Southern Rail STRIKE details

[ROSM]

I'm at The Parlour, which will be absolutely rammed as it always is, even when it's not almost Christmas.

Well I've now taken the same insurance policy as you as I had a 10 pound voucher from the time I got a coach from Gatwick in a previous rail fiasco which expires at year end and have used that.

May see you at some point of journey home

 

[albionite]

Copy and paste but worth sharing.


I'ts a long one, but here we go.

The whole sorry matter of Govia Thameslink Railway (whose brands include Southern, Gatwick Express, Thameslink and Great Northern), the Department for Transport and the Government has manifested itself in the current dispute which has been going on for far less a period of time than the questionable service being provided by GTR. Indeed, on the Brighton Main Line, the flagship of GTR, problems with the trains and the infrastructure and the timetabling to squeeze every last bit of 'value' out of outdated and congested tracks is one of the more pressing issues but the lack of investment has been overshadowed by a labour dispute.

This piece will last a while. I would suggest a cup of tea and a quiet room with some paracetamol before you continue but you must continue and then absorb the facts.

The practice of Driver Only Operation, sometimes called DOO(P) or even DCO depending on which way the wind is blowing began in the 1980s under British Rail. Nobody could have foreseen at that time what a behemoth it would become in 2014 when things began to come to a head. When it started, trains ran every 30 minutes from Bedford to St Pancras (this predates Thameslink, even) using 4 carriage trains. Trains were rarely full and recent advancements in the Radio network to allow drivers and signallers to communicate meant it was deemed there would be no need for a Guard. A Guard, by the way, is not an archaic member of the railway grades who makes sure platforms are clear but in fact a very highly-trained professional who, in the event of an emergency or the Driver being ill or dead, is versed in rules to evacuate you safely. Like the driver, they 'know the route' like the back of their hand and can tell in a fraction of a second exactly where they are, on which line (an impressive feat on multi-track spaghetti tangles like at London Bridge) and what sort of speed the train should be going. Indeed, they have just as tough a job as a driver when it comes to making sure the entire train functions safely throughout its journey. They are pen knives: they dispatch trains at unstaffed stations, they check tickets, they defer criminal or antisocial behaviour, they give a sense of security and safety in a world where terrorism is rife, they can get you out of a dangerous situation in seconds, save your life, get you medical attention, fix minor faults on the move which can make you more comfortable or more safe and just provide a pleasing voice.

What happened after the roll out on the BedPan (Bedford to St Pancras) was an evolution of DOO the likes of which ASLEF would have resisted if they could foresee the systematic asset-stripping and destruction of the railway industry as we know it. Southeastern, c2c, West and East Anglia, Great Northern, the 'new' Thameslink of the 90s and more would all fall. That said, even East Anglia and c2c still use Guards on their 12 carriage trains over safety concerns - surely the first piece of evidence to suggest that 12 Carriage DOO is hardly what we should want as passengers.

Recently, there have been a number of extremely high-profile incidents that have made DOO absolutely obsolete. Indeed, ASLEF believe that we should go back to Driver and Guard on every single train in this country. So too do a number of bodies including those representing the disabled passengers and even some safety experts. These incidents we shall try to cover concisely.

'Liverpool'. This was a horrendous incident in which a young girl, albeit under the influence of intoxicating substances, fell down between the train and the platform. The Guard was charged with manslaughter and whilst this perhaps doesn't suggest an argument for keeping Guards, I feel it is the opposite. Had that been a Driver, the outcome could have been much the same. As a driver myself I need to stress that I am not suggesting drivers aren't competent at train dispatch; more that in the modern railway the driver will come under even more pressure to move a train by focusing at a television screen instead of signals and having to interpret far more complex information as well as trying to work out if it's safe to do so. If that's the case, drivers need to be paid far more like airline pilots given the sheer size of the task they are being asked. Problem is that even the drivers don't want the extra money because they aren't greedy. This strike isn't about ruining your Christmas. It's about having a decent, safe railway and that's something we can't have right now because your Government is taking money away and trying to make profit from the infrastructure at massive rates.

