[Football] Sweet Caroline - why?

[Smillie's People]

Look at the lyrics which are ENTIRELY about England and Blake's desire to create a new Jerusalem here as opposed to what was going on at the time which was essentially the Industrial Revolution and the horrors (hence Satanic Mills) which it involved.

There is an old legend that Jesus as a young man came to England with his uncle(?) Joseph of Aramathea (who collected his body after crucifixion).

Joseph was allegedly a tin merchant who travelled to Cornwall to collect tin ore and other metals, near Glastonbury. No-one knows what Jesus did or where he was from the age of about 12 to 30 when he began preaching, according to the Gospels.

 

[Sid in the Sharknado]

There is an old legend that Jesus as a young man came to England with his uncle(?) Joseph of Aramathea (who collected his body after crucifixion).

Joseph was allegedly a tin merchant who travelled to Cornwall to collect tin ore and other metals, near Glastonbury. No-one knows what Jesus did or where he was from the age of about 12 to 30 when he began preaching, according to the Gospels.

Glastonbury is not, by any sensible definition, near Cornwall.

I think this files under "technically possible, definitely not true". There is no reason to think that he ever came to Britain apart from stories made up by monks etc. over the years to try and drum up the tourist trade.

 

[Smillie's People]

Glastonbury is not, by any sensible definition, near Cornwall.

I think this files under "technically possible, definitely not true". There is no reason to think that he ever came to Britain apart from stories made up by monks etc. over the years to try and drum up the tourist trade.

Apparently (according to a book I got written in about 1930) Cornwall was linked to the Glastonbury area as sources of rare metals - tin, copper etc. The writer said it was curious that no legends existed in Devon about Christ visiting as a young man. Allegedly Glastonbury Abbey was built on the site of a mud wattle and daub church built by J of A after he came to live there. This appeared in early Christian writings from about 3-400 ADS (he claims).

 

[METALMICKY]

Sweet Caroline a football song? Not for me. Not helped by the fact that it's my sister's name and she's far from it!

 

[Sid in the Sharknado]

Apparently (according to a book I got written in about 1930) Cornwall was linked to the Glastonbury area as sources of rare metals - tin, copper etc. The writer said it was curious that no legends existed in Devon about Christ visiting as a young man. Allegedly Glastonbury Abbey was built on the site of a mud wattle and daub church built by J of A after he came to live there. This appeared in early Christian writings from about 3-400 ADS (he claims).

Out of interest, is that book "Did Our Lord Visit Britain as they say in Cornwall and Somerset?" (1936) by C.C. Dobson? It's briefly mentioned in the Wikipedia page on Joseph of Arimathea.

As far as I can tell, there's no connection between Glastonbury and the tin/copper trade. Nor is there any evidence that the church dates back to 400AD, or that J of A ever lived in Britain. There is plenty of reason to think that the locals have been spreading these stories to encourage pilgrims to the area, and that this is continued in the modern day to support the tourist industry.

This is frustrating, because the church is apparently genuinely extremely old, and the history of how Christianity spread to Britain and Ireland and around the ancient world is genuinely interesting, but it's murky and confusing enough as it is without having to sift through all the made-up stuff as well.

 

[Pint of Ale and a Burger]

There is a lot of missing years of Jesus.
He seems to vanish off the historical radar from about the age of 15 and then reappears in his early 40s as the Messiah,which we obviously all know about.
That's a big chunk of his life we don't know about.
There is a small and disputed bit of evidence that he travelled into India and the Himalayas on a path of spiritual seeking.
I personally think this did happen because of the similarities between jesus,Buddha and the Vedic texts.

I'm quite convinced jesus was a yogi.
But the interesting part is he seemed to have been able to travel by working for various traders who obviously travelled far and wide,so it is possible jesus visited Glastonbury but unlikely he did so as an enlightened being,but still possible.

It's also possible he travelled over here after his crucifixion if the rumours are to be believed about Mary Magdalene being smuggled to France with jesus s child which began the Merovingian dynasty.
Whatever happened,it's a lovely line in the Jerusalem song which makes it one of the best English songs ever,in my opinion.
It should be the national anthem.

 

[dadams2k11]

Because it is quality.

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

I take it you haven't been to a Test Match in the last 10 years or so?

Can’t say I’ve ever been to a test match

 

[Sid in the Sharknado]

Can’t say I’ve ever been to a test match

You're missing out, it's a great day out. But don't worry, you're not alone:

Never seen the 'stupid miming' you mention as I have only ever sung it at Church/Remembrance Services.

Apparently neither has Jakarta.

 

[LamieRobertson]

I take it you haven't been to a Test Match in the last 10 years or so?

Played at the county ground tonight….crickets catching on

 

[jakarta]

You're missing out, it's a great day out. But don't worry, you're not alone:



Apparently neither has Jakarta.

Been to quite a lot of Tests thank you, including the MSG when we hammered the Convicts.

 

[Sid in the Sharknado]

Been to quite a lot of Tests thank you, including the MSG when we hammered the Convicts.

So, based on the post I quoted, even given multiple opportunities and being surrounded by other people singing it, you still couldn't bring yourself to sing Jerusalem at a test match?

