Some hard truths for the UKIP supporters...

[hybrid_x]

democracy in the UK?

all parties support NATO.
all parties support the massive central banks such as Bank of England, IMF, and ECB.
all parties support and help many toxic corporations in the top twenty of the FTSE 100.
all parties support council tax.

there's no choice. immigration is irrelevant now as all that wanted to come here are already here.

they are all just pawns for finance and corps.....to keep people in silly petty debates like this very thread.......eek, that i am now a part of ;-)

 

[somerset]

democracy in the UK?

all parties support NATO.
all parties support the massive central banks such as Bank of England, IMF, and ECB.
all parties support and help many toxic corporations in the top twenty of the FTSE 100.
all parties support council tax.

there's no choice. immigration is irrelevant now as all that wanted to come here are already here.

they are all just pawns for finance and corps.....to keep people in silly petty debates like this very thread.......eek, that i am now a part of ;-)

Of course it is your democratic right to either form a party that will represent your particular anti-establishment agenda, or simply withdraw from society, live in the woods somewhere, and therefore avoid being upset by the real world.( including petty debates that are obviously beneath your lofty position)

 

[Flex Your Head]

For this reason alone, he shouldn't be elected as the guy is clearly bad luck. Not only did he have a crash on the last election day he now seems to have had a plane crash in a helicopter! I suspect he'll never fly again.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

Excellent. I wonder who was responsible for declaring open borders... Take one man (Does not matter what his nationality is) who crosses the border to the UK,he wants his wife and family with him,say two kids... that one is now four,the parents would also like to bring their parents...now we are eight,they have to be housed,then they have to have schools,doctors, and if they do not have a job then unemployment pay. I still cannot see the benefit of belonging to the EU,we are the second highest contributor to the corrupt Brussels 'government'. Start by getting out of the CHR....Mickey Mouse aspiring judges.

Exactly right. I think the thread of the title should read Some Hard Truths About The EU.
People picking holes in UKIP without looking at the much bigger picture. What goes on in Europe will effect us all eventually.

Why is the EU not committed in helping out countries in Southern Europe so they can protect their borders properly, so these people don't arrive here in the first place. It's inhumane to keep allowing these people to make these journeys. They end up nothing. We contribute millions of pounds a day for what?

Here are a few stories I found.
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/middl...er-african-immigrants-201451151638149598.html
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-eu-27352480
http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tan...-dangerous-but-common-way-of-entering-europe/

 

[IlsonDerby]

But Labour, Tories, Lib Dems keep banging their drums saying we'll lose thousands of jobs if we leave the EU and must stay in to save them but we're already are losing them by staying in.

Such an ill educated comment to make...Unemployment is falling! FGS if you're going to use this propaganda at least choose something that isn't in the news regularly!

Unemployment has been falling for a while now hence why the bank of England are getting ready to increase their interest rate. When the BofE increases their interest rate, inflation tends to rise with it which in turn makes the economy grow.

Back to the interest rate of the BofE being raised...a high interest rate makes a country more attractive for investment as there is a higher return! FDI comes into Britain in such high amounts because of our ties to Europe. If we were to leave the EU investors and companies would choose a different country to invest their money.

This is coming from somebody who has recently spoken to both the Chief economist at Lloyds and the East Midlands agent for the BofE

 

[Bevendean Hillbilly]

democracy in the UK?

all parties support NATO.
all parties support the massive central banks such as Bank of England, IMF, and ECB.
all parties support and help many toxic corporations in the top twenty of the FTSE 100.
all parties support council tax.

there's no choice. immigration is irrelevant now as all that wanted to come here are already here.

they are all just pawns for finance and corps.....to keep people in silly petty debates like this very thread.......eek, that i am now a part of ;-)

Yes. Well I've read some of your previous output and I wouldnt expect you to have a sensible position on anything not involving space aliens and lizard men.

For this reason I expect you to vote wisely and would be fascinated to hear your rationale.

Not.

 

[smartferndale]

seagullonthewing cumulative effect

One small Essex town where we live and helped a Rumanian man. His wife arrived and then their 2 children. Can you blame them for trying the improve the life of their family? No. It must take a lot of bottle to uproot and start a new life in a foreign country. Both now work full time and after claiming housing benefit for nearly one year are fully self sufficient. Only help now child benefit. But they do use school places, doctors and a house. But British can travel on the continent and be accused of the same thing.
Now a female friend has arrived and after one year her husband and 2 children are coming over. And we start again. We will help because they are decent hard working people who want to better themselves.
Another Rumanian couple are also living and both working and yet another have arrived 9 months ago and the wife has become pregnant and needs help with baby items etc. Every case is different and deserves support to make a better life.

But the cumulative effect is very worrying and even a die hard Christian Liberal can see the fears that this puts into peoples minds. It is in the best interest of everyone living in the U.K. that there is a severe restriction on immigration and I include in this all those Eastern Europeans living here. They are rapidly becoming the scapegoat for housing issues, drain on health services etc. And hence the potential for growth of racism.

 

[WATFORD zero]

To be fair, I was impressed by the beginning of their Party Political Broadcast

 

[Biancazzurro]

No matter which party you want to vote for I am surprised by the candidates who want to be elected for the south east but live nowhere near here. This has all of our local candidates mapped: http://goo.gl/1Ud2Lq

 

[El Presidente]

UKIP are the equivalent of the Tea Party in the USA. They appeal to a demographic that contains some/ all of being older, socially conservative (anti immigration, gay marriage, abortion, climate change etc) and poorly educated. These people are more easily swayed by a demonisation agenda and are entitled to vote UKIP because the alternatives from the mainstream parties aren't attractive to them.