Then there's West Wickham. This small-ish station on the South Eastern routes to Hayes (which is near Bromley and Beckenham) was the scene of one of the worst "trap and drag" incidents of recent times in which two people (a driver and instructor!) were both unable to see a woman's handbag being caught in train doors which were subsequently closed just enough to create an electrical circuit called "Interlock" which allows a modern train to physically move. That's right - doors not entirely shut still give the false impression of being safely closed with nobody or nothing caught in and trains can move. Two drivers were both party to missing this because of appalling quality cameras which drivers on Southern are now expected to use for 12 Carriage peak time trains to Sussex and Surrey. Do you want your children or your wife or husband to get caught? Even a friend? It could be entirely innocent but equally deadly.

Then, coincidently having spoken about the Hayes line is a different Hayes called Hayes & Harlington. First Great Western also managed to be involved in a similar "trap and drag" incident. Again, a driver trying to look back through poor-quality CCTV managed to receive the electrical Interlock circuit necessary to release the brakes and take power to leave with a woman caught in it. Was it her handbag? No. It was her whole hand. She was lucky to escape with her life. The RMT and ASLEF unions subsequently issued an urgent advisory to all drivers and guards that the availability of interlock is basically defunct. That vital safety indication is completely meaningless - and drivers now will rightly delay trains to make absolutely certain that the situation is safe.

So why do drivers now feel the need to take longer to dispatch trains? Or Guards, for that matter? We heard about the 'Lewisham incident' in which a train was delayed because sunlight obscured the CCTV and people laughed so greatly at the "wrong kind of sun" in the same way we laugh at the "wrong kind of snow". Well, this is the most important part. If two people need to supervise a task involving safety the likelihood of a lapse is very minimal. If it is only person and that person is having a bad day, these safety issues are made more likely. Perhaps some people would call drivers selfish for wanting to take far more time to supervise the dispatch of a train when the very thing at the front of our minds now every time and sometimes more than 100s of stations a day is the very real chance of being taken to court for a slight mistake and being taken away from your family as you are imprisoned for manslaughter? But would we all not be so very worried that after years of a positive relationship between two people to get home safely every day that now you are losing a companion and being made to take on responsibilities that place you in the sights of a lawyer looking to cash in on a death?

Something that hasn't been appearing in the media has been about why a Guard can save your life quicker than a driver. The Driver's responsibilities now are that if the train catches fire, they must walk 1.25 miles up the track to take part in the truly archaic practice of placing detonators on the track to get oncoming trains to stop short of a derailed train or a train being evacuated so passengers aren't run over. Said driver then walks the 1.25 miles back to the train, and walks past it 1.25 miles the other way before returning. Having walked 5 miles in total, they can now save you from a potentially burning train for fear of not doing it and, once again, going to court. This old system is being enforced by the high potential for litigation against a driver who just wants to save your life but they aren't going to risk it in case they do in fact get imprisoned.

Then there's the cab radio. I suspect 98% of you will not know that if the driver has a heart attack, or perhaps is involved in a collision and loses consciousness etc., the train will come to a halt automatically. The first that passengers will become aware of this is that the emergency brakes will apply and the likelihood is that the train will stop in a strange place and regular travellers will automatically become concerned. After 30 seconds of no activity, the alarm will sound on the cab radio and the Signalling Centre will be alerted to the problem. They will try to make contact with the driver and if they don’t respond, they will take command of the PA (public address) and request railway staff to go to the cab and assist the driver using a coded message designed not to cause alarm to passengers. If the Guard hadn’t already gone to the front of the train, they would now do so and assist. An On Board Supervisor could do the same thing but will likely have no formal training in the use of the radio, communication protocols, where to arrange access for ambulance crews or how to evacuate passengers if needed. This means that the best chance of a driver surviving an accident or health problem is for a Guard to be aboard the train – and it’s also therefore best for passengers. Recently, a DOO train operated by c2c came to a halt outside Barking and the driver couldn’t receive medical attention for 40 minutes and died. He had a heart attack.

We have to try to be as fact-based as possible so we shall now turn to the Southern 'franchise' explicitly. In a first for this industry since privatisation, the Government has awarded the mixed bag of Southern, Gatwick Express, Great Northern and Thameslink as one entire company to Govia Thameslink Railway under a management contract. That is to say that the four mentioned companies are just brands. However, each of the four individual companies have their own sets of terms and conditions that are bespoke to the operations they run. That is to say that all of the drivers are on different pay rates, with different methods of dispatch and all. This melting point means that whilst it is easy to suggest that Thameslink runs DOO and therefore Southern can too is a difficult myth to unpick but let's try.

