[Albion] Stop this false nine nonsense now

[Stat Brother]

It’s a proper toys out the pram-fest this weekend. When is the poll due?

If he hadn't dummied the ball we might not be all of a tizzy now!

 

[Guinness Boy]

It’s a proper toys out the pram-fest this weekend. When is the poll due?

Hey, it's a long term project.

Sure, we're 8th now but with a few more games playing without a recognised striker. youth team prospects going backwards and xG of less than 0.5 I'm pretty confident we can hit League One by 2024.

You need to look at the big picture.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Hey, it's a long term project.

Sure, we're 8th now but with a few more games playing without a recognised striker. youth team prospects going backwards and xG of less than 0.5 I'm pretty confident we can hit League One by 2024.

You need to look at the big picture.

Being an Albion fan, by definition, is a long term project.

Getting upset by dips in form is like getting upset there’s traffic on the M25 at 5pm on a Friday.

 

[Swansman]

Must be quite rough to, every time it rains, believe that it never will stop raining and any time it is sun believe that there will never be rain again. Dont envy you.

 

[Kosh]

Some of the teams are worse than others, none are "diabolical". Yes they've lost half of their games but the other half they havent lost despite allegedly being "diabolical". How come half of the teams playing Newcastle lost points to a "diabolical" team? Because they are not. No team in the PL is. Obviously it was a winable game but nothing comes for free and you have to deserve every win/point you get even against the bottom sides.

I dont agree with pretty much any of that. I think both against (especially) Newcastle and Villa, the team was poor in possession but that the number of players in the box wasnt the core issue. For the most part, there was a couple of players in there, but also for the most part players were either indecisive or making the wrong decisions.

Is part of that GPs fault? Obviously, and I've already said that GP ****ed the game yesterday with the Maupay for Lamptey sub. But yet again when a football team loses a game there is this absurd obsession what some middle management bloke did or didnt do as if the 22 people on the pitch has no impact on the results.

70+ teams in the English league thinks that through changing managers every one and half years every problem will suddenly be solved and they will finally reach their deserved heights, just to quickly realise (and then yet again forget) that football is played on the pitch and thats where you lose and win most games. Sack all managers and replace them with 20 poo eating monkeys and the league table would not look a lot different. Yet managers are always talk of the town.

Right; lets you and me get this straight: I don’t want nor have I suggested we sack/replace GP - okay? There are literally no sensible or viable alternatives.

I simply want the head coach of my club to set us up with the best possible chance of winning games against the teams we CAN compete with. During the last two games he has categorically failed to do this.

Why? You tell me - you’re the one with all the bombast and the inside understanding of the game - you’ve been a coach (or so you say), help me to recollect the lesson whereby playing no recognised striker against a lesser team makes any sense whatsoever ?!? Games where you expect final third penetration, games where you should expect to create chances ... ?!?!

Is it beyond unreasonable therefore to constructively criticise that decision making process ? Well ?

Your other point re any team is a good team is exactly why we fail, we fear every team even now ... we’re frightened to really go for our opponents, we will never make that top 10 dream unless we start to believe we belong there... I despair re the attitude that we’re here to make up the numbers and BOY if we scape a win against Newcastle we should thank our lucky stars ... you see, we don’t belong.

If GP believes this too, then we should all pack up a go home.

Where has that GP gone from season one? We’ve regressed this season and anyone who chooses to be honest can see it.

Beyond that, yes he has his hands tied but he needs to look at playing the percentages - especially against a team like Newcastle at home, which was cowardly and pathetic.

 

[Shooting Star]

You need a stroke of genius to beat the big boys, and Potter is fantastic at that. His downfall is that he continues to try and do the same against teams of a similar/lesser calibre than ourselves, and ends up out-smarting only himself. We don’t need to trick the Villa’s and Newcastle’s of this world - our style + a conventional formation/lineup would suffice, as shown with our success at the beginning of the season.

 

[Stat Brother]

Being an Albion fan, by definition, is a long term project.

Getting upset by dips in form is like getting upset there’s traffic on the M25 at 5pm on a Friday.