Also, I know this is a typo, but at heart I'm a tiny immature child:

Been to quite a lot of Tests thank you, including the MSG

In all seriousness, I'd have given a lot to be there (assuming you're referring to 2010/11) - I was spending my "gap year" in a loft in Reading while working for National Grid. I stayed up to listen to the commentary of the first match and heard Strauss get dismissed in the first over, and decided to go to bed.

 

[BN9 BHA]

Played at the county ground tonight

Did you bat or bowl?

 

[LamieRobertson]

Did you bat or bowl?

Umpired……hmm is that playing though .maybe not

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

There is a lot of missing years of Jesus.
He seems to vanish off the historical radar from about the age of 15 and then reappears in his early 40s as the Messiah,which we obviously all know about.
That's a big chunk of his life we don't know about.
There is a small and disputed bit of evidence that he travelled into India and the Himalayas on a path of spiritual seeking.
I personally think this did happen because of the similarities between jesus,Buddha and the Vedic texts.

I'm quite convinced jesus was a yogi.
But the interesting part is he seemed to have been able to travel by working for various traders who obviously travelled far and wide,so it is possible jesus visited Glastonbury but unlikely he did so as an enlightened being,but still possible.

It's also possible he travelled over here after his crucifixion if the rumours are to be believed about Mary Magdalene being smuggled to France with jesus s child which began the Merovingian dynasty.
Whatever happened,it's a lovely line in the Jerusalem song which makes it one of the best English songs ever,in my opinion.
It should be the national anthem.

I fear that you are falling into the trap of believing what fits your preconceptions, which is very easy to do when there is no evidence whatsoever. There is contemporaneous evidence from Roman writing of an annoying git (in the view of the Romans) who they crucified, but the rest of it was made up many years (most of it hundreds of years) later. By Romans in the main, ironically. Charlatans, rather like our current Christian politicians, such as Boris, Moggy and that other one. Boris is a Catholic, now, apparently. Praise the lord.

I add that this does not prove there is no God or that Jesus wasn't both God himself and his son at the same time. Saying 'I believe' or 'I read that' doesn't prove the opposite, either.

As far as good literature is concerned, on the topic of Jesus, I rather enjoyed the Da Vinci Code, yet people tell me the book is rubbish. I found it a cracking yarn

Edit: Jesus was supposedly 33 when he was crucified. If this has been revised to 'in his 40s' this is a revision made after the 60s when I was told all the facts about Christ at school. A Christian school - St Nick's in Portslade. I love it when facts are replaced by new facts.

 

[ExmouthExile]

Just be thankful we haven’t had to listen to that bloody cringeworthy brass band since before the pandemic. I hope they never return!

 

[clapham_gull]

Let's face it, it's a little bit Palace isn't it ?

I've actually seen him live in concert. Burrish Gull bought front row tickets for a joke and it was simultaneously the funniest and deeply disturbing concert I have ever attended.

I was in therapy for weeks afterwards.

 

[Pint of Ale and a Burger]

Yes,your right.
I meant to say early 30s not 40s when Jesus burst back on the scene.
I had a quick check and I got that wrong too.
We are missing about 18 years of his life from 12 to 29.
So why do we know so much about him as a child and then as an adult but his most formative years in which he became the famous jesus are missing.
It seems very strange this information was not recorded but I believe the reason why it's not recorded is because Jesus wasn't in the area during those 18 years.
I believe he was in the Himalayas learning the path of yoga and the Vedas.
He learnt from the yogis and then returned to Bethlehem with his new found wisdom which was obviously popular with the majority of the locals but not with those in charge,for obvious reasons.
There has been some very small leads to go on regarding jesus having travelled in India but nothing we should call"evidence"but there is something there,which is more than we had before and it's enough for people to now be looking seriously at that theory of Jesus in India.

Im not sure I'm falling into a trap with my thoughts on this.
There is certainly a lot of similarity between jesus teachings and Buddha and Krishna,and .
More recent yogis.
There is certainly enough for me to think jesus had studied about enlightenment in India and the Himalayas and was quite likely an enlightened being himself.

It is quite possible too that in those 18 years he visited Glastonbury.
Again no hard evidence of it but a local legend and a possibility,so worth investigating,and certainly worth putting into a rousing song about england.

In fact I have decided on Sunday I will be changing the words of sweet Caroline to
"sweet Jesus Christ"which makes more sense and pays homage to the song Jerusalem and the exciting possibility jesus once visited here.

 

[jakarta]

So, based on the post I quoted, even given multiple opportunities and being surrounded by other people singing it, you still couldn't bring yourself to sing Jerusalem at a test match?

Also, I know this is a typo, but at heart I'm a tiny immature child:





In all seriousness, I'd have given a lot to be there (assuming you're referring to 2010/11) - I was spending my "gap year" in a loft in Reading while working for National Grid. I stayed up to listen to the commentary of the first match and heard Strauss get dismissed in the first over, and decided to go to bed.

Of course it was the MCG, Strauss actually went in the first over of the Second Test, not the First?

As mentioned I was at the MCG for the first day, 90,000 there at start of play, probably less than 10,000 at stumps. I still have copies of the Aussie Papers from the following Day as souvenirs. Let's just say the Convicts don't like being stuffed at Cricket...

 

[birthofanorange]