Thameslink is the successor to First Capital Connect which is successor to the 'original' Thameslink which is successor to British Rail. British Rail introduced 4 car trains to Bedford to St Pancras and when trains started running to Brighton, Sevenoaks and Surrey the trains would rarely be 8 carriages. The method of working was deliberately changed to suit this so as to provide DOO facilities for 4 and 8 car trains at stations as far as Haywards Heath and then the trains had to run fast to Brighton. At stations such as London Bridge or City Thameslink, stations had to be heavily modified to give platform staff the ability to electronically dispatch these new trains whilst now Thameslink-heavy stations such as Wiveslfield and Hassocks were still only served by traditional slam door stock. Thameslink evolved and now up to 12 car trains run with cameras mounted on the body side. A driver can therefore have to look at up to 12 CCTV screens at once that are the size of your iPhone to try and decide if it's safe to move a train which, in the current climate after 'Liverpool' is an ever-worsening and daunting task. The cameras, which can face into the wind, then get covered in dirt and dead flies and make the task even more challenging.

Southern, on the other hand, has a traditional Metro system which has DOO and uses trains where a driver can physically hold his or her head out of the window for a prolonged period to make sure nobody gets caught. That doesn't, however, mean that it's any easier and that there's an argument for DOO as when the platform is on the other side to the driver they are now 'flying blind'. At many stations, drivers are dispatched where there is considerable risk such as at Balham or Tulse Hill or Purley.

Southern's main line operations are somewhat split down further with the Uckfield and Ashford services using Guards even in the future due to the rural nature of the routes and the lack of infrastructure (and surprisingly a lack of willpower to fit CCTV etc); and the 'electric' main line network. This includes Milton Keynes, Southampton, Portsmouth, Eastbourne, East Grinstead, Horsham, Littlehampton and Brighton (to name a few key places) from London. When the trains were 'slam door' it was obvious why we had a Guard: to make sure the doors were even shut along the length of a train but also because of the lack of CCTV. Now, with the uniformity in the fleet of Class 377 electrics, it is deemed appropriate to roll out DOO to the rest of the network. The problem is that it is riddled with pitfalls. Let's deal with these.

Disabled passengers need wheelchair ramps. Conductors who are safety-critical and close doors will deal with these people by setting up and putting away the ramp as part of their station duties. At a great many unstaffed stations, drivers cannot undertake this task. Therefore, whilst the On Board Supervisor role could offer ramp assistance there is no guarantee that they shall be on each train. If a fare evader is caught and has to be dealt with, said On Board Supervisor will leave the train and have to find their way back to it. Along the rural route, for example, from Brighton to Southampton the OBS will potentially find themselves at Shoreham by Sea and the train goes with nobody for ramp assistance or to make people feel secure and comfortable right the way to Southampton and probably back to a crew depot such as Barnham. This is, frankly, intolerable.

Then, there's the element of safety training previously mentioned. I shall dive away from Southern's franchise for one second whilst we discuss what this means. A 12 car Thameslink or Gatwick Express train could come to grief tomorrow at a place, perhaps between Earlswood and Salfords on a busy 4 track main line, and there would only be a driver. There are rails that contain almost certainly fatal 750v DC electricity that trains run from that passengers, now desperately trying to escape a fire, will have to try to avoid. Once they've avoided the most immediate danger of electrocution, they're now in the path of an oncoming train doing 90mph and powerless to stop. The driver was unable to assist them. A Guard, however, can take control of the situation immediately and isolate the electricity locally and create a safe route for passenger evacuation. Now, passengers are involved in a deadly lottery that should their train derail or be involved in another serious incident (such as the Watford Tunnel derailment) they could either be left to their own devices or be saved by a Guard.

If the Southern changes take place, and indeed planned changes to remove Guards from Northern at least, there is no lottery: you are simply in the most dangerous situation at the beginning. An On Board Supervisor could be ticket-trained and simply be riding trains all day with no appreciation for what is going on below the solebar. For some, this could indeed be a lovey change in passenger experience as Chris Grayling, Paul Maynard, Charles Horton and Peter Wilkinson suggest. That said, I would sooner know that somebody was on the train for my safety in the event of a dire situation (like cabin crew) than worry about a ticket check every station. In fact, some companies go so far as to have a Driver, Guard AND Ticket Inspector on each train. What a novelty?