But this isn't just a dip in form, that's like the dinosaurs saying 'look at that shooting star'.

I can say with great confidence the Albion are never going to score another goal and will lose every game this season 15-0 but with 79% possession.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Being an Albion fan, by definition, is a long term project.

Getting upset by dips in form is like getting upset there’s traffic on the M25 at 5pm on a Friday.

I can understand the parody going over Swansman's head, but not even a flicker of recognition from you?

 

[Bold Seagull]

I can understand the parody going over Swansman's head, but not even a flicker of recognition from you?

Well maybe a flicker, I’m more concerned of you heading down a dark path again.

 

[Stat Brother]

Right; lets you and me get this straight: I don’t want nor have I suggested we sack/replace GP - okay?

Too late.

You're a marked man now.
You will be labelled an 'outer'.

If you persist in questioning GPott you will soon be told you don't even support the Albion and just want them to lose.

 

[Kosh]

Too late.

You're a marked man now.
You will be labelled an 'outer'.

If you persist in questioning GPott you will soon be told you don't even support the Albion and just want them to lose.

I’m sometimes utterly aghast that literally the best manager we’ve ever had can frustrate me so!

That’ll confuse the buggers.

 

[Swansman]

Right; lets you and me get this straight: I don’t want nor have I suggested we sack/replace GP - okay? There are literally no sensible or viable alternatives.

I simply want the head coach of my club to set us up with the best possible chance of winning games against the teams we CAN compete with. During the last two games he has categorically failed to do this.

Why? You tell me - you’re the one with all the bombast and the inside understanding of the game - you’ve been a coach (or so you say), help me to recollect the lesson whereby playing no recognised striker against a lesser team makes any sense whatsoever ?!? Games where you expect final third penetration, games where you should expect to create chances ... ?!?!

Is it beyond unreasonable therefore to constructively criticise that decision making process ? Well ?

Your other point re any team is a good team is exactly why we fail, we fear every team even now ... we’re frightened to really go for our opponents, we will never make that top 10 dream unless we start to believe we belong there... I despair ref he attitude that we’re here to make up the numbers and BOY if we scape a win against Newcastle we should thank our lucky stars ... you see, we don’t belong.

If GP believe this too, then we should all pack up a go home.

Where has that GP gone from season one? We’ve regressed this season and anyone who chooses to be honest can see it.

You "simply" want this and that is what every fan at every club wants but since they are never wrong and the coaches are wrong any time a team lose, we have this manager circus.

Why you would set up with a false nine rather than a striker against a poor team? Its not exactly rocket science. Against a "poor" team you expect to have the ball a lot more and you expect them to go forward a lot less. This means that your centre forward is usually going to be inside a crowded penalty area, barely participating in the game. If you have a player who is more comfortable dropping down and creating chances from a bit deeper, you are more likely to have him involved.

This is why Spain started with Cesc as a false nine instead of playing Torres in 2012. They found out that looking for through balls to their CF in crowded spaces was a lot more difficult than having a more dynamic attack where you couldnt predict the next move. When Xavi or Iniesta or Silva had the ball, defenders knew that they should keep track of Torres. With Torres removed from the team, you never knew who what or where the ball would go. Obviously Brighton dont have the same level of players but the idea is similar. If everyone is a playmaker, your attacks are less predictable.

Did it work well? No. Is there any guarantees a different solution would have worked better? If Mwepu, after his goal and fine performance against Liverpool, would have been benched for Maupay, and the game ended 1-1, the same people complaining about Maupay not playing would have complained about Mwepu changing the successful team from the second half vs Pool.

When a team is doing well, the manager is never doing anything wrong, and when a team is doing bad, he is never doing the right thing. That is the simplicity of football debate. Meanwhile, in the real world, football is played on the pitch, 11 players vs 11 players and that is where you win and lose pretty much every game. But because everyone believes they could pick the best lineup and make tactical decisions while no one believes they could perform better on the pitch, people prefer to focus on the former.

If Brighton and the players would start thinking they "belong in the top 10", much like some fans do, it would go very bad very quickly. Start looking at the league table instead of the next game and you are in deep shit.

