[Football] Southgate Out.

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

Funny how everybody's suddenly so smart in hindsight in evaluating Southgate's absurdly soft World Cup run. Woe betide anybody who dared suggest such a thing at the time tho

Yup, it was certainly easy - although somewhat harder than Scotland's............

 

[super-seagulls]

Hughton in!

 

[DJ NOBO]

The trouble with Southgate OUT is that it opens up the possibility of Potter IN.


.

You think Potter would be a serious contender for the England job?

 

[Nameless]

So let me get this right.

England had a decent World Cup, reached the EuroNat semis, cruised through Euro 2020 qualifying and have started off this new EuroNat trying to experiment with a squad that has a lot of unavailable players. They just about beat Iceland (France only just managed that recently) and drew in Denmark who have only lost their first match in yonks recently.

Southgate and England are the perfect long-term fit. Foremost, because it's a job that no-one is ever successful at in this country so it's pointless changing. We are a country of club footballers. Nationally most teams who do well do so because the team unit is based in a strong social and responsible ethos. A lot of World Cup/Euro winning managers have no great track record elsewhere. So Southgate is half the battle won. The players like him and know him. Tactically he is probably not the best but that's not as important.

Does anyone look at this team and think they should be winning stuff ? I think there are two world class players and small number of decent ones. Grealish is the only player I've been head scratching about the omission of.

So in short, it's his until something goes hideously wrong.

Is this a serious post or are you just here for arguments sake.. Southgate is a specialist in failure all he's ever done is fail. That team is more than capable of winning things with the right person in charge and that is most definitely not Southgate.

 

[Dorset Seagull]

The trouble with Southgate OUT is that it opens up the possibility of Potter IN.


So it needs to be combined with Smug Eddie IN instead.

Why would Potter want to change the every day interaction with players for the sitting in the stands watching potential prospects. He seems to me to be a hands on kind of guy who has bought into a project and wouldnt give it up for a undoubted short term punt on the international stage

 

[Nameless]

I don't think it's impossible, I just think expectations of many England fans are unrealistic. It's a mediocre football team that, probably, won't ever win any international championships

It's not that unrealistic to think a talent pool like that can win stuff.. It's better on paper at least than the Portgual side who win the NL & Euros arguably just as good as the French team across the pitch. The only two teams who have won things recently that are heads and shoulders above the potential of this squad are Germany side that won the world cup and the Spain team that dominated.

 

[vagabond]

The trouble with Southgate OUT is that it opens up the possibility of Potter IN.


So it needs to be combined with Smug Eddie IN instead.

This.

I’m scared guys.

Don’t let the England farce take GP away from us.

 

[mejonaNO12 aka riskit]

He's had 2 chances to 'win things'

Has finished 4th in both so far....at a time that we have no centre backs of any quality.

I have no idea what people expect him to have done, especially during a transitional phase where he is trying to phase in young players at the same time.



Bizarre.

 

[vagabond]

You think Potter would be a serious contender for the England job?

Well how many English manager alternatives are there?

Smug Eddie, Lamps, Gerrard. Not many unless we go the foreign route again.

 

[Swansman]

Well how many English manager alternatives are there?

Smug Eddie, Lamps, Gerrard. Not many unless we go the foreign route again.

And Dyche perhaps.

Dont think they will sack Southgate before the Euro tournament next summer though.

 

[Eeyore]

Well how many English manager alternatives are there?

Smug Eddie, Lamps, Gerrard. Not many unless we go the foreign route again.

There's been 18 managers in my lifetime and it all remains as is. International management is about character as much as skill. Look at those with most success. If the England players like Southgate then that's fine by me.

 

[Pavilionaire]

England manager is a results business and therefore if Southgate were to be sacked now that would have to be one of the harshest decisions in England history.

In 43 matches he has 8 losses - Belgium twice, Germany, France, Spain, Croatia, Netherlands, Czech - all top sides apart from the Czechs. 6 defeats have been by the odd goal, the 3-1 loss vs Dutch was in extra time and the 2-0 WC 3rd/4th place play-off was a dead rubber with a couple of players rested.

 

[Nameless]

England manager is a results business and therefore if Southgate were to be sacked now that would have to be one of the harshest decisions in England history.

