The establishment and historic child sex abuse

[seagullsovergrimsby]

I recall watching a documentary series many years ago about youngsters who ran away from home and ended up on the streets in London. One lad was discussing how he had to survive and said he was often chatted up by men who paid him to perform sexual acts , he went on to say one of his clients was a Labour MP and named him and the constituency he represented (which was bleeped out) because on their second meeting his briefcase snapped open and documents fell out.

 

[cunning fergus]

I get very uneasy with party politics in this thread. Cyril Smith was a Liberal, Greville Janner was Labour and Leon Brittan, Conservative. They all got away with it. This is not a party political issue.

I may be wrong, but I don't think the Police has stated as unequivocally as they have about Janner that Britton/Smith should have been arrested? There has been innuendo in the press and allegations but not with an apology by the Police for not acting whey should.

I guess on a broader political perspective we should reflect on how politicians in general have allowed children in care and in other vulnerable circumstances to be systematically abused, as we have found out in recent years.........

Frankly if MPs are not abusing them directly or with their mates, they are facilitating it with political weakness when confronted by it as has happened in Derby, Rochdale, Rotherham, Blackburn, Halifax, Oxford et al.

We need to hold these f@ckers to account first......

 

[Bry Nylon]

There is a case for saying that having a defendant with an advanced case of Alzheimer's makes it difficult to achieve a meaningful fair criminal trial. BUT ... this doesn't rule out referring the matter to the full scrutiny of whichever one of the Inquiries that have been set up would be appropriate.

So he is too unwell to face trial but presumably well enough to attend the House of Lords and comment upon and scrutinise legislation - if he so chooses? Completely ridiculous. I see that the Labour Party has suspended him, but there should be some mechanism for removing Peerages from people diagnosed with advanced dementia.

 

[gregbrighton]

I get very uneasy with party politics in this thread. Cyril Smith was a Liberal, Greville Janner was Labour and Leon Brittan, Conservative. They all got away with it. This is not a party political issue.

Of course it is a party political issue. All parties need to make far more effective vetting and disciplinary procedures to ensure these perverts are not representing the electorate.

 

[spring hall convert]

Of course it is a party political issue. All parties need to make far more effective vetting and disciplinary procedures to ensure these perverts are not representing the electorate.

Agreed but to single one party in particular out is to spectacularly misunderstand the scale, magnitude and reach of what has happened/ is happening here.

 

[clippedgull]

Exclusive from LBC radio

An ex-undercover officer has told LBC five suspected child abusers were released without charge despite admitting to being part of a paedophile ring with the former MP Cyril Smith.

more here including audio from ex cop

http://www.lbc.co.uk/ex-police-officer-breaks-silence-on-cyril-smith-108099

 

[gregbrighton]

Agreed but to single one party in particular out is to spectacularly misunderstand the scale, magnitude and reach of what has happened/ is happening here.

We should single parties out. It is their representative who they have appointed/elected. We should keep singling out the parties until they do something about it. I have singled out every party in this thread. You are trivialising the seriousness of the crimes by trying to hush up the party affiliation. The message to all parties: Get your houses in order.

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

but there should be some mechanism for removing Peerages from people diagnosed with advanced dementia.

You would then end up with an empty Chamber

 

[spring hall convert]

We should single parties out. It is their representative who they have appointed/elected. We should keep singling out the parties until they do something about it. I have singled out every party in this thread. You are trivialising the seriousness of the crimes by trying to hush up the party affiliation. The message to all parties: Get your houses in order.

You said "There is a rich seam of Conservative individuals to have their comeuppance soon." I was merely responding to that, from that post your position wan't particularly clear

 

[Lord Bracknell]

So he is too unwell to face trial but presumably well enough to attend the House of Lords and comment upon and scrutinise legislation - if he so chooses? Completely ridiculous. I see that the Labour Party has suspended him, but there should be some mechanism for removing Peerages from people diagnosed with advanced dementia.

The last time he spoke in the House of Lords was on 7 February 2013 - in a debate about Israel.

 

[cunning fergus]

The last time he spoke in the House of Lords was on 7 February 2013 - in a debate about Israel.

