[Sussex] Southern Water rip off

[zefarelly]

Because the media is written and presented by either right wing twats, or left wing well meaning do gooders whose only actual experience of poverty is running out of avocados to go with the feta cheese and that locally sourced artisan bread. Or their poor little darlings no longer being able to travel and study freely in Europe.

Bunch of cvnts the lot of them!

I'm sure Dewsbury will welcome you with open arms.

 

[1066familyman]

£72billion paid out in dividends since water privatization.
Bills up 40% above inflation.
Infrastructure investment 15% down.
And that's not accounting for almost everything being subcontracted and the profit taking there.
Shit still being pumped into the sea.

Not exactly a success yet this is the model we want for the NHS.

Unless it course the major objective was the upward transfer of wealth in which case a roaring success.

And they say Thatcher is dead.

 

[zefarelly]

She certainly sewed some very fruitful and popular seeds amongst her party and all profit orientated capitalists.

I don't think I can be more diplomatic than that.

What astounds me more than anything is the country doesn't even own its own utilities over 70% of water is foreign owned

60% electric is French

Gov only owns 20% of our infrastructure.

Tories like being gimps.

 

[rigton70]

She certainly sewed some very fruitful and popular seeds amongst her party and all profit orientated capitalists.

I don't think I can be more diplomatic than that.

What astounds me more than anything is the country doesn't even own its own utilities over 70% of water is foreign owned

60% electric is French

Gov only owns 20% of our infrastructure.

Tories like being gimps.

Labour had enough years in power to do something didn't they? Why didn't they?

 

[1066familyman]

Labour had enough years in power to do something didn't they? Why didn't they?

Because Labour couldn't run a bath?

Opps, no sorry, that's me in 21st century Britain.

 

[Cotton Socks]

When was your water meter last read? I read it myself a few months ago as due to covid the bills have been estimated. I had a refund & my DD reduced. As others have said turn off everything inside & see if the meter is ticking over.

 

[Weststander]

I had a (genuinely) quick internet look back at Hansard at the time of water privatisation.

It appears there were genuine issues eg 26% and 43% price rises in 1975/76 and 1976/77. Capital infrastructure investment fell by a third in the second half of the 70’s. I vaguely recall talk of a creaking Victorian system, of countless leaks. So by no means a bed of roses.

But, the point of privatisation was to bring in private investment to carry out the modernisation.

Posing the question, I wonder if that outside investment never came, that instead we funded the modernisation?

 

[1066familyman]

When was your water meter last read? I read it myself a few months ago as due to covid the bills have been estimated. I had a refund & my DD reduced. As others have said turn off everything inside & see if the meter is ticking over.

Done that. We don't have a leak. We do use a lot of water. As said, there's medical conditions involved and there's 5 of us (used to be 6).

I only water the garden from water butts and have more bricks in the toilet cisterns than Jewson's. The attempts at water saving doesn't stop there when it comes to toilet habits either.

Plain fact is, this essential for life is massively overpriced to facilitate large profits for a privatised company with no competition in the 'market'. And there's absolutely bugger all I can do about it.

 

[razer]

Just one of many reasons that I'd love to move up North. If the right opportunity came up, I'd be out of this over crowded rip off South East in a flash.

I did that in 1987. I'm still here.

 

[zefarelly]

I had a (genuinely) quick internet look back at Hansard at the time of water privatisation.

It appears there were genuine issues eg 26% and 43% price rises in 1975/76 and 1976/77. Capital infrastructure investment fell by a third in the second half of the 70’s. I vaguely recall talk of a creaking Victorian system, of countless leaks. So by no means a bed of roses.

But, the point of privatisation was to bring in private investment to carry out the modernisation.

Posing the question, I wonder if that outside investment never came, that instead we funded the modernisation?

Errr, we're creaking more with the same Victorian system in most places . . . Just a few new bits tacked on to try and cope with all the extra houses and people.

As for privatisation, a lot easier to sell it off cheap than buy it back high. TBH I think a halfway house would be best, but how you go about doing that without people dipping their fingers in is beyond me.

 

[Cotton Socks]

Done that. We don't have a leak. We do use a lot of water. As said, there's medical conditions involved and there's 5 of us (used to be 6).

I only water the garden from water butts and have more bricks in the toilet cisterns than Jewson's. The attempts at water saving doesn't stop there when it comes to toilet habits either.

Plain fact is, this essential for life is massively overpriced to facilitate large profits for a privatised company with no competition in the 'market'. And there's absolutely bugger all I can do about it.

If there are medical conditions involved then I think that there is some sort of 'discount' but I think everyone has to jump through 20 hoops to get it.

 

[1066familyman]

If there are medical conditions involved then I think that there is some sort of 'discount' but I think everyone has to jump through 20 hoops to get it.

See my first post a page or two back.

 

[Cotton Socks]

See my first post a page or two back.

Apologies, I got confused between the op & your's.

 

[Creaky]

Water supply is one of the few utilities that I have no problem with.

To have clean water delivered directly to the premises at a cost of a few pence per gallon has always struck me as extremely good value.

What is often forgotten is that the “water” charges most people face is not just for the supply of clean water but also for the removal of waste. We are not on main drainage and have to rely on our own sewage treatment - the charges we face reflect this at less than £15 per month. If we were on main drainage the cost would be at least three times this amount.