In 43 matches he has 8 losses - Belgium twice, Germany, France, Spain, Croatia, Netherlands, Czech - all top sides apart from the Czechs. 6 defeats have been by the odd goal, the 3-1 loss vs Dutch was in extra time and the 2-0 WC 3rd/4th place play-off was a dead rubber with a couple of players rested.

Okay now please show us all the teams we have beaten the lucky win in spain and the sweden win at the world cup the only two impressive wins I remember. It wouldn't be harsh it would be necessary he's useless.

 

[maresfield seagull]

I did and people were raging at me.. The only match which you could say we were impressive in was the Sweden game. We scraped past Columbia on Pens.. Got beat by Belgiums A & B side and lost to a Croatia side who are really nothing special.

With a 2020 join date Under which name were you stating this Back then ?

 

[Nameless]

There's been 18 managers in my lifetime and it all remains as is. International management is about character as much as skill. Look at those with most success. If the England players like Southgate then that's fine by me.

Sorry but no. Bet Jack Grealish, Lewis Dunk, Aaron Wan-Bissaka, James Tarkowski, Saka don't like him very much. Michael Keane, Eric Dier, Kalvin Phillips, Tyrone Mings all probably do though.. He's useless and it's gonna be a shame if being embarrassed in the euros is what it's gonna take to get rid of him.

At the very least Steven Gerrard, Eddie Howe or Sean Dyche would pick the strongest squads and have some form of tactical know-how.

 

[Boys 9d]

Isn't there a miracle worker manager (albeit foreign) who is not currently under contract? Capable of making a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

 

[Nameless]

With a 2020 join date Under which name were you stating this Back then ? [/QUOT]

I was stating it to every person I spoke to about it.. Way before joining this site.

 

[Giraffe]

I do think with international management there is a fair degree of luck involved. You are judged on a relatively small number of games which are mostly just the tournament games. The other games are a necessary evil to get you there, either an assortment of qualifying games, which it seems to me has become easier for recent tournaments, or pointless friendlies which mean nothing.

The luck then comes down to keeping your best players injury free or not knackered, having a good draw in the tournament, and the normal run of the ball/VAR/ref decisions etc.

Southgate strikes me a a lucky manager, and that may be a better thing than a good one at England level.

Judgement should only be made on tournaments and England should be expected to progress to a quarter final level at a world cup, probably a semi final at Euros. Anything better is a bonus and history shows that with only 2 semi final appearances and 1 final appearance in world cups. Southgate achieved (partly through luck) one of those semi final appearance. Job done, lets see how he does in the next tournament.

And yes he should be picking Dunk, but not doing so doesn't actually make him a dreadful manager. He is clearly behind letting the younger players play as he is able to motivate them better. That may be a sign of weak management, but he certainly makes it work better than the more recent crop of management. At least now I feel watching the team they are motivated, whereas prior to his time I really didn't think they cared at all.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Okay now please show us all the teams we have beaten the lucky win in spain and the sweden win at the world cup the only two impressive wins I remember. It wouldn't be harsh it would be necessary he's useless.

As opposed to all the previous England managers with tournament success and multiple wins against the best sides in the world? Who are you kidding. The brutal fact of the matter is we build up our 'world class' stars when actually they're not. We still aren't producing technical ability at the very highest level that wins you tournaments.

Southgate brings continuity from being involved in England's development sides, and that in turn has led to a lot of looking at youth. He's probably given more debuts than previous England managers too, and in some respects that is no bad thing.

The other question is who is in the succession plan? Serial winners like Germany have a plan in place, I'm not seeing any obvious candidates unless you spunk a shit load of money on a big name for yet more disappointment and failure to connect with what playing for England is about.

 

[Greg Bobkin]

It's not that unrealistic to think a talent pool like that can win stuff.. It's better on paper at least than the Portgual side who win the NL & Euros arguably just as good as the French team across the pitch. The only two teams who have won things recently that are heads and shoulders above the potential of this squad are Germany side that won the world cup and the Spain team that dominated.

But it's clearly NOT better than Portugal or else it would've won something! It's like revisiting the whole 'golden generation' nonsense from the early 2000s or hyping up the 1996 lot – just because people keep saying the squad is good enough and you believe it, doesn't mean that it actually IS...

All this talk of potential and talent pools is just that – all talk.