The ultimate REFERENDUM thread

[Soulman]

Birmingham has 30,000 local people already registered on their books for social housing in the area. The waiting lists include approximately 500 homeless families.

Birmingham city councillors have come together to pledge to re home 500 Syrians within the city over the next five years. To confirm the Council’s intentions on the matter, councillors from the Conservative and Labour parties came together in Birmingham earlier this week to assure more than 400 people gathered at a local church that they would indeed seek to house 500 Syrians under the government’s resettlement scheme.

Addressing the group, Cllr Clancy said: “The answer is yes. This city will put its arms out to welcome refugees from those UN camps, 500 of them over this next few years. We will welcome them, it’s a sign of strength as a city that we can do that.”

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

We will negotiate to what we want and we will negotiate much further afield in larger quantities without the red tape restrictions of the EU.

How about you show a bit more passion and be proud of Great Britain in going forward in the way we want to instead of being brittle and scared like many.
This is our country and we will succeed and flourish and dictate what we want instead of being dictated by Germany and France and the fools in Brussels.

Time for us to do it our way again just like we did for hundreds of years

yep, that common market agricultural policy we were hoodwinked into joining just got a lot bigger over the years
regards
DR

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

noticed the crusty's of Lewes were out on the Cliffe high st voicing their remain in the EU propaganda, one of them told me it was a very important vote i said yes very important that we leave and regain our identity as a country, he looked bemused
regards
DR

 

[drew]

Back at yer !!!

At least be honest ... you are voting in come what may. That may being ...Ongoing mass immigration - no problem, Ever Closer Union - no problem, Ongoing Eurozone crisis - no problem, Migrant Crisis + Schengen - no problem, Numerous new treaties that drain more sovereignty and power to the EU - no problem, Rising societal tensions feeding extremist parties across Europe - no problem, Terrorists exploiting a porous EU external border - no problem, inability to strike new trade deals with growing markets - no problem, expansion of the EU to include many more poorer nations including Turkey - no problem. All of this is happening now or will happen but still the fear mongering speculation of our GDP possibly growing at a slower rate is enough to see people running for cover and refusing to acknowledge most nations in the world don't need to be tied to a political Union to prosper.

Talk about scaremongering!!!

I am in the stay camp but not entrenched. Your rant doesn't really help. Just to remind you, we aren't in the Eurozone, the last major terrorist act here was by home grown terrorist.

Emerging nations forming trading blocs ! http://www.wsj.com/articles/southeast-asia-launches-huge-trade-bloc-1451419463 Not a political union I agree but who knows what follows?

Something from the CBI on trade deals: http://news.cbi.org.uk/business-iss...ness-facts/10-facts-about-eu-trade-deals-pdf/

As part of the EU, which emerging markets do we not have deals with?

We're not in the Schengen arrangements.

We didn't take a quota from the EU over immigrants, CDM elected to make a gesture. That would probably have happened whether we were in the EU or not.

 

[The Rivet]

Newsnight, BBC again. Really f**ked off with presenter 'Gollum' and his prep script and stance!
Again the panel voting because of their pocket money, Shallow, banal, biased and simplistic.
BBC-= British Bullshit Corps in the main.

 

[5ways]

Especially Euro Trolls!

I think there is only one and he is getting a lot of bites

 

[The Rivet]

Yes, feed the trolls, inners that is. With Cyanide!..

 

[beorhthelm]

Newsnight, BBC again.

i thought the graphics showd some interesting points on the economics. one point thats previously past me by was how small the export trade with EU as proportion of GDP - 12% i think they said. looking it up, its that sort of number. other point very well made is that you dont need *any* trade deal to trade with other countries. people seem to work on an assumption that no trade deal means closed to business, when all it means is some tariffs and barriers to trade, not wholesale block. so all the comparisons to Norway/Switzerland/Canada are irrelevant, you start from a basis of no trade deal and work towards an improved deal, while trading. we trade with the 100+ non-eu countries depsite there often being no EU deal in place, we can carry on doing that and trading with EU nations with out a trade deal, and once things settle down the grown ups in EU will be happy to sell us things we want and buy things they want without tariffs and trade barriers.

