The Palace Conspiracy

[amexee]

"overtime wages"

What planet are you on??!

My niece is a copper. Reckons that they all hike there overtime upto nearest half hour even if only 5 mins late out of the station, with the blessing of the bosses

Not ever skint!!

Police - honest- bollocks

 

[Lady Whistledown]

My niece is a copper. Reckons that they all hike there overtime upto nearest half hour even if only 5 mins late out of the station, with the blessing of the bosses

Not ever skint!!

Police - honest- bollocks

Blimey, can you tell me where she works please, I wouldn't mind some of that. Think I've managed to claim about four whole hours this year so far.

The Palace game, for your info, was known about sufficiently far in advance for the powers that be to simply cancel officers' rest days, therefore virtually none of them would have made a penny out of it beyond their normal daily pay. Clearly that doesn't work so well with the conspiracy theory, but take my word for it: I know plenty of people who were mightily pissed off at having to spend what should have been their day off standing around, listening to pissed football fans banging on at each other.

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

Those outside the Standard, QH and the Bell were not allowed to move, so people who wanted to avoid the disorder were not able to. Therefore if the Palace escort was taken around to Trafalger street the Albion risk could have been held where they were. Worst you would have got is hardcore trying to force their way out, who would be nicked on the spot. I'm sorry the entire affair could have been avoided so easily.

allegedly all the Palace main players were in
Polegate / Seaford then Lewes , not worth all this shit over a what was mainly a load of Palace Barmies,problem is there's probably a list of people who they would rather not have at the Stadium regardless of whether they hadn't committed an offence

 

[brakespear]

So let's be clear - mindless violence, wanton thuggery, a pre-planned return to the "heady" days of peoples' youth when assaulting someone was a prerequisite for supporting your football club - call it what you will......................it is all the fault of the police. The fact that people on websites such as this were promoting hatred well in advance of the game is also obviously the fault of the police. These people were clearly blameless and their behaviour should be excused while the attempts of the police to deal with it should be vilified. Given that the Palace (and Brighton) thugs had the whole city to choose from the police could never resources to deal with it. Maybe next time they should just play the match behind closed doors and then the "fault" could be apportioned where it rightly belongs.

Keyser Soze - a mindless and violent criminal in a fictional world......................... a name well chosen it seems

Naturally, but equally it's bloody difficult to get a group of 200 people (I'm going by the numbers quoted on here by the way, I have no idea whether they're accurate) from West Street to the station any other way. They won't want to herd them down the side roads because they're small, with lots of offshoots, and simply not practical in terms of traffic movements. They also do like, where possible, to treat people like adults and NOT surround them with officers as that can actually have the opposite effect of ramping things up further. How many times have we seen complaints on here that there have been too many OB around, that football supporters get treated like cattle?

If a bunch of people in a pub or on the street can't handle their rivals walking past without hurling bottles or excessive abuse then that's their problem. I notice the other 20,000 or so individuals inside the stadium broadly managed to cope that day without anything more than the usual banter going back and forth, so anyone who crosses that line, inside or outside the stadium has nobody to blame but themselves.

IMHO of course.

these.

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

Blimey, can you tell me where she works please, I wouldn't mind some of that. Think I've managed to claim about four whole hours this year so far.

The Palace game, for your info, was known about sufficiently far in advance for the powers that be to simply cancel officers' rest days, therefore virtually none of them would have made a penny out of it beyond their normal daily pay. Clearly that doesn't work so well with the conspiracy theory, but take my word for it: I know plenty of people who were mightily pissed off at having to spend what should have been their day off standing around, listening to pissed football fans banging on at each other.

my heart bleeds for you SOMETIMES YOU HAVE TO DO THINGS YOU DON'T WANT TO DO

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

I suspect you were very much in the minority then. All the " top boys " knew the rendezvous was Brighton station and thats why they were there.

