Southern Rail STRIKE details

[yxee]

No, the guard or platform dispatcher steps back from the train when they dispatch so has a clear view of the whole train.

Hmm... pretty sure they can't do that on a large number of platforms due to platform curvature, seems like you'd need at least two people, maybe three. Doesn't strike me as a foolproof solution.

Basically it's a technology problem, the doors didn't close properly. The solution should really be a safer door design with backup controls. If a system is fallible, the foolproof solution is not necessarily a human (who is also fallible)

 

[Deadly Danson]

Hmm... pretty sure they can't do that on a large number of platforms due to platform curvature, seems like you'd need at least two people, maybe three. Doesn't strike me as a foolproof solution.

Basically it's a technology problem, the doors didn't close properly. The solution should really be a safer door design with backup controls. If a system is fallible, the foolproof solution is not necessarily a human (who is also fallible)

Correct - the best solution is a mixture of human double checking and the best technology. All the more reason not to rush ahead with further DOO until the technology is infallible. Glad you agree with me.

 

[yxee]

Correct - the best solution is a mixture of human double checking and the best technology. All the more reason not to rush ahead with further DOO until the technology is infallible. Glad you agree with me.

I don't think human double-checking is needed. Given the disruption of the strikes, I'd prefer to just rely on customers pulling the safety cord and an improved door system (i.e. a good safety regulator). I think the incident is so unlikely, it is a worthwhile trade off if it means thousands of people can get to their jobs.

 

[beorhthelm]

Who'd have thought? I don't know the details but if for some reason the driver had the indication that the doors were closed and could take power, there's no way he could see that the door was open from the cab which is why someone who can step back and take a proper view of the whole train before dispatch is so important. It may be driver error but again another safety check can never hurt.

did you read the article? seems a driver error that could have occured with a guard on the platform.

it was raised yesturday, link to the rail forum where they suggested with the 455 you'd have to walk an awful long way back to see the doors open (open into the bodywork, so no door visable). this incidnet does show there's some basic safety systems lacking fail-safe operation.

 

[bhanutz]

The RMT no doubt had something to do with it to try and enhance their plummeting popularity with customers!

RMT propaganda....Nothing to see here!

 

[Deadly Danson]

I don't think human double-checking is needed. Given the disruption of the strikes, I'd prefer to just rely on customers pulling the safety cord and an improved door system (i.e. a good safety regulator). I think the incident is so unlikely, it is a worthwhile trade off if it means thousands of people can get to their jobs.

We will have to agree to disagree and it's not much consolation if you are the person who is hurt or killed on the "unlikely incident". And just for info - the vast majority of trains do not have a safety cord - just a button to press which communicates to the driver. By the time that conversation has happened it may be too late.

 

[Carrot Cruncher]

What strikes me as odd about that incident is that the RMT/ASLEF aren't shouting from the rooftops about it.

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

Having travelled roughly twice a week bar strike days one thing I have noticed is on train ticket inspections have ceased during rush hours or is it just me

To be fair thameslink are diligent on this. Southern have never been during rush hr.

 

[Yoda]

SASTA have reached a new low. Today will be the FOURTH day in a row they have cancelled the train I get home from work (16:06 from Durrington) meaning it is QUICKER for me to walk to near Worthing Hospital.

Yesterdays excuse was due to an obstruction on the line when I mentioned it to their twatter feed. The "obstruction" was in the Havent area. The train I get comes from Littlehampton and was still running, but, like today, was just skipping stations. When I told them this, they surprisingly went quiet.

 

[albionite]

http://www.leweslibdems.org.uk/conservative_government_behind_problems_with_southern_rail

 

[wellquickwoody]

No, the guard or platform dispatcher steps back from the train when they dispatch so has a clear view of the whole train.

A 'clear' view from the middle of a 150 yard train, standing about 6 feet back on a platform that curves away at either end, that kind of clear view?

 

[beorhthelm]

due to shortage of guards/on board supervisors they were cancelling trains on the East Coast line Saturday, running them empty to and fro. how did it come to this?

 

[Deadly Danson]

A 'clear' view from the middle of a 150 yard train, standing about 6 feet back on a platform that curves away at either end, that kind of clear view?

Currently if the platform is curved so that the guard can't see the whole of the train then additional platform staff are provided to ensure safety.

 

[The Large One]

interesting that you see it like that, lets look at it neutrally: its changed from a franchise to outsourced model. its been re-nationalised in all but name, with a private company asked to run it for a price, subject to performance criteria. the minimum level of service has already been breached and they were pulled up, fined and put on the naughty step for last years poor performance. the general service hasn't improved and the union action has made matters worse, and given them cover. elsewhere the government are introducing new delay repay that kicks in at 15 mins not 30min.

SASTA / GTR haven't been punished in any meaningful way. As you said, it's a government contractor. In reality, it's a lightning conductor, there to protect government from blame. They have been allowed to breach their own remedial plans; they're currently working on the fourth set, so it isn't subject to performace criteria at all. Even G4S got sacked as a government contractor for being utterly shit.

The union hasn't made matters worse; it's had very little effect on Southern's performance.

Meanwhile, look at today's figures - 67% punctuality across GTR (52% punctuality on Thameslink).

 

[Deadly Danson]

[Tweet]798461353350590464[/Tweet]

 

[pearl]

[Tweet]798461353350590464[/Tweet]

I can't believe they can do that, *******s

 

[Deadly Danson]

due to shortage of guards/on board supervisors they were cancelling trains on the East Coast line Saturday, running them empty to and fro. how did it come to this?

Same as ever - not enough staff. The full timetable was reintroduced way before there was enough staff to fulfill the service. Even with all the cancellations currently plenty of services still have various managers acting as guards.

 

[pearl]

Same as ever - not enough staff. The full timetable was reintroduced way before there was enough staff to fulfill the service. Even with all the cancellations currently plenty of services still have various managers acting as guards.

yeah my train home is cancelled ...... gggggrrrrrrrgggggghhhhhh!

 

[deletebeepbeepbeep]

In my view delay repay should kick in for delays of 15 minutes and should be provided automatically to season ticket holders without any form filling.

 

[Papa Lazarou]

In my view delay repay should kick in for delays of 15 minutes and should be provided automatically to season ticket holders without any form filling.

The Government are trying this soon, or so I thought. I believe they are using Southern as the test run of it.