Southern passengers, in reality, who have trains with safety-critical Conductors stand a far better chance of surviving an accident than a Thameslink passenger. It is only because our railway industry is so very safe indeed that DOO gives the illusion that it is safe. But would you rather have a Conductor who can save your life in an emergency than not? Is it not better to "have it and not need it" like a thick coat in winter than to "need it and not have it"? I would certainly suggest so.

Now to return to this Management Contract. 100% of fares from the passengers of Southern, Thameslink, Great Northern and Gatwick Express enter the coffers of the Government. In return, a measly 3% is given back to Govia Thameslink Railway to give you train staffing, train maintenance, station staffing and any available improvements. It is this strangling effect that the Government is having on commuters and leisure passengers alike that is fully to blame for the horrific service being experienced by all concerned.

Make no mistake: Govia Thameslink Railway has no realistic reason to get rid of Guards. This is an absolute and definite forcing of the act of removing Guards to cut every last penny of 'waste' (!) from the frontline and from you the passenger to give the Government more money. Chris Grayling is sitting in his office and playing politics with your life every day and in the mean time washes his hands of the disputed saying it is between GTR and the Unions. It is the opposite - GTR may treat their staff badly but they could easily walk away and let another private company take every bit of flack from passengers as they too are forced by the Government to inflict misery on staff, cut headcount and treat passengers with contempt.

Southern's new Chief Operations Officer even admitted that he was being hampered from budging from the Government position on Guards and DOO by the Government itself who want to break the spirit and conditions of working railway staff and then inflict these horrific plans across other franchises.

It's not enough that the dreadful McNulty Report, being carried out by a man arguably even more dangerous and toxic than Beeching (That person being Peter Wilkinson) is already taking away your ticket offices and therefore making stations unstaffed for longer and even in inner city areas where antisocial behaviour is on the increase; but now the Government has Guards in their sights. Said horrid person, Peter Wilkinson, was formerly a senior man within Govia / Go Ahead and is now in charge of railway policy and commands a lovey £260k salary to "improve your experience" by giving you a ticket check but holding you in contempt by making sure the people who could save you in an accident are gone.

Wilkinson is such an unsavoury character that, despite everything I have so far told you about safety training and safety of passengers and the litigious nature of potential action against drivers, he said in a public meeting that he would force drivers who are opposed to these changes out of ‘his’ industry. This chap was forced to make a public apology and was, to be honest, very right to do so.

To end, I shall ask you as a person to still condemn the strikes of people who are really, really doing it for your safety. You are a passenger who deserves the best, safest railway and we are starting upon the slippery slope which will degrade that. These people are losing thousands of pounds this year, potentially, in lost earnings not because they are selfish but because their number one priority is you. The Driver is the most likely person to die in a rail accident and if that is the only person on the train you could now be alone, in a tunnel or in a rural area with no prospect of help. Govia Thameslink Railway have been so disgusting in this debate that they’ve gone so far as to take away staff’s children’s free travel to get to school, and they’ve stopped them being able to park at work. They’ve also made them sign a document that forces them to not strike again in return for being entitled to things like sick pay. If a Guard or Driver has the Flu and doesn’t come in for the obvious reason of not wanting to then give it to other staff and causing the entire service to collapse, they must now get a Doctor’s note after just one day to get their statutory sick pay.

Govia Thameslink have also recently had a high-profile in which all Thameslink and Great Northern staff were not even paid. Guards and Drivers were even called selfish by Conservative MP Nick Herbert from Sussex who decided that they should do overtime in order to keep the service running. Whilst it is absolutely true that the railway has always ‘run’ on overtime in order to keep slightly lower costs, the epidemic of overtime use across GTR has reached crisis points. Drivers, supposed to be working 4 days in each 7-day week, are now working 13 in 14. They are working 61% more than they should be and many are becoming exhausted and fed up about the lack of active recruitment for more drivers. There is a very real chance of people ‘falling asleep at the wheel’. Whilst it is to their credit that GTR are now recruiting more than 200 drivers, it is far too late. Customers are paying the price for years and years of no investment and continuing to add to the mountain of unallocated work.