 

[Kosh]

You "simply" want this and that is what every fan at every club wants but since they are never wrong and the coaches are wrong any time a team lose, we have this manager circus.

Why you would set up with a false nine rather than a striker against a poor team? Its not exactly rocket science. Against a "poor" team you expect to have the ball a lot more and you expect them to go forward a lot less. This means that your centre forward is usually going to be inside a crowded penalty area, barely participating in the game. If you have a player who is more comfortable dropping down and creating chances from a bit deeper, you are more likely to have him involved.

This is why Spain started with Cesc as a false nine instead of playing Torres in 2012. They found out that looking for through balls to their CF in crowded spaces was a lot more difficult than having a more dynamic attack where you couldnt predict the next move. When Xavi or Iniesta or Silva had the ball, defenders knew that they should keep track of Torres. With Torres removed from the team, you never knew who what or where the ball would go. Obviously Brighton dont have the same level of players but the idea is similar. If everyone is a playmaker, your attacks are less predictable.

Did it work well? No. Is there any guarantees a different solution would have worked better? If Mwepu, after his goal and fine performance against Liverpool, would have been benched for Maupay, and the game ended 1-1, the same people complaining about Maupay not playing would have complained about Mwepu changing the successful team from the second half vs Pool.

When a team is doing well, the manager is never doing anything wrong, and when a team is doing bad, he is never doing the right thing. That is the simplicity of football debate. Meanwhile, in the real world, football is played on the pitch, 11 players vs 11 players and that is where you win and lose pretty much every game. But because everyone believes they could pick the best lineup and make tactical decisions while no one believes they could perform better on the pitch, people prefer to focus on the former.

If Brighton and the players would start thinking they "belong in the top 10", much like some fans do, it would go very bad very quickly. Start looking at the league table instead of the next game and you are in deep shit.

We’re not Spain sadly...

I take issue with the last paragraph, you have to believe otherwise what’s the point of competing ?

The rest is reasonable enough. I don’t really agree however, and I still think GP consistently over strums his guitar for these lesser gigs...

That said, nobody’s perfect.

 

[Swansman]

We’re not Spain sadly...

I take issue with the last paragraph, you have to believe otherwise what’s the point of competing ?

The rest is reasonable enough. I don’t really agree however, and I still think GP consistently over strums his guitar for these lesser gigs...

That said, nobody’s perfect.

I dont think the point of competing is to believe this or that, the point of it is to compete as well as you can. If I enter some competition, what I believe is not particularly interesting - my effort and quality is what matters and to test that against others is "the point of competing". Belief is the point of going to church, not playing the Premier League.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Right; lets you and me get this straight: I don’t want nor have I suggested we sack/replace GP - okay? There are literally no sensible or viable alternatives.

I simply want the head coach of my club to set us up with the best possible chance of winning games against the teams we CAN compete with. During the last two games he has categorically failed to do this.

Why? You tell me - you’re the one with all the bombast and the inside understanding of the game - you’ve been a coach (or so you say), help me to recollect the lesson whereby playing no recognised striker against a lesser team makes any sense whatsoever ?!? Games where you expect final third penetration, games where you should expect to create chances ... ?!?!

Is it beyond unreasonable therefore to constructively criticise that decision making process ? Well ?

Your other point re any team is a good team is exactly why we fail, we fear every team even now ... we’re frightened to really go for our opponents, we will never make that top 10 dream unless we start to believe we belong there... I despair re the attitude that we’re here to make up the numbers and BOY if we scape a win against Newcastle we should thank our lucky stars ... you see, we don’t belong.

If GP believes this too, then we should all pack up a go home.

Where has that GP gone from season one? We’ve regressed this season and anyone who chooses to be honest can see it.

Beyond that, yes he has his hands tied but he needs to look at playing the percentages - especially against a team like Newcastle at home, which was cowardly and pathetic.

Spot on.

If Brighton and the players would start thinking they "belong in the top 10", much like some fans do, it would go very bad very quickly. Start looking at the league table instead of the next game and you are in deep shit.

And there we have it. "Know your place".