It is a far more costly operation to remove and treat sewage than it is to supply clean water. A clean water leak for instance poses far fewer dangers than does a sewage leak or unsafe disposal of waste - something I understand Southern Water is responsible for.

 

[jackanada]

I had a (genuinely) quick internet look back at Hansard at the time of water privatisation.

It appears there were genuine issues eg 26% and 43% price rises in 1975/76 and 1976/77. Capital infrastructure investment fell by a third in the second half of the 70’s. I vaguely recall talk of a creaking Victorian system, of countless leaks. So by no means a bed of roses.

But, the point of privatisation was to bring in private investment to carry out the modernisation.

Posing the question, I wonder if that outside investment never came, that instead we funded the modernisation?

Surely it can't just be me who finds the "outside investment" argument ridiculous. Or the other phrase from the time of "access to markets".
We're a country. We can invest in anything if we want to. Also a country can borrow money at very low interest rates or even print the damn stuff.

Then there are the advantages of publicly owned companies that get ignored.

The private company tries to pare staff to and cut pay and conditions to the bone.
This gets called efficiency but only if you look at the company in isolation.
In the private case profits are offshored, and the state has to subsidise pay so people can live, and pay benefits to a pool of unemployed so that occasional labour hasn't starved before it's needed.
The state owned case you have too many employees. But you have reduced unemployment, you have greater resilience in the system, the tax multipliers from these extra jobs stimulate the whole economy and help the Treasury, you have improved children's lives, reduced ill health, cut crime and on and on.


And water was privatized 1989 after they utilities had their budgets capped for a decade to be sure they were falling apart.

Anyhow add it to the list of things North Sea Oil boom money could have paid for instead.

 

[BLOCK F]

How have you avoided not having a meter installed? Southern Water have a legal right to install meters. The householder has no right to refuse a meter in areas of the country deemed to be in 'serious water stress'. Southern Water operates in just such an area.

Our bill is horrendous. Currently £108 a month and it's still not covering what they claim we use apparently.

5 of us in the house and a teenager who needs extra water for a medical condition. We are on an 'essentials' tariff, but no longer qualify for 'Water Sure' which caps the annual bill at 400 odd quid. To qualify for Water Sure you have to be in receipt of job seekers allowance or a means tested benefit in addition to other qualifying conditions like medical need, or 3 or more children under 19 and in full time education. Only two of ours are still under 19. We are no longer in receipt of any means tested benefits.

Privatisation is a misnomer as regards water companies. Whilst we can all shop around for a more 'competitive' energy supplier, we cannot do this for our water supply. Each water company effectively operates a monopoly.

Meanwhile, Southern Water pollute and pay fines that likely barely touch their profits. And there's this ...

Now financial accounts for Southern Water show its chief executive Ian McAulay - brought in to ensure change in the organisation - was handed a £550,900 bonus in 2020/21. Mr McAulay has a £435,000-a-year salary and with pension payments and benefits secured a £1.082m pay package.19 Jul 2021

Still, we all got a Christmas card from them. Which was nice.

Hi there,
I have inadvertently misled you a wee bit.
In this area (Chichester), Portsmouth Water Company provide our water and Southern take away the waste.
We pay a very modest £110 per annum to Portsmouth and £28.95 per month to Southern.
We’ve never been approached by Portsmouth to install a meter and have lived here for over twenty years.
At one time, there were five of us living here, but now the children have fled the nest, there are now only the two of us.

 

[studio150]

But, the point of privatisation was to bring in private investment to carry out the modernisation.

Posing the question, I wonder if that outside investment never came, that instead we funded the modernisation?

Or modernisation has yet to be carried out.

 

[Bodian]

Southeast Water - £97/month

1 bath, 4 showers and 2 dishwashers per day, plus about 10 loads of washing/week...

I've never had a bath and four showers in a day so far as I can recall. Let alone every day.

You must be squeaky clean!

 

[Jim in the West]

Surely it can't just be me who finds the "outside investment" argument ridiculous. Or the other phrase from the time of "access to markets".
We're a country. We can invest in anything if we want to. Also a country can borrow money at very low interest rates or even print the damn stuff.

Then there are the advantages of publicly owned companies that get ignored.

The private company tries to pare staff to and cut pay and conditions to the bone.
This gets called efficiency but only if you look at the company in isolation.
In the private case profits are offshored, and the state has to subsidise pay so people can live, and pay benefits to a pool of unemployed so that occasional labour hasn't starved before it's needed.
The state owned case you have too many employees. But you have reduced unemployment, you have greater resilience in the system, the tax multipliers from these extra jobs stimulate the whole economy and help the Treasury, you have improved children's lives, reduced ill health, cut crime and on and on.


And water was privatized 1989 after they utilities had their budgets capped for a decade to be sure they were falling apart.

Anyhow add it to the list of things North Sea Oil boom money could have paid for instead.

I confess to having an interest in this argument, having worked for a water company for the past three years (Bristol Water). Bristol Water has been a private company for all its 175 years. It is a fantastic example of how a private water company can serve the needs of its customers. The "public v private" argument is much more nuanced than "Private = bad, public = good".

 

[Bold Seagull]

Superb to know that despite shocking levels of service and illegal sewage dumping, our 70% of our water utilities are making money for foreign investors. That is comforting.