seen a fair few of these people starting/signing petitions demanding that Farage is given a knighthood

 

[shingle]

Just to throw a spanner in the works. About 5.27 in

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1uOwz_UrQ0

 

[Eric the meek]

It's amazing how so many people in this country became seemingly in thrall to such a low quality individual.

Agreed. Unfortunately, it is a reflection of the audience as well as the rhetoric and soundbites of the speaker.

I do find it disturbing that this could happen in modern day, educated, first world Britain. In one of the vids, he is now peddling financial advice.

 

[Stat Brother]

Not that surprising.
He’s got an instinct for opportunity and is a highly skilled communicator.
Bit like Hitler!

There is an alternate universe where farage would be revered.

Privately educated banker - ran as the 'everyman'.
Never held office in the UK.
Fell out with the Tories - became more Tory.
Never held office in the UK.
Only able to find a platform, wage and pension in the EU.
Never held office in the UK.
Fought against the EU.
Never held office in the UK.
Changed Tory/UK policy in the hope of 'keeping him quiet'.
Never held office in the UK.
Got the national result he wanted.
Never held office in the UK.
Backed away from the result the very next morning.
Never held office in the UK.
Frequent contributor on highbrow political talk shows.
Never held office in the UK.
Often found without the courage of his convictions.
Never held office in the UK.

Yet has completely shaped the best part of 50 years of an entire country.


An arse-biscuit of the highest order, but for someone with no platform he's done remarkably well.

 

[Weststander]

Sadly, I think he really is worshipped by many Brexiters as some kind of patriotic hero expressing the xenophobic views they feel they cannot say because of 'political correctness'. These people also still love racist 'comedians' like Jim Davidson and Bernard Manning, judging by their social media posts.

I've encountered 100s of them on Facebook over the last 5 years - the 'school of hard knocks, university of life, wear your-poppy-with-pride' brigade who all look like Phil Mitchell (Eastenders), with their permanently angry gnarled faces and snarling mouths telling 'Remoaners' to "F***-off and live in Brussels, so we can have our country back.'

I've seen a fair few of these people starting/signing petitions demanding that Farage is given a knighthood

It's astonishing how many million thick Brits exist. [I'm not labelling Brexiteer voters as anything bad, there would be gobby antisemites lacking in the brain cells department on the left too].

A sizeable rump of idiots, quite frightening how they swerved an education and common sense. It's getting out of control.

A brilliant show from James O'Brien on Wednesday, unusually he largely ditched party politics and dealt in detail with these people.
https://www.globalplayer.com/catchup/lbc/london/episodes/2zGudhCUh7HmXy1HsbyTqPJSWt/

Farage has hoovered up the right wing millions within this class.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Very profound!

I wish I'd thought of it. It's attributed to Mark Twain with 'fool' instead of 'con', although no absolute proof that MT did actually write it.

 

[Eric the meek]

Very profound!

That might be because the original may have come from Mark Twain:

'It's easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled.'

A powerful quote that gets you thinking.

Edit: I see the quote has already been attributed to Mark Twain, if indeed it was him what wrote it.

 

[Baldseagull]

They say that everyone has their price and it seems that Nigel Farage's price is £87

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khv9MipUhg4

I am sure if the EU had invaded Ireland and was imposing all law and taxes, killing dissidents, giving fiefdoms to Scottish settlers, causing famines etc. they would have fought for independence from them too, Nigel.
Equating British rule in Ireland, with membership of the EU, in any way, is quite disgusting.

 

[Baldseagull]

There is a new situation in the EU now which is causing conflict in Poland . The EU have announced that if there is conflict between EU law and a national law of a member country then EU law is the one that must be followed. I can see some countries challenging this when certain cases arise.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primacy_of_European_Union_law

It isn't a problem for any country other than Poland, or more accurately, the current Government of Poland.
Membership explicitly gives this to the EU in specific areas. The Polish Government threw out a load of judges, and appointed new ones that they liked better, then they asked the judges that they appointed to come to a decision on whether the Polish Constitution was compatible with EU law, and the mates, I mean judges, decided that that it wasn't.