It's incredible. Whenever fans of big clubs come out with that classic "we should be beating teams like Brighton" this board takes mass offence, revels in our smallness and laughs at the hubris of the fallen giant. And the psychology of that is actually "aha, but we've arrived and you don't even know it".

Then when we claim we should be winning against, or at least competing against, teams who have a) not won all season or b) lost the last 5 then we're suddenly entitled.

That makes no logical sense whatsoever.

The bottom line is that the club has said we need to move to the next level (and, by inference, now, not in 2028). Bloom has said we should be a regular top ten team. Not me. The bloke who pays for it.

Ironically (he wrote of a fan of over 40 years) because that's what Mid Sussex Malcolm who used to have a box at Chelsea expects. I'd still go home and away in League 2.

And here we are heading for another 40 points and 16th place season that will have the easily satisfied clapping like seals whilst regurgitating our possessions stats and the fact that Sarmiento has moved on, because he's now watching the game from a slightly better seat than mine instead of banging in a hat trick against West Ham U23s.

 

[Swansman]

Spot on.



And there we have it. "Know your place".

It's incredible. Whenever fans of big clubs come out with that classic "we should be beating teams like Brighton" this board takes mass offence, revels in our smallness and laughs at the hubris of the fallen giant. And the psychology of that is actually "aha, but we've arrived and you don't even know it".

Then when we claim we should be winning against, or at least competing against, teams who have a) not won all season or b) lost the last 5 then we're suddenly entitled.

That makes no logical sense whatsoever.

The bottom line is that the club has said we need to move to the next level (and, by inference, now, not in 2028). Bloom has said we should be a regular top ten team. Not me. The bloke who pays for it. Ironically (he wrote of a fan of over 40 years) because that's what Mid Sussex Malcolm who used to have a box at Chelsea expects. I'd still go home and away in League 2.

And here we are heading for another 40 points and 16th place season that will have the easily satisfied clapping like seals whilst regurgitating our possessions stats and the fact that Sarmiento has moved on, because he's now watching the game from a slightly better seat than mine instead of banging in a hat trick against West Ham U23s.

I believe that the club has not said we "need to move to the next level now". TB said that he wants the club to be top ten and that is a realistic aim. All of the "should be there" and "need to be there" are inventions from impatient people, as far as I know.

Anyway, we have been over this before. You'll write some annual thread about the club not being better than last year and I'll respond by saying that not all development happens on the pitch and/or on the scoresheet. Rinse and repeat. I think I'll stay out of that tradition tbh as its not particularly interesting or pleasing.

 

[Guinness Boy]

I believe that the club has not said we "need to move to the next level now". TB said that he wants the club to be top ten and that is a realistic aim. All of the "should be there" and "need to be there" are inventions from impatient people, as far as I know.

Anyway, we have been over this before. You'll write some annual thread about the club not being better than last year and I'll respond by saying that not all development happens on the pitch and/or on the scoresheet. Rinse and repeat. I think I'll stay out of that tradition tbh as its not particularly interesting or pleasing.

You won't even stay out of this thread.

Paragraph 1 shows just how little you understand.

 

[Swansman]

You won't even stay out of this thread.

Paragraph 1 shows just how little you understand.

I'll continue to discuss this subject with those I find it interesting to discuss it with. When you are frustrated everything tends to be black or white and it is difficult to have some kind of calm exchange of perspectives when that happens.

 

[Guinness Boy]

I'll continue to discuss this subject with those I find it interesting to discuss it with. When you are frustrated everything tends to be black or white and it is difficult to have some kind of calm exchange of perspectives when that happens.

I'd suggest it means a bit more to someone who's spunked a good proportion of their income to actually be there at Villa Park compared to someone basing a cod-intellectual thesis on a poor and small illegal stream.

 

[Swansman]

I'd suggest it means a bit more to someone who's spunked a good proportion of their income to actually be there at Villa Park compared to someone basing a cod-intellectual thesis on a poor and small illegal stream.

I think it is more down to values and personality rather than money. Not saying my personality or values are better (or worse), just different. For example I'm slightly emotionally numb in general and you probably are not.