I note he was the son of a Baron, and went to the same private school as George Osbourne and Harriet Harman.

He was certainly a man of the people.........good old Labour.

 

[8ace]

... or they're dead

Sad to see the Ernest Saunders defence is still getting an outing

I made a similar point the other week when they mentioned Enoch Powell was being investigated. Some patronising jebend informed me I didn't get it.

 

[aolstudios]

http://www.lbc.co.uk/ex-police-officer-breaks-silence-on-cyril-smith-108099

 

[spring hall convert]

Well this is unprecedented isn't it?

https://leics.police.uk/news-appeal...-from-an-alleged-victim-of-historic-sex-abuse
Issued on 16/4/15 at 3:23 p.m.

The following is a statement made by one of the 25 individuals who claimed to have been assaulted in Leicestershire between the 1960s and 1980s and whose claims were investigated by Leicestershire’s Police Operation Enamel enquiry.

The man has expressly requested that Leicestershire Police make his statement publicly available.

In describing today’s decision as “a disgrace”, he said:

“This animal is still being protected because [of his status] and isn't able to stand trial. They say that it's not in the public interest, but isn't it in the public interest to know what his victims have gone through at the hands of this man?

“If he was an everyday person with a normal life and job, justice would [have] been served, but as it stands we victims are just being pushed to the ground again and walked over.

“Let someone feel the pain and suffering that I've endured and still going to endure for the rest of my life. It's not a case of being found guilty or going to prison - it's about being believed after so long being told that we were lying. Justice needs to be served.”

Ends.

 

[aolstudios]

Well this is unprecedented isn't it?

https://leics.police.uk/news-appeal...-from-an-alleged-victim-of-historic-sex-abuse
Issued on 16/4/15 at 3:23 p.m.

The following is a statement made by one of the 25 individuals who claimed to have been assaulted in Leicestershire between the 1960s and 1980s and whose claims were investigated by Leicestershire’s Police Operation Enamel enquiry.

The man has expressly requested that Leicestershire Police make his statement publicly available.

In describing today’s decision as “a disgrace”, he said:

“This animal is still being protected because [of his status] and isn't able to stand trial. They say that it's not in the public interest, but isn't it in the public interest to know what his victims have gone through at the hands of this man?

“If he was an everyday person with a normal life and job, justice would [have] been served, but as it stands we victims are just being pushed to the ground again and walked over.

“Let someone feel the pain and suffering that I've endured and still going to endure for the rest of my life. It's not a case of being found guilty or going to prison - it's about being believed after so long being told that we were lying. Justice needs to be served.”

Ends.

It certainly does. They should be allowed to tell their story & we should be told who supressed this & stopped it going to court - on this occasion and with every other time one of the *******s in the establishment has got away with it. Every one

 

[gregbrighton]

It certainly does. They should be allowed to tell their story & we should be told who supressed this & stopped it going to court - on this occasion and with every other time one of the *******s in the establishment has got away with it. Every one

This is is really rather depressing. I hope whoever gets into government will reform the systems to allow justice for the victims but I doubt it will ever happen.

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

There is a case for saying that having a defendant with an advanced case of Alzheimer's makes it difficult to achieve a meaningful fair criminal trial. BUT ... this doesn't rule out referring the matter to the full scrutiny of whichever one of the Inquiries that have been set up would be appropriate.

This diagnosis is all a bit too convenient. The victims definitely need their story to be told. As you say - full scrutiny.

It must be difficult for the victims to hear his family denials.

 

[glasfryn]

what definitely needs to happen is to allow the police to do the job they are there for

 

[Gwylan]

This is is really rather depressing. I hope whoever gets into government will reform the systems to allow justice for the victims but I doubt it will ever happen.

There was a vote on this in March. There was a proposal put forward by John Mann to relax the official secrets act so historic allegations of child abuse could be heard. It was voted for by all Labour MPs and a handful of Conservatives and Lib Dems but voted down by the bulk of the parliamentary Tory and LD parties.

If we have a change of government, there may be a chance of getting it through but if the Tories get back in: no chance

 

[carlzeiss]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...entia-diagnosis-stopped-police-raid-home.html