Essentially, the current Government is trying to stoke up a Polish exit from the EU, which is economically even more stupid than the UK leaving, but you know, gay rights, muslims, sovrintee n all that.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

It isn't a problem for any country other than Poland, or more accurately, the current Government of Poland.
Membership explicitly gives this to the EU in specific areas. The Polish Government threw out a load of judges, and appointed new ones that they liked better, then they asked the judges that they appointed to come to a decision on whether the Polish Constitution was compatible with EU law, and the mates, I mean judges, decided that that it wasn't.

Essentially, the current Government is trying to stoke up a Polish exit from the EU, which is economically even more stupid than the UK leaving, but you know, gay rights, muslims, sovrintee n all that.

Not true, the German constitutional court had a problem with European law overreach and amusingly the darling of the hardcore remainer set, Michel Barnier, is running his presidential campaign on a ticket of regaining legal sovereignty from the EU.

 

[stewart12]

the bloke is an absolute charlatan

 

[Stat Brother]

Not true, the German constitutional court had a problem with European law overreach and amusingly the darling of the hardcore remainer set, Michel Barnier, is running his presidential campaign on a ticket of regaining legal sovereignty from the EU.

Like what we had?

 

[Baldseagull]

Not true, the German constitutional court had a problem with European law overreach and amusingly the darling of the hardcore remainer set, Michel Barnier, is running his presidential campaign on a ticket of regaining legal sovereignty from the EU.

The German Court had a disagreement over whether the ruling of the ECJ in favour of the ECB was in the area of EU primacy, and as far as I am aware the matter was left there and the ECJ did not push it further. Barnier is also well aware that the EU has primacy in certain areas, wanting a negotiation on where that primacy begins and ends is quite different.

What the Poles are saying is that Articles 1, 2, 4.3 and 19 are incompatible with the Polish constitution, the only resolution to that would be for Poland to leave, or change their constitution to suit, or for there to be a change in the decision of the court, which I am sure the current Government can arrange if they just sack a load of judges and put some different ones in again.
It isn't news that the EU has primacy in it's areas of competence.

Edit: Article 2 of the Treaty reads "The Union is founded on the values of respect for human dignity, freedom, democracy, equality, the rule of law and respect for human rights, including the rights of persons belonging to minorities. These values are common to the Member States in a society in which pluralism, non-discrimination, tolerance, justice, solidarity and equality between women and men prevail."

If that is incompatible with the Polish Constitution, I think it is the Polish Constitution that needs updating.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Like what we had?

European law is superior to the national laws of Member States, as we are no longer a member this is less of a problem. Saying that, may I commend you for being the only person on this thread pointing out that despite his obvious limitations Mr Farage is probably the most influential (apart from Mrs T) UK politician in our lifetimes.

 

[Stat Brother]

European law is superior to the national laws of Member States, as we are no longer a member this is less of a problem. Saying that, may I commend you for being the only person on this thread pointing out that despite his obvious limitations Mr Farage is probably the most influential (apart from Mrs T) UK politician in our lifetimes.

Yeah it's a real shame isn't it?


In generations to come, when looking back to now-ish, for so many reasons history won't be called 'history' it'll be:-

'Come on children, sit down and open your textbooks at 'what were they thinking?' '.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

The German Court had a disagreement over whether the ruling of the ECJ in favour of the ECB was in the area of EU primacy, and as far as I am aware the matter was left there and the ECJ did not push it further. Barnier is also well aware that the EU has primacy in certain areas, wanting a negotiation on where that primacy begins and ends is quite different.

What the Poles are saying is that Articles 1, 2, 4.3 and 19 are incompatible with the Polish constitution, the only resolution to that would be for Poland to leave, or change their constitution to suit, or for there to be a change in the decision of the court, which I am sure the current Government can arrange if they just sack a load of judges and put some different ones in again.
It isn't news that the EU has primacy in it's areas of competence.

Thanks for confirming other countries have a problem with ECJ overreach re national law despite you claiming the opposite.

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

It's easier to con people, than it is to convince people they have been conned.

The great lie of sovereignty - just 11% of our laws came from the EU, and were transposed into British law anyway, and 89% of our laws are British made. Parliament in Westminster is sovereign and always has been.

I’ll never forget, going back nearly 20 years ago in the run up to an election Farage was on Question Time, which I was watching with my daughter who was at home on study leave from Cardiff University, revising for her finals in European Studies, which included - obviously - how the European institutions worked.

Just about everything he said, Ellie said: “no it isn’t”, “that’s not true”, “where did he get that from” or something similar. It just became totally clear that he knew nothing about how Europe worked at all.