[Misc] The Big Bang (or not).

[Deportivo Seagull]

With all due respect, I can’t have a serious discussion with someone about science or the universe if they first ask me if I have proof that god doesn’t exist.

Of course God doesn’t exist. Let’s start there.

God is a belief based system. No proof is needed or provided as there isn’t any, hence belief based system. To disprove ‘something’ you take the proof provided and take it apart, religion has no proof so you don’t need to disprove something that doesn’t exist. What you can say is ‘i’ll disprove it once you provide some proof’ which they can’t.

For the religious amongst us. I have absolutely no problem with people being religious. If it makes you happy or makes your life easier then fine BUT it’s your religion and not mine so don’t start telling me what I can and can’t do or how to lead my life.


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[The Clamp]

God is a belief based system. No proof is needed or provided as there isn’t any, hence belief based system. To disprove ‘something’ you take the proof provided and take it apart, religion has no proof so you don’t need to disprove something that doesn’t exist. What you can say is ‘i’ll disprove it once you provide some proof’ which they can’t.

For the religious amongst us. I have absolutely no problem with people being religious. If it makes you happy or makes your life easier then fine BUT it’s your religion and not mine so don’t start telling me what I can and can’t do or how to lead my life.


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Yep.
God is not real.

I think faith is real.

I think it can be a positive force but it has an extremely limited place in serious scientific discussion. And certainly no place in a climate discussion.

 

[Questions]

Can we have your liver then ?

Oh alright you talked me into it.

 

[cunning fergus]

Think you might be conflating journalism with science.

Do the scientists know that wine was grown up north in Roman times in a warmer climate than we have now or is it lazy journalism?

https://www.theguardian.com/science/2003/apr/04/sciencenews.research

 

[Deportivo Seagull]

Do the scientists know that wine was grown up north in Roman times in a warmer climate than we have now or is it lazy journalism?

https://www.theguardian.com/science/2003/apr/04/sciencenews.research

No shit Batman.
Climate goes through cycles, the issue is we are giving it at helping hand that it doesn’t need. Not difficult.


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[Seagull27]

Do the scientists know that wine was grown up north in Roman times in a warmer climate than we have now or is it lazy journalism?

https://www.theguardian.com/science/2003/apr/04/sciencenews.research

The climate has been considerably warmer and colder in the past than it is now, no scientist would deny that.

It's not the change in temperature itself that is the problem, but the rate of change.

This infographic demonstrates it very well:
https://xkcd.com/1732/

 

[The Clamp]

Do the scientists know that wine was grown up north in Roman times in a warmer climate than we have now or is it lazy journalism?

https://www.theguardian.com/science/2003/apr/04/sciencenews.research

We know the planet used to be hotter. At one stage it was literally a mass of bubbling sulphur and liquid lava only able to support very simple but extremely persistent life forms such as Mitochondria. And Nigel Farage.

It would be nice not to return to the kind of temperatures that can’t support mammalian life forms.

 

[beorhthelm]

Do the scientists know that wine was grown up north in Roman times in a warmer climate than we have now or is it lazy journalism?

https://www.theguardian.com/science/2003/apr/04/sciencenews.research

The climate has been considerably warmer and colder in the past than it is now, no scientist would deny that.

It's not the change in temperature itself that is the problem, but the rate of change.

This infographic demonstrates it very well:
https://xkcd.com/1732/

interesting the infographic does not support the warmer 1000 y ago. or, estimations of historic temperature are misleading.

 

[Bold Seagull]

No shit Batman.
Climate goes through cycles, the issue is we are giving it at helping hand that it doesn’t need. Not difficult.


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It would appear it is a bit difficult to comprehend.

 

[GOM]

Not at all and this statement shows you simply don't understand scientific theory.

Gravity for example is a settled theory that has become a law. It works in every possible situation we have come up with.

The Big Bang Theory has always been the most likely theory of how the universe came into being, with there being multiple theories for the origin of the big bang, but not completely discrediting other theories.

Indeed, it seems that some are unaware of the difference between a theory and a law, which is somewhat the crux of this thread.

 

[pb21]

interesting the infographic does not support the warmer 1000 y ago. or, estimations of historic temperature are misleading.

 

[The Clamp]

I think one thing we can all agree on is that there’s a lot of stuff out there, whatever theory one subscribes to.



Oh and that God or no God, the universe is heading towards a slow but inevitable thermal death.

Friday though, so chin up.

 

[e77]

Let's go back to our old friend the Covid vaccines. In an ideal world they would have been able to test and trial it other a longer period but humanity was in a somewhat tight spot and it needed to be accelerated. There was no absolute guarantee of widespread side effects (there still isn't) but when allowing it for use the governments of the world had to make a judgement call which seems to have largely paid off. If a majority of the population hadn't made an informed decision to take the vaccine then we would all still be in some stage of lockdown with society on the verge of collapse by now.

Science attempts to measure via observation. It rarely gets to offer a definitive answer so we have to go with an informed best estimate.

As for global warming, the big money is in fossil fuels at the moment and if anyone had a motive to form a conspiracy it would be them, But as far as I can see man made global warming is the prevalent view.

As for the Big Bang, I imagine it is difficult to observe the virtual infiniteness of space for evidence of something that probably happened millions of years ago. It wouldn't surprise me if revisions were made through time but it isn't really comparable to more earthbound scientific questions.

For all their boasts about being free thinkers, conspiracy theorists never seem to agree the scientific orthodoxy. That isn't being a free thinker, that is being a contrarian.

 

[Seagull27]

interesting the infographic does not support the warmer 1000 y ago. or, estimations of historic temperature are misleading.

It does - it literally has a reference at the year 1000 mark that there was a warm period in Northern Europe, but the infographic is based on global averages

Edit: beaten to it

 

[beorhthelm]

It does - it literally has a reference at the year 1000 mark that there was a warm period in Northern Europe, but the infographic is based on global averages

Edit: beaten to it

yes a brain fart, thought i saw something i cant see now. the Guardian article is poor reference too.

 

[Hugo Rune]

As for the Big Bang, I imagine it is difficult to observe the virtual infiniteness of space for evidence of something that probably happened millions of years ago.

There is evidence though. It’s CMB. This is the ‘landmark’ evidence for the Big Bang.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_microwave_background

 

[Questions]

So what we’re saying is the moon could be still made of cheese then.

 

[Happy Exile]

I think one thing we can all agree on is that there’s a lot of stuff out there, whatever theory one subscribes to.



Oh and that God or no God, the universe is heading towards a slow but inevitable thermal death.

Friday though, so chin up.

Reminded me for some reason of the short story "Last Contact" https://web.archive.org/web/2008072...books.com/books/newbookscifi/last-contact.asp

 

[e77]

There is evidence though. It’s CMB. This is the ‘landmark’ evidence for the Big Bang.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_microwave_background

I am no expert and I am sure there its evidence but my point is things on that scale are harder to prove than something earth based.

 

[Shropshire Seagull]

Right, I've read all the comments on this thread and I still have no idea if the world is really flat.

So, if I were to paddle my canoe out to sea heading for the horizon, might I fall off the edge?
And if I did, would my missus still be able to claim on my life insurance?