 

[LargeHadronZugzwang]

UKIP are a rag bag of loony Tories that advocate Fracking Ponzi, xenophobia and tax haven business deals. They have nothing to offer ordinary citizens whatsoever.

http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...great-british-fruitcakes-bake-off-stewart-lee

 

[cunning fergus]

UKIP are the equivalent of the Tea Party in the USA. They appeal to a demographic that contains some/ all of being older, socially conservative (anti immigration, gay marriage, abortion, climate change etc) and poorly educated. These people are more easily swayed by a demonisation agenda and are entitled to vote UKIP because the alternatives from the mainstream parties aren't attractive to them.

But here we go again, UKIP is a symptom, and any underlying analysis on the demographic of its supporters misses the point.........if they are genuinely poorly educated and easily swayed by a demonisation agenda then that has always been the case; no one was castigating these individuals when they were voting for mainstream parties in previous elections.......it's only now.

But this is not a binary issue about UKIP, discontent with the EU is everywhere, in Italy a party lead by a comedian is due to get 25% of the vote.

The real hard truth is that the EU is failing, and it has to change. The likely (and planned) change is actually for more EU and less national sovereignty. From today's Guardian no less.....

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/10/what-can-save-the-european-union

Blind optimism in the future is not the answer..............neither is shallow mudslinging.

 

[El Presidente]

But here we go again, UKIP is a symptom, and any underlying analysis on the demographic of its supporters misses the point.........if they are genuinely poorly educated and easily swayed by a demonisation agenda then that has always been the case; no one was castigating these individuals when they were voting for mainstream parties in previous elections.......it's only now.

But this is not a binary issue about UKIP, discontent with the EU is everywhere, in Italy a party lead by a comedian is due to get 25% of the vote.

The real hard truth is that the EU is failing, and it has to change. The likely (and planned) change is actually for more EU and less national sovereignty. From today's Guardian no less.....

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/10/what-can-save-the-european-union

Blind optimism in the future is not the answer..............neither is shallow mudslinging.

I'm not castigating them though.

 

[WATFORD zero]

But you must accept that a party who campaign to get MEPs elected to a parliament where they cannot instigate their main policy, whilst their leader refuses to stand in an election to the government that can push through their main policy isn't going to appeal to the most intelligent in society ?

I agree that there are major changes that are needed in the EU but stamping my feet and cutting off my nose to spite my face doesn't really appeal.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

But you must accept that a party who campaign to get MEPs elected to a parliament where they cannot instigate their main policy, whilst their leader refuses to stand in an election to the government that can push through their main policy isn't going to appeal to the most intelligent in society ?

I agree that there are major changes that are needed in the EU but stamping my feet and cutting off my nose to spite my face doesn't really appeal.

Although he was in a no win situation with the by-election. Labour, Lib Dems and the Tories rightly get slagged off for parachuting in candidates for elections - people want someone to vote for that has a connection with the area they want to represent. The "he hasn't got the balls" accusations from the 3 main parties were pathetic especially when Labour cynically lied about a referendum on Lisborn and neither party leader had the guts to debate the EU with UKIP ( and Clegg has to take some credit for doing so ). Strange how Cowardly Cameron suddenly wants to hold a debate ?

 

[WATFORD zero]

Although he was in a no win situation with the by-election. Labour, Lib Dems and the Tories rightly get slagged off for parachuting in candidates for elections - people want someone to vote for that has a connection with the area they want to represent. The "he hasn't got the balls" accusations from the 3 main parties were pathetic especially when Labour cynically lied about a referendum on Lisborn and neither party leader had the guts to debate the EU with UKIP ( and Clegg has to take some credit for doing so ). Strange how Cowardly Cameron suddenly wants to hold a debate ?

But it is still as ridiculous as me wanting to change the British tax system and standing in the French elections. He has never stood for election in a vote that could effect membership of the EU. Some people with lower morals than Nigel himself might suggest that it is because he doesn't want to give up his MEP salary and expenses to stand in an election where he could actually do what he claims he wants to do.

 

[The Spanish]

The popularity amongst over 65s is quite a telling point don't you think?

These people are from the generations that took part in the fight (or grew up with people that did) to maintain this country's independence in the face of a fascist power that was dominating Europe.

The greatest irony is that these souls are now being castigated as nazis and racists for having the temerity to vote for a Democratic Party by people from generations who never even took part in that struggle.

Lest we forget? Don't make laugh.

ironically the generation sneering at them is the one obsessed with pointless minutes silences and mock grief, in the absence of any genuine national trauma, or need for commemoration of it, of their own.

 

[The Spanish]

UKIP are a rag bag of loony Tories that advocate Fracking Ponzi, xenophobia and tax haven business deals. They have nothing to offer ordinary citizens whatsoever.

http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...great-british-fruitcakes-bake-off-stewart-lee

a link to a stewart lee article in the guardian. seriously?

 

[Kevlar]

I think it is right to point out UKIP's very right wing other policies.
but in truth they are a one policy party exiting the EU
and many on the left including me share that policy
how to tackle UKIP ?
have an in out referendum and they will fade into history

 

[LargeHadronZugzwang]

a link to a stewart lee article in the guardian. seriously?

Would you prefer a link to the Daily Mail?