So I ask, who is really at fault? Are the unions really trying to make a political point to punish the Government because they are not red but blue; or are they really standing up in your interests? I believe that it is certainly the latter. The Government are solely to blame for this crisis; whether Labour or Conservative for the railway industry as a whole has been slowly collapsing around its employees. The money from your fares destined for investment is being horrifically wasted and the passengers are suffering as the service genuinely deteriorates. Southern is just a thin end of the wedge: Thameslink’s planned timetable is already causing concern as it is likely to exacerbate delays during disruption; Northern is expecting to push up to 50% of their network to Driver Only using the CCTV technology that is causing such chaos and even London Midland could be going the same way. The entire railway industry is being forced through an ill-conceived set of changes proposed by a businessman who clearly doesn’t understand safety. The RSSB (Rail Safety experts) panel which is deciding that DOO is safe includes Govia Thameslink Railway Chief Executive Charles Horton. The Government is ready to spend tens of billions on High Speed Two as the existing network crumbles and to cap it all the Government profiteers from you and the misery you are enduring as they don’t want to negotiate and won’t negotiate. Instead of chasing tax dodgers, they are chasing you. They are increasing the fares once again and all at your expense.

Southern will not be the first, and it won’t be the last. You can probably expect the same things to come on Northern and beyond and therefore we need to finish this fight together. Chris Grayling, Paul Maynard and Peter Wilkinson have to go and we need railway industry professionals and not career politicians or businessmen running our railway. We need the right people at the right time. ASLEF have shown that strikes are legal – and so have the RMT. This cannot and will not go away and the Conductor or Guard role is not obsolete: We need them more than ever as our trains get longer, more frequent and busier. We need to keep the Guard on the train now, in the future and forever.

Please, share this with your friends and let them all know what is really happening on the railways across the country. We are in the grip of a terrible political nightmare and frontline staff are losing their jobs to feed the greed of people in senior posts. The media and the politicians can talk about anti-strike laws but all it does is mask the very problem we face. We need to support our Guards, keep our Guards and support our Drivers. It’s the Management we need to confront. Thank you.

The original creator of this content has been disclosed for anonymity, and I am only redistributing this information to ensure his security.

 

[wellquickwoody]

Still sounds safer by percentages than using the roads?

 

[Hiney]

Good to see Paul Barber on South Today last night

 

[Peter Grummit]

One thing to add to the driver's piece above. Much of the Southern network runs at or close to capacity, in terms of train paths that the signalling system can cope with. Regular passengers know that small delays or problems can have implications across a number of services and take a while to recover from. The single thing that most messes up the system is extended train dwell times at stations. Making drivers responsible for dispatch on 12 car services, often via small CCTV screens, is bound to make this worse.

PG

 

[beorhthelm]

One thing to add to the driver's piece above. Much of the Southern network runs at or close to capacity, in terms of train paths that the signalling system can cope with. Regular passengers know that small delays or problems can have implications across a number of services and take a while to recover from. The single thing that most messes up the system is extended train dwell times at stations. Making drivers responsible for dispatch on 12 car services, often via small CCTV screens, is bound to make this worse.

PG

this is the sort of argument that loses me, because it doesnt match reality. at busy stations, there are platform staff controlling/assisting with dispatch, while at quiet stations its unlikly to have problems prolonging the check. there are better arguments to be made than claiming a driver has to check monitors.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

How do you resolve a problem when part of the problem is banned from the talks?

[tweet]809002366229942272[/tweet]

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

How do you resolve a problem when part of the problem is banned from the talks?

[tweet]809002366229942272[/tweet]

Because much as they want to think they are important the RMT really are not?

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

This must be a record for SASTA today. Not ONE train reported as late!

HAHA ! Yes!


This will help the punctuality average I gtee it!

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

Great to see them all laughing and dancing on the picket line today on TV - shame about the miserable time their customers are having, missing their families and losing their jobs.

Yep. Their MEMBERS are quite happy. The unions subsidise their wages.

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

The strikes are what they are now. I've got used to them and they really don't bother me. They are an inconvenience but no worse than that.

What is ****ing annoying is the emergency time table. Uckfield line is down to one train an hour between Uckfield and London Bridge. No Uckfield Oxted shuttles and we've lost the morning and early evening half hour services. Yesterday coming home 14:08, 15:08, 17:08, 19:08 and 22:04 all cancelled. So imagine you turned up to get the 2pm train you would have actually having to wait for 2 hour until the next one. The only winners there are the pubs around London Bridge! As it was I got the 18:06 which is normally 10 coaches, last night 6 for two trains worth of people. Was a delightful journey back.

