[Football] So why has this team managed to do what no other England team has done in 55 years?

[lawros left foot]

Taking the knee.

Why didn’t we start doing it 50 years ago.

 

[Pavilionaire]

I think these are all important factors:

1. The establishment of St George's Park in 2012 - from that moment on English football had a base at which all ages have come through. That gets younger players comfortable representing England.

2. Southgate has chosen almost exclusively from players that have come through England youth, U17, U19, U21 age groups, so are familiar with summer tournament football and how to look after themselves all year round.

3. Southgate has stuck with a core of players whom he trusts implicitly. The rest of the team see this. There are very few seasoned pros outside of the core group; the second string are mainly young and will be the in the 1st XI of the future. The exceptions are Coady and Mings but even Coady came through the ranks at England. I think Southgate likes Mings because he plays at Southgate's old club in his old position and has a left foot; better candidates like Dunk, Tarkowski and White did not play for England U17/U19/U21 or Villa.

4. At their clubs this England team have grown up playing alongside and against the world's best from an early age. They are also coached by some of the world's best coaches. There is less fear of the opposition.

 

[Eeyore]

I think it's probably due to finally adopting the political ideologies of Karl Marx

Even Ms Patel seems suddenly converted. Having said folk have the right to boo, and calling it political gesturing, a picture appeared in Twitter of her enthusiastically supporting the team.

Of course, it won't be coming home as it will be detained in the first safe country it enters. So that'll be Italy.

 

[Brovion]

Even Ms Patel seems suddenly converted. Having said folk have the right to boo, and calling it political gesturing, a picture appeared in Twitter of her enthusiastically supporting the team.

Of course, it won't be coming home as it will be detained in the first safe country it enters. So that'll be Italy.

Naa. It'll get to Calais, find it can't stowaway on a lorry so will be drowned trying to cross the Channel in a rubber dinghy.

 

[drew]

A refreshing absence of WAGs has helped. Great that the players have a home life - but too often at big tournaments this has become blurred with their professional lives.

Don't miss the likes of Rebekah Vardy and Collen Rooney being on the England scene.

But I would suggest that is due to circumstances rather than by design. The pandemic has meant the team have had to be in a bubble. Do you think the wives would have been kept at out had this been a normal year?

 

[Stat Brother]

Naa. It'll get to Calais, find it can't stowaway on a lorry so will be drowned trying to cross the Channel in a rubber dinghy.

While we all stand on the white cliffs of Dover sticking 2 fingers up to Europe, while simultaneously patting ourselves on the back for being superior in every way.

 

[Happy Exile]

I think Southgate knows what he's good at (management of people) and what he's not good at, and being a humble chap has assembled a great team of experts around him to plug the gaps in his own ability. He clearly still has to be the ultimate decision maker, but a lot of what I've read and heard about him since the World Cup suggests his biggest coups are being human with the players and then accepting expertise of others makes him stronger and his decisions better, rather than viewing taking on board the wisdom of others as somehow diminishing his input.

 

[Marshy]

A very handy draw for one. We have not played a decent side other than Germany and they are a poor version currently.

I am reserving judgement until the final is over.

This I am hoping will age well..... I think we are going to get taken apart by Italy on Sunday.

 

[Stat Brother]

A very handy draw for one. We have not played a decent side other than Germany and they are a poor version currently.

I'm still waiting for a reply from any of 'you lot'.

Are you saying England only leave tournament football when they play good team?
Were it for the eventual winners knocking England out, then 'we' would have won X, Y and Z tournaments.

Is that what you're implying?

If so that's far far removed from any memory I have.


My thoughts on England is they are quite capable of being knocked out by anybody (usually themselves) so the fact they haven't this time is very little to do with the calibre of the opposition.

 

[FatSuperman]

Germans were poor. Previous teams would have stuffed us.

Oh come on. You know that the best teams often don't win knockout tournaments. Greece were never the best team in 2004, but won each knockout game 1-0. Squad togetherness is massive.

 

[JBizzle]

A very handy draw for one. We have not played a decent side other than Germany and they are a poor version currently.

I am reserving judgement until the final is over.

This I am hoping will age well..... I think we are going to get taken apart by Italy on Sunday.

Absolutely, and we have no history of slipping up in major tournaments to so called lesser teams like Croatia (1-2 in 2018), Finland (0-1 in 2016), Costa Rica (0-0 to go out in the group in 2014), Albania (0-0 in 2010), Romania (2-3 to go out in the group in 2000), all of Euro 88 and 92...

 

[We're the Stripes]

I think these are all important factors:

1. The establishment of St George's Park in 2012 - from that moment on English football had a base at which all ages have come through. That gets younger players comfortable representing England.

2. Southgate has chosen almost exclusively from players that have come through England youth, U17, U19, U21 age groups, so are familiar with summer tournament football and how to look after themselves all year round.

