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[Politics] The Labour Government



Right Brain Ronnie

Well-known member
Feb 20, 2023
632
North of North
I wouldn’t mind seeing at least 2 terms. Not for a party political point, but because long term planning is a good thing.

But with just 33.7% of the GE vote, let’s not get ahead of ourselves.
I agree with stability IE two terms, but our country will go from fractured to unrepairable after labour policies for 5 years let alone 10.
As you say they have a tiny percentage of the nation that put them there, they are on a cliffs edge with this start.
 






Thunder Bolt

Silly old bat
That old chestnut. These old right wingers whose deaths you cheerfully predict were brought up in the sixties. Flower people, drugs and free love, student riots, and so forth. They're conservative now, but they weren't then; it's a typical progression for people to move from left to right as they age; if only because taking wealth from the rich to give to the poor, is always more popular among the poor than it is among the rich.
Don't generalise. This old codger knows plenty of people in my demographic who don't like seeing profiteering by the rich. The top 1% grew their fortune by $42 trillion over the past decade according to Oxfam.
Most of it secreted away in tax havens.

Blame them, not poor people, or those who are trying to live their lives without starvation, bullets, bombs or being killed because of what they are.
 


Right Brain Ronnie

Well-known member
Feb 20, 2023
632
North of North
What precisely have they done wrong?
Heighten tension with Starmer trying to attach anyone that protest are far right, how do you think that works with those who are not?

Maybe it makes it a them and us situation maybe that causes more friction?

People have had enough and every time he barks far right, it shows he knows f*** all.

He is detached from those that are proud of their country.

He is fast becoming a dictator, a very dangerous man indeed.

The riots on the streets were predicted to come by many in touch with real life. The left were naive in not seeing this coming , the balance in Britain was on the edge and then labour got in to take it up a few notches.

Its been a tinderbox and still is, he needs to start dowsing and stop striking those matches for this to balance again.
 


Weststander

Well-known member
Aug 25, 2011
69,262
Withdean area
I agree with stability IE two terms, but our country will go from fractured to unrepairable after labour policies for 5 years let alone 10.
As you say they have a tiny percentage of the nation that put them there, they are on a cliffs edge with this start.

It's definitely a tough gig. Until now only the IFS have told the fiscal truth.

Let's see.

Barometers for me - mental health services, A&E's, decent affordable housing for the excluded millions.
 
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Bodian

Well-known member
May 3, 2012
14,245
Cumbria
Heighten tension with Starmer trying to attach anyone that protest are far right, how do you think that works with those who are not? But he wasn't/didn't actually do that did he.

Maybe it makes it a them and us situation maybe that causes more friction?

People have had enough and every time he barks far right, it shows he knows f*** all.

He is detached from those that are proud of their country.

He is fast becoming a dictator, a very dangerous man indeed. How is he becoming a 'dictator'? What has he done that is akin to a dictator?

The riots on the streets were predicted to come by many in touch with real life. The left were naive in not seeing this coming , the balance in Britain was on the edge and then labour got in to take it up a few notches. You mean people are protesting and being violent just because Labour got in?

Its been a tinderbox and still is, he needs to start dowsing and stop striking those matches for this to balance again.
Further questions in bold.
 


Mellor 3 Ward 4

Well-known member
Jul 27, 2004
10,233
saaf of the water
Wrong and short sighted.

Trust people to make good decisions and hold them accountable if they make bad decisions.

All this does is give people with zero knowledge the opportunity to make decisions whilst adding delay and risk.


Wrong (IMO)

(1) Any 'business' when money is tight, looks at what is being spent and on what - and buyers have to get approval from above.
(2) It's not their money - spending up to £2m without authorisation from the person who is ultimately accountable and responsible is IMO foolhardy.
(3) Civil Servants are (very rarely) held to account.
 


Zeberdi

“Vorsprung durch Technik”
NSC Patron
Oct 20, 2022
6,932
Heighten tension with Starmer trying to attach anyone that protest are far right, how do you think that works with those who are not?
I think he actually said it was the far right that incited the riots and deserve the full force of the law - he acknowledged that most engaged in the actual rioting were people causing criminal damage, thuggery and looting BUT were not themselves the far right, ‘just‘ racist or even just bored youth being thuggish.

Burning hotels with living people inside is not “protest”, they are lucky they didn’t get charged with attempted murder.

The conundrum for Starmer was he could not expand on the root causes of the riots in the media while they were happening or it could have been seen that he was justifying violence. However, it has been said by me and many others in recent days to you that Starmer’s Government has introduced legislation to tackle social deprivation, poverty, lack of housing, immigration etc

You really do need to give the government time for these policies to have an effect.