clueless

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

Any person with a degree of sense or who knows anything about the Albion would know to avoid the station and the pubs nearby on such a fixture as Albion v Palace. I'm sure a tiny minority of people were caught up in this and that's unfortunate but the overwhelming vast majority of people involved were either well up for a ruck or claim not to be hooligans etc but are of the opinion that, "I'm no troublemaker but if those Palace arse'oles come on my manor and walk past giving it large and come near me then I'm getting involved to protect my mates and famileee" sorry fellas that makes you no different than the rest and as far as I'm concerned if you got a shove or baton from the OB then it wasn't nearly as big a shove or hit as you deserved so dry your eyes and stop bleating about the OB getting involved and doing their jobs. Its a waste of time trying to have a reasoned debate about it with some posters as they are so entrenched in their anti-police rhetoric nothing anyone says will change that.

pot kettle black eh ?

 

[Lady Whistledown]

my heart bleeds for you SOMETIMES YOU HAVE TO DO THINGS YOU DON'T WANT TO DO

Not complaining for a second old chap, as I booked the day off months in advance so I got to go to the game anyway. Looking back now, it might have been more enjoyable being at work...

The second point wasn't a whinge either, it was merely in response to the incorrect belief that the game was policed at massive public expense by officers on a huge overtime gravy train. It wasn't.

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

Not complaining for a second old chap, as I booked the day off months in advance so I got to go to the game anyway. Looking back now, it might have been more enjoyable being at work...

The second point wasn't a whinge either, it was merely in response to the incorrect belief that the game was policed at massive public expense by officers on a huge overtime gravy train. It wasn't.

maybe not huge but surely substantial ?, 12 hour SHIFT FOR MOST , I've heard they even get transport police in from ASHFORD to police Lewes train Station

 

[Lady Whistledown]

maybe not huge but surely substantial ?, 12 hour SHIFT FOR MOST , I've heard they even get transport police in from ASHFORD to police Lewes train Station

No idea which base they'd have got the BTP in from, but I would have thought even they would have factored this game in way in advance for cancelled rest days, as they would any high level game. Unless of course they have some kind of huge budget (unlikely, simply as no police force does at the moment). They always have to get them in from somewhere else anyway, as stations like Lewes and Falmer don't have a BTP presence, they just turn up when they're needed, like if someone jumps in front of a train. Having to police Falmer station will be a whole new experience for them this season.

I can only speak from a Sussex point of view, and they are, honestly, incredibly tight on overtime because the budget simply isn't there to pay for it. No police force has much cash to spare, hence they're all trying to get rid of staff left, right and centre. I can't see there would have been the need for many twelve hour shifts simply because of the timing of the game- even if they started at 2pm they'd have been more or less done by midnight at the worst. More likely they'd have had crossover of people starting at 2 or 4, doing the usual eight hour shifts. That's what I'm guessing anyway. Trust me, they will have worked it out to the nth degree to get away with paying as little in overtime as possible- the people who plan these things don't earn the overtime anyway so they have no incentive to pay the rest of the force extra money!

 

[Uncle Spielberg]

clueless

Fair point, I am not really up on where the organised fights and top boys reunions with sad fuckwits in the 40's and 50's meeting up to settle old scores are. That seems to be your field of expertise so I stand corrected. Your also right in that all the fans at the Station were there for a couple of civilised pints pre game. No intentions at all of lobbing glass pints across the road, that was all down to the Police. Sorry for my mistake.

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

No idea which base they'd have got the BTP in from, but I would have thought even they would have factored this game in way in advance for cancelled rest days, as they would any high level game. Unless of course they have some kind of huge budget (unlikely, simply as no police force does at the moment). They always have to get them in from somewhere else anyway, as stations like Lewes and Falmer don't have a BTP presence, they just turn up when they're needed, like if someone jumps in front of a train. Having to police Falmer station will be a whole new experience for them this season.

I can only speak from a Sussex point of view, and they are, honestly, incredibly tight on overtime because the budget simply isn't there to pay for it. No police force has much cash to spare, hence they're all trying to get rid of staff left, right and centre. I can't see there would have been the need for many twelve hour shifts simply because of the timing of the game- even if they started at 2pm they'd have been more or less done by midnight at the worst. More likely they'd have had crossover of people starting at 2 or 4, doing the usual eight hour shifts. That's what I'm guessing anyway. Trust me, they will have worked it out to the nth degree to get away with paying as little in overtime as possible- the people who plan these things don't earn the overtime anyway so they have no incentive to pay the rest of the force extra money!

your lot were around Brighon station area mid morning onwards, as you've said there may have been a cross over point , those mounted officers don't come cheap ,especially when you have to draft them in from another area ?