3. Southgate has stuck with a core of players whom he trusts implicitly. The rest of the team see this. There are very few seasoned pros outside of the core group; the second string are mainly young and will be the in the 1st XI of the future. The exceptions are Coady and Mings but even Coady came through the ranks at England. I think Southgate likes Mings because he plays at Southgate's old club in his old position and has a left foot; better candidates like Dunk, Tarkowski and White did not play for England U17/U19/U21 or Villa.

4. At their clubs this England team have grown up playing alongside and against the world's best from an early age. They are also coached by some of the world's best coaches. There is less fear of the opposition.

You make some good points but I can't get on board with the bits highlighted. Completely undermines everything Southgate's building to suggest he's picking a player because he played for one of his old clubs. Why on earth did he take so long to call up Grealish if he supposedly shows such favouritism towards Villa players?

 

[Thunder Bolt]

I think it's probably due to finally adopting the political ideologies of Karl Marx

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/s...ndon-sterlingrad-if-england-win-euros-280566/

 

[vagabond]

A very handy draw for one. We have not played a decent side other than Germany and they are a poor version currently.

I am reserving judgement until the final is over.

This I am hoping will age well..... I think we are going to get taken apart by Italy on Sunday.

Iceland.

The draw shouldn’t be used to devalue Southgate and England’s achievements. We’ve struggled to beat all these teams before. And Germany are hardly poor. Another day they’d have easily scored against us, 1-1 different game. And the Denmark match was a battle and a half. Hardly a walkover.

Not just you, but does seem to be a new trend I’ve noticed, whenever we win… the team we beat is always poor.

 

[Nitram]

Home advantage, all the best teams in other side of the draw and luck, some very good forwards and lots of talent in depth.

 

[Napper]

We've genuinely been very unlucky in most previous tournaments.

I think the 3 qualifying and having Croatia first game helped. The jeopardy wasn't as much as previous tournaments and the way we approached that game was perfect. That then gave us a solid foundation to then build the momentum which snow balled due to home advantage. The draw with Scotland at the time was seen as poor but another clean sheet gave us more confidence in the one area that everyone thought we may struggle.

Against the germans , the luck was there with the one on one miss .

Being technically better has made it more of a level playing field. With pretty much every england team when the pressure increased the default setting was to lose the ball and go deep and long. Being technically as good as most nations has changed all that now.

I hope that what we learn from this is the tournament really starts in the knock outs. The stuff before it is all about arriving at them with in the most conservative way possible.

Tournament management , step forward Gareth Southgate.

We have the tools now - we just have to use them correctly

 

[pasty]

I hope that what we learn from this is the tournament really starts in the knock outs. The stuff before it is all about arriving at them with in the most conservative way possible.

I think the management and the team understand that, we just need the media and fans to understand it as well now. Yes, it would have been marvellous to absolutely stuff Scotland, but in the grand scheme of things, not losing was far more important.

 

[Uter]

Iceland.

The draw shouldn’t be used to devalue Southgate and England’s achievements. We’ve struggled to beat all these teams before. And Germany are hardly poor. Another day they’d have easily scored against us, 1-1 different game. And the Denmark match was a battle and a half. Hardly a walkover.

Not just you, but does seem to be a new trend I’ve noticed, whenever we win… the team we beat is always poor.

Denmark are ranked 10th in the world by FIFA. They are no pushovers and have a very good record over the last couple of years.

Clearly luck has a big bearing on individual knock-out competitions, but Southgate has guided England to at least the semi final of 3 of the 4 competitions he has been in charge for. It's getting less and less credible to keep pinning that on good fortune.

Maybe the simplest explanation is he's a good manager with a very good team.

People with an antipathy towards something will always rejoice in that things failure and seek to de-legitimise any success. Human nature.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I agree with the praise for GS, but also... many of the other teams are poor. Germany just a shadow, Spain?*, Portugal weak, Belgium??, France overrated, Italy...hmmm let's see. I know I know... you can only beat what's in front of you, but for me it's been a poor tournament that we may win...ohhh perhaps I'm on the wrong thread . Sorry guys, not feeling well today, plus my wife's Ukrainian and I'm 1/8th Italian...a bit messed up in the head!

Ukraine certainly have the fittest-women-picked-out-by-the-tv-cameras trophy in the bag? I know there is still one game to go but I don’t think Italy, and certainly not England, will win this now? Please congratulate the wife.

 

[Marshy]

Iceland.

The draw shouldn’t be used to devalue Southgate and England’s achievements. We’ve struggled to beat all these teams before. And Germany are hardly poor. Another day they’d have easily scored against us, 1-1 different game. And the Denmark match was a battle and a half. Hardly a walkover.

Not just you, but does seem to be a new trend I’ve noticed, whenever we win… the team we beat is always poor.

I know what your saying, and no international fixture is easy, but there is no denying our route has been as good as its likely to get, much like our world cup was.

I think we can play much better than we have so far, so that fills me with confidence.