Assess where it is in 12-24 months time.
Maybe it makes it a them and us situation maybe that causes more friction?

People have had enough and every time he barks far right, it shows he knows f*** all.

He is detached from those that are proud of their country.

He is fast becoming a dictator, a very dangerous man indeed.
Well that is just bollix Ronnie - and you need to calm down your rhetoric - calling the head of a Labour Government for calling out far right ideologues as dictatorial, is frankly unhinged. Read back what you have written then ask yourself why moderate thinking NSC members have been mocking and trolling you.
The riots on the streets were predicted to come by many in touch with real life. The left were naive in not seeing this coming , the balance in Britain was on the edge and then labour got in to take it up a few notches.
Er, under 14 years of Tory Government.

Precisely how have the current Government taken it up a ‘few notches’?

Look at the Kings Speech again and the legislation they have introduced.
Its been a tinderbox and still is, he needs to start dowsing and stop striking those matches for this to balance again.
Again - what ‘matches has he been striking’? What exactly in your POV should he be doing?

Spell

It

Out

in

Policy suggestions



(Or ‘forever hold your peace’ 🙂)
 
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Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
56,097
Faversham
Wrong (IMO)

(1) Any 'business' when money is tight, looks at what is being spent and on what - and buyers have to get approval from above.
(2) It's not their money - spending up to £2m without authorisation from the person who is ultimately accountable and responsible is IMO foolhardy.
(3) Civil Servants are (very rarely) held to account.
Precisely.

The only way military hardware spending could be deemed inappropriate, if up to 2 million could be spent no questions asked on an item, is if we had a war and the kit failed.

And even then the person who singed off the purchase would just say 'how could we have possibly known?'.

The objection to the new regulations is objectionable.
 


Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
56,097
Faversham
I think he actually said it was the far right that incited the riots and deserve the full force of the law - he acknowledged that most engaged in the actual rioting were people causing criminal damage, thuggery and looting were not themselves the far right, just racist or even just bored youth being thuggish. Burning hotels living people inside is not “protest”, they are lucky they didn’t get charged with attempted murder.

The conundrum for Starmer was he could not expand on the root causes of the riots in the media while they were happening or it could have been seen that he was justifying violence. However, it has been said by me and many others in recent days to you that Starmer’s Government has introduced legislation to tackle social deprivation, poverty, lack of housing, immigration etc

You really do need to give the government time for these policies to have an effect.

Assess where it is in 12-24 months time.

Well that is just bollix Ronnie - and you need to calm down your rhetoric - calling the head of a Labour Government for calling out far right ideologues as dictatorial, is frankly unhinged. Read back what you have written then ask yourself why moderate thinking NSC members have been mocking and trolling you.

Er, under 14 years of Tory Government -

Precisely how have the Government taken it up a ‘few notches’

Look at the Kings Speech again and the legislation they have introduced.

Again - what ‘matches has he been striking’? What exactly in your POV should he be doing?

Spell

It

Out

or

(Or ‘forever hold your peace’ 🙂
Good luck with that.

It takes an honest person of good heart to face facts and accept mistakes.
I contend you are not dealing with an honest person.

As always, I salute your indefatigability.
 


CheeseRolls

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jan 27, 2009
6,230
Shoreham Beach
Wrong (IMO)

(1) Any 'business' when money is tight, looks at what is being spent and on what - and buyers have to get approval from above.
(2) It's not their money - spending up to £2m without authorisation from the person who is ultimately accountable and responsible is IMO foolhardy.
(3) Civil Servants are (very rarely) held to account.
WE may not be so far apart on this as you think.

1 The MOD agree a budget with the Treasury. I am arguing not for accountability, but that the accountability should be to the Ministry of Defence and NOT the Treasury. I think this is more about control than accountability and the further away you get from a decision, the lesser the understanding of the decision to be made and its ramifications.
2 See 1 above
3 True, but they should also not be put in this position. Unless they are dishonest, incompetent or maverick, ministerial approval should always be a given.
 




Boys 9d

Well-known member
Jan 3, 2012
1,854
Lancing
I wonder if the people who consider that the Labour Government have failed as things haven't improved in a few weeks are the same people who tell us to be patient as the benefits of Brexit will take decades to become apparent?
 


pocketseagull

Well-known member
Dec 29, 2014
1,360
£50,000.00 does seem like an arbitrary and very low figure. Ministerial approval for things like individual IT contract workers just seem like overkill. Would be interesting to know if there's actual fact based reasoning for the figures and not just trying to appease Rachel Reeves.
 