That's it for me. Until this is resolved I'm going to bite the bullet and travel from Tunbridge Wells/High Brooms. Ironically probably the biggest loser because of that will be the pubs around London Bridge.

A guy I used to work with lives/commutes from Crowborough which is on the Uckfield line. Whenever there was the inevitable **** up (even on a "good" day) he was always getting his Mrs (who thankfully doesn't work) to pick him up from T Wells. He probably now just does the TWells route every day.

 

[Captain Sensible]

How do you resolve a problem when part of the problem is banned from the talks?

[tweet]809002366229942272[/tweet]

Are the Acas talks between Aslef and Southern? Not the RMT? Perhaps he means the RMT have been barred from having their dispute delt with by Acas. Why the sudden will to want to sort the problems with the Driver Union, but not the long running guards dispute? Sounds like a Union busting divide and conquer tactic.

 

[LamieRobertson]

My wonderful MP (Loughton) just appeared on Prime ministers questions....wonderful opportunity ..and all he does is slate ASLEF ...fail!

 

[Yoda]

Yep. Their MEMBERS are quite happy. The unions subsidise their wages.

I'm sure I saw Dan post saying that ASLEF do not have a strike pot to subsidise their lost wages.

 

[Arthur]

A guy I used to work with lives/commutes from Crowborough which is on the Uckfield line. Whenever there was the inevitable **** up (even on a "good" day) he was always getting his Mrs (who thankfully doesn't work) to pick him up from T Wells. He probably now just does the TWells route every day.

I commute from Crowborough so share his pain. It's a lot worse for Buxted and Uckfield commuters though. The down train goes down to the bottom of the line (Uckfield) before coming back which takes ~30 mins. If the down train is > 20 mins late then it will 9 times out of 10 terminate at Crowborough and the up train will start from there. That will happen at least once or twice a week. Now with the emergency timetable and no shuttles that will mean waiting for the next train with is timetabled an hour later. To add salt in the wounds the pub opposite Crowborough station has shut down. As parts of the line are still single track any delay on the line can have a massive knock on effect for services up and down the line. I'd love to know how long I've sat at signals waiting for a train coming the other way.

 

[Peter Grummit]

this is the sort of argument that loses me, because it doesnt match reality. at busy stations, there are platform staff controlling/assisting with dispatch, while at quiet stations its unlikly to have problems prolonging the check. there are better arguments to be made than claiming a driver has to check monitors.

Where there are no dispatch staff, drivers will feel obliged to double-check the doors/passenger interface. Things are bound to take longer.

If you watch the reality of what happens at the busy stations, such as Clapham Junction, then the dispatch staff, guard and driver have their work cut out as a team to ensure no-one is boarding when doors are closing, or holding doors open. The guard acts as the central interface between the dispatch team and the driver. CJ is the critical platform bottleneck on the mainline. Dwell times there determine the capacity of the whole Southern network. Here's an extract from a Network Rail report:

Clapham Junction
Clapham Junction is the key platform-based constraint on the route into
Victoria. The station has single Up BML Fast and Down BML Fast platforms,
and the majority of Fast Line services call here. The platforms have a booked
dwell time of one minute and a platform re-occupation time of two minutes.
This effectively pegs the maximum theoretical capacity of the BML Fast Lines
into Victoria at 20tph

If that one minute scheduled dwell time has to be extended by 30 seconds, then the capacity of the BML network reduces by around 15%. The alternative is that it runs late, with knock-on effects for all the trains behind in peak hours.

PG

 

[Dick Swiveller]

Caroline Lucas calls for Grayling to be sacked and Southern to be stripped of franchise during PMQs. May seems to think giving money back is fine and then sneers about unions.

 

[beorhthelm]

If that one minute scheduled dwell time has to be extended by 30 seconds, then the capacity of the BML network reduces by around 15%. The alternative is that it runs late, with knock-on effects for all the trains behind in peak hours.

PG

agree with that. and thats alot of the problem for Southern because 1 minute at Clapham (or Croydon) is a bit of a fantasy, increasingly so when there is already a problem so more people trying to get on/off.

 

[pasty]

Genuine question for anyone ITK.

If an ASLEF driver who works for Southern is on strike because they say DOO trains are not safe and a guard MUST be kept on the train, why are ASLEF drivers who work for Thameslink not on strike for the same reason?

 

[Beach Hut]

RMT were not invited and not part of the dispute with ASLEF, can see the point