 

[dsr-burnley]

As it stands, we export about £30bn a year to Germany and import about £75bn from Germany. As George Osborne points out, if Germany refuses to continue this trade, we lose exports. As he doesn't point out, we do have a powerful weapon in persuading them to let the trade continue.

Or maybe Osborne doesn't think Germany has much influence in the EU economy?

 

[Deleted member 22389]

Birmingham has 30,000 local people already registered on their books for social housing in the area. The waiting lists include approximately 500 homeless families.

Birmingham city councillors have come together to pledge to re home 500 Syrians within the city over the next five years. To confirm the Council’s intentions on the matter, councillors from the Conservative and Labour parties came together in Birmingham earlier this week to assure more than 400 people gathered at a local church that they would indeed seek to house 500 Syrians under the government’s resettlement scheme.

Addressing the group, Cllr Clancy said: “The answer is yes. This city will put its arms out to welcome refugees from those UN camps, 500 of them over this next few years. We will welcome them, it’s a sign of strength as a city that we can do that.”

Still waiting for politicians and celebs to do their bit. The issue is where they go from here because this charity wont last long.

 

[pastafarian]

i thought the graphics showd some interesting points on the economics. one point thats previously past me by was how small the export trade with EU as proportion of GDP - 12% i think they said. looking it up, its that sort of number. other point very well made is that you dont need *any* trade deal to trade with other countries. people seem to work on an assumption that no trade deal means closed to business, when all it means is some tariffs and barriers to trade, not wholesale block. so all the comparisons to Norway/Switzerland/Canada are irrelevant, you start from a basis of no trade deal and work towards an improved deal, while trading. we trade with the 100+ non-eu countries depsite there often being no EU deal in place, we can carry on doing that and trading with EU nations with out a trade deal, and once things settle down the grown ups in EU will be happy to sell us things we want and buy things they want without tariffs and trade barriers.

this was an important point and timely reminded,it gets forgotten about far too quickly in the melee mainly as the remain camp seem desperate to pin a norway/swiss/canada deal into the agenda.

 

[heathgate]

Nice side step.

It's actually a concise list of his wants and fears..... now let's see you do the same in support of the EU status quo you hold so dear.

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[Hamilton]

i thought the graphics showd some interesting points on the economics. one point thats previously past me by was how small the export trade with EU as proportion of GDP - 12% i think they said. looking it up, its that sort of number. other point very well made is that you dont need *any* trade deal to trade with other countries. people seem to work on an assumption that no trade deal means closed to business, when all it means is some tariffs and barriers to trade, not wholesale block. so all the comparisons to Norway/Switzerland/Canada are irrelevant, you start from a basis of no trade deal and work towards an improved deal, while trading. we trade with the 100+ non-eu countries depsite there often being no EU deal in place, we can carry on doing that and trading with EU nations with out a trade deal, and once things settle down the grown ups in EU will be happy to sell us things we want and buy things they want without tariffs and trade barriers.

It's a death of a thousand cuts though. It's only a few percentage points of the GDP; it's only a few percent of our growth there; it's only a few extra tariffs here and there. Gradually it all mounts up. And at the end of it all, we still have open borders; we're still trading with the EU (importing and exporting), but on slightly worse off terms. And we take the hit. We export to Germany and take their tariffs or they just go elsewhere. We import from Germany, put in place our own tariffs, and prices at the tills go up on all sides as the removal of free trade brings in further costs. All sounds rather divisive and pants to me.


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[JC Footy Genius]

Talk about scaremongering!!!

I am in the stay camp but not entrenched. Your rant doesn't really help. Just to remind you, we aren't in the Eurozone, the last major terrorist act here was by home grown terrorist.

Emerging nations forming trading blocs ! http://www.wsj.com/articles/southeast-asia-launches-huge-trade-bloc-1451419463 Not a political union I agree but who knows what follows?

Something from the CBI on trade deals: http://news.cbi.org.uk/business-iss...ness-facts/10-facts-about-eu-trade-deals-pdf/

As part of the EU, which emerging markets do we not have deals with?

We're not in the Schengen arrangements.

We didn't take a quota from the EU over immigrants, CDM elected to make a gesture. That would probably have happened whether we were in the EU or not.