Right Brain Ronnie

Well-known member
Feb 20, 2023
632
North of North
It's definitely a tough gig. Until now only the IFS have told the fiscal truth.

Let's see.

Barometers for me - mental health services, A&E's, decent affordable housing for the excluded millions.
I definitely have some barometers setup, but the needle is currently are past stormy, you'd think the needle can only go one way, I would like to think it will start heading towards CHANGE by the end of the Year, it might hit fair for a spell midterm, but ultimately I predict it will be at stormy again by year 5 If they get that far, I think they may go early for the next election, because of that forthcoming shit storm.
 




Weststander

Well-known member
Aug 25, 2011
69,262
Withdean area
I definitely have some barometers setup, but the needle is currently are past stormy, you'd think the needle can only go one way, I would like to think it will start heading towards CHANGE by the end of the Year, it might hit fair for a spell midterm, but ultimately I predict it will be at stormy again by year 5 If they get that far, I think they may go early for the next election, because of that forthcoming shit storm.

November 2024 general election?
 


Right Brain Ronnie

Well-known member
Feb 20, 2023
632
North of North
Further questions in bold.
But he was using far right like he was a stuck on 33rpm . How many far right do you think are in the country?
I think he actually said it was the far right that incited the riots and deserve the full force of the law - he acknowledged that most engaged in the actual rioting were people causing criminal damage, thuggery and looting BUT were not themselves the far right, ‘just‘ racist or even just bored youth being thuggish.

Burning hotels with living people inside is not “protest”, they are lucky they didn’t get charged with attempted murder.

The conundrum for Starmer was he could not expand on the root causes of the riots in the media while they were happening or it could have been seen that he was justifying violence. However, it has been said by me and many others in recent days to you that Starmer’s Government has introduced legislation to tackle social deprivation, poverty, lack of housing, immigration etc

You really do need to give the government time for these policies to have an effect.

Assess where it is in 12-24 months time.

Well that is just bollix Ronnie - and you need to calm down your rhetoric - calling the head of a Labour Government for calling out far right ideologues as dictatorial, is frankly unhinged. Read back what you have written then ask yourself why moderate thinking NSC members have been mocking and trolling you.

Er, under 14 years of Tory Government.

Precisely how have the current Government taken it up a ‘few notches’?

Look at the Kings Speech again and the legislation they have introduced.

Again - what ‘matches has he been striking’? What exactly in your POV should he be doing?

Spell

It

Out

in

Policy suggestions



(Or ‘forever hold your peace’ 🙂)
: the art or skill of speaking or writing formally and effectively especially as a way to persuade or influence people.

Sorry but I don't see my rhetoric as any different to that of yours or others.

So far I have answered many questions and hardly had any of mine answered.
I get posters following me I am not chasing them down. It my view upset them, I apologise but their views upset me too.
There are two sides to a story, so forgive me if I have seen my last ban as just nonsense.

Meanwhile the time is ticking and the barometer stuck on stormy, of course I am reasonable but all the policy changes I have seen, are just Change for the sake of change, can't he leave anything alone?

How many far right do you think are in the country?


Thanks for your spacing but that might be a bit OTT.
 




Bodian

Well-known member
May 3, 2012
14,245
Cumbria




Zeberdi

“Vorsprung durch Technik”
NSC Patron
Oct 20, 2022
6,932
: the art or skill of speaking or writing formally and effectively especially as a way to persuade or influence people.

Sorry but I don't see my rhetoric as any different to that of yours or others.
Thanks, I know what it meant.

We all often use ‘rhetoric’ to argue our POV - you using ‘rhetoric’ is not the issue.

The POV is.

Ps. - Several people including myself and @Bodian above have asked you why you think Starmer is being dictatorial - I do think you could maybe just address that.
 


Right Brain Ronnie

Well-known member
Feb 20, 2023
632
North of North
You seem to have omitted explaining what it is that Starmer has done that is akin to being a Dictator.

I'd quite like to know.
He just acts like a dictator that is my opinion, but it is also the view of probably most of the left on here who read the Guardian.
Please watch to the end that little rascal really gets stuck in to lying Starmer,


Thanks, I know what it meant.

We all often use ‘rhetoric’ to argue our POV - you using ‘rhetoric’ is not the issue.

The POV is.

Ps. - Several people including myself and @Bodian above have asked you why you think Starmer is being dictatorial - I do think you could maybe just address that.
Can I now please have my questions answered?
 
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