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

Fair point, I am not really up on where the organised fights and top boys reunions with sad fuckwits in the 40's and 50's meeting up to settle old scores are. That seems to be your field of expertise so I stand corrected. Your also right in that all the fans at the Station were there for a couple of civilised pints pre game. No intentions at all of lobbing glass pints across the road, that was all down to the Police. Sorry for my mistake.

i never said the US, i had i quiet pint and went on my way

 

[26-10-02]

A view from the other side.

I think a lot of the problems were down to the Sussex police not having had big game experience for a number of years.There were police at East Croydon from early morning onwards checking names ,match tickets and so on.Left there about 1.30 and our direct train had about 50 or so Palace on it in small groups.Amazingly at Brighton station me and my son were singled out to be stopped and questioned while the groups just walked on.Eventually after checking our tickets we were free to go and I asked where we could have a quiet drink,the copper didn't know as he was a Croydon cop so he asked a local one who told us to head for the wetherspoons as it was full of 'our lot'.(his words)Looked in there and it was like an idiots convention so passed it up and met some mates down the lanes.As said previously why did they walk them up west st. when a slight detour would have been so much less hassle?
All this could have been avoided if the police had said beforehand drink in Lewes or somewhere as the majority in there and elsewhere just wanted a drink with no trouble.We did this for you in 2002 when you had Thornton Heath.After the match another cock up when they held back half the away end outside while the other half just walked up some stairs and to the station where small outbreaks of trouble happened.Once again a special train leaving at 11.00 would ahve avoided this and we could have had a couple of after match drinks till the crowd went.The amount of police around with dogs,horses and the rest was more than adequate ,they were just incompetent.

 

[Napper]

Fair point, I am not really up on where the organised fights and top boys reunions with sad fuckwits in the 40's and 50's meeting up to settle old scores are. That seems to be your field of expertise so I stand corrected. Your also right in that all the fans at the Station were there for a couple of civilised pints pre game. No intentions at all of lobbing glass pints across the road, that was all down to the Police. Sorry for my mistake.

Again another idiotic comment. Your posts are like a 3 year old kid trying to get involved with a debate on fractions.

Utterly clueless and seemingly live in a bubble

 

[e77]

So in summary:

Could the Police have done things differently and will they learn from the experience? Quite possibly
Is it a major conspiracy to allow the Police to pay for their holidays and allow near martial law to be imposed next time Palace come to town in response to the requests from a scared population? Probably not

 

[WICKBHA]

I think a lot of the problems were down to the Sussex police not having had big game experience for a number of years.There were police at East Croydon from early morning onwards checking names ,match tickets and so on.Left there about 1.30 and our direct train had about 50 or so Palace on it in small groups.Amazingly at Brighton station me and my son were singled out to be stopped and questioned while the groups just walked on.Eventually after checking our tickets we were free to go and I asked where we could have a quiet drink,the copper didn't know as he was a Croydon cop so he asked a local one who told us to head for the wetherspoons as it was full of 'our lot'.(his words)Looked in there and it was like an idiots convention so passed it up and met some mates down the lanes.As said previously why did they walk them up west st. when a slight detour would have been so much less hassle?
All this could have been avoided if the police had said beforehand drink in Lewes or somewhere as the majority in there and elsewhere just wanted a drink with no trouble.We did this for you in 2002 when you had Thornton Heath.After the match another cock up when they held back half the away end outside while the other half just walked up some stairs and to the station where small outbreaks of trouble happened.Once again a special train leaving at 11.00 would ahve avoided this and we could have had a couple of after match drinks till the crowd went.The amount of police around with dogs,horses and the rest was more than adequate ,they were just incompetent.

That

 

[spoonie]

so how many been banned from the Amex so far then ??