Hardly scaremongering when much of what I described has been and is happening today. As for the future predictions, I simply looked at the EU's track record and their stated goals so a gazillion times more accurate than any Brexit economic predictions (give or take 6 zillion obviously).

I wasn't trying to persuade (perish the thought) just getting you to acknowledge your partisan position and all the issues you need to ignore when deciding staying in is a less risky option. Not entrenched yet spend considerable time only arguing against Brexit. Well dug in?

Just to remind you not being in the Eurozone doesn't insulate us from the ongoing fallout and being locked into a second tier EU while the Eurozone first tier has different priorities/problems and a majority of votes doesn't bode well for us. Brexit will of course not fully protect us either but at least it gives us the chance to diversify the risk by being more global in our trading outlook instead of Eurocentric.

At least one of the terrorists involved in the recent attacks in Brussels travelled to the UK which they are entitled to do as they were EU citizens, see recent arrests in Birmingham for the ongoing fallout/potential risk.

If the EU was just a trading block there would be no problem but it isn't.

The CBI a source that supported us joining the Euro. Some rapidly growing markets include Brazil,India,China .. 3 of the biggest economies in the world.

Once again not being in Schengen (or part of Quotas )doesn't insulate us from its effects/fallout. See Calais, see numbers of illegal immigrants trying to get here every day, see ease of movement of extremists/terrorists and weapons across Europe, see rising societal/political tensions between member states, see one members stupidity of welcoming everyone costing us £500 million and counting to try (epic fail) and help rectify the problem.

 

[beorhthelm]

It's a death of a thousand cuts though. It's only a few percentage points of the GDP; it's only a few percent of our growth there; it's only a few extra directives, regulations and rules here and there. Gradually it all mounts up.

do you see? the cost analysis utterly fails to account for the reduction in regulation and bureaucracy and the future increase in bureaucracy. we already take the hit, we impose costly regulations (some estimate 30bn a year, though probably over egged) most of which is on businesses that have no direct economic activity with the EU. we cede powers, self determination and authority of our courts for the sake of 12% of the economy.

 

[Maldini]

As much as we criticise countries with dictators such as North Korea I ask myself are we any different.Our goverment is churning out project fear and telling us all kinds of nonsense to get us to believe what they want us to believe. Isn't that what dictatorships do. Osborne now plucking the figure of £4300 out of thin air.

Can the goverment really not just give us facts instead of theories. Can they not produce technical data, figures,graphs,or any other kind of factual proof whether it's in their favour or not.Should they even be taking sides.Shouldn't they just tell us the good and the bad.

What this has shown me very clearly is that you cannot trust anyone.Not even your own goverment. This is democracy. Sad.

 

[Maldini]

Once again not being in Schengen (or part of Quotas )doesn't insulate us from its effects/fallout. See Calais, see numbers of illegal immigrants trying to get here every day,

When you look at Italy,Greece and Turkey I think we can count ourselves lucky not only that we are an island but that we are not in the south of Europe.
We moan about migrants but compared to these countries we have it easy.
We are also lucky that we don't have a leader like Merkel who's opened the doors to a country she believes she owns.

 

[sten_super]

do you see? the cost analysis utterly fails to account for the reduction in regulation and bureaucracy and the future increase in bureaucracy. we already take the hit, we impose costly regulations (some estimate 30bn a year, though probably over egged) most of which is on businesses that have no direct economic activity with the EU. we cede powers, self determination and authority of our courts for the sake of 12% of the economy.

It was Open Europe that carried out the analysis and came up with £27bn costs (link). They also admit that the same method gives a benefit to these regulations of £57.1bn (although they question whether that's an accurate figure).

 

[JC Footy Genius]

I think there is only one and he is getting a lot of bites

He may well be a double agent .. his contributions are certainly a big plus for the Brexit cause

 

[gregbrighton]

When you look at Italy,Greece and Turkey I think we can count ourselves lucky not only that we are an island but that we are not in the south of Europe.
We moan about migrants but compared to these countries we have it easy.
We are also lucky that we don't have a leader like Merkel who's opened the doors to a country she believes she owns.

If we Brexit, will that mean all the pensioners will be thrown out of Spain. I hope not. We don't need these people filling up all the NHS beds. There are not enough to go round already...