[Misc] Sewage in the sea

[Baldseagull]

[tweet]1561952712417222661[/tweet]

Gove is like our rivers, regularly full of shit.

 

[Questions]

They didn’t when people were crapping in takeaway boxes last summer in Bournemouth.

Do you think they bought the takeaway just for the box Herr T ?

 

[CHAPPERS]

I know you are joking but this will not happen. To sort out this mess, like the other messes e.g. NHS, schools, public transport etc, it will cost money and the UK does not like paying taxes. Until there is a big change in mindset you will muddle along forever being promised everything will be sorted by making everything more efficient and reducing waste.

Finally a good idea. Everyone stop sh1tting. So simple.

 

[Questions]

Finally a good idea. Everyone stop sh1tting. So simple.

I wish I could today……… but I’m into homemade chilli jam at the moment

 

[Thunder Bolt]

This is from 2021 but Peter Kyle is spot on.

[tweet]1562094463815766021[/tweet]

 

[Eeyore]

Isn't there a song about this

Good old sewage by the sea...
Good old sewage by the sea....
Good old sewage by the sea....

Your piss and your stools, will swim in them all at...

 

[Questions]

This is from 2021 but Peter Kyle is spot on.

[tweet]1562094463815766021[/tweet]

The sooner he is prime minister the better

 

[sant andreu]

As well as focusing on the MPs, this article starts naming and shaming the water company CEOs making big money for giving us sh¡t all.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/aug/23/water-sewage-britain-shores-politicians-ceos?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

"A sarcastically warm welcome to public life, then, to Sarah Bentley, boss of Thames Water. Come on out, Sarah! Joining her are CEO of Anglian Water, Peter Simpson, and Yorkshire Water’s Nicola Shaw. Don’t be shy, guys. A slow clap too for Wessex Water’s Colin Skellett, Steve Mogford of United Utilities, South West Water’s Susan Davy, Southern Water’s Lawrence Gosden, Severn Trent’s Liv Garfield and Northumbrian Water’s Heidi Mottram. Welcome, all! We do hope to be spraying much, much more unsolicited content about you across the pages and airwaves over the coming months, the better to showcase your very British success stories. And don’t let’s forget David Black, chief exec of Ofwat, which – despite the increasingly deafening public outcry – can’t even be bothered using its full range of powers to sanction water company directors via their remuneration packages. What are you waiting for, David?!"

 

[BrightonCottager]

The overnight storms are likely to trigger storm outfalls . Southern Water Beachbuoy site showing unverified releases affecting Southwick and Shoreham Beach. Surface Water Outfalls near King Alfred and Hove Lagoon will probably also go off.

 

[Half Time Pies]

The overnight storms are likely to trigger storm outfalls . Southern Water Beachbuoy site showing unverified releases affecting Southwick and Shoreham Beach.View attachment 151155 Surface Water Outfalls near King Alfred and Hove Lagoon will probably also go off.

I see a lot of these are confirmed now, some discharging for over 3 hours! Great time for it, in the lead up to a Bank Holiday weekend at the end of August!

 

[sydney]

I wish I could today……… but I’m into homemade chilli jam at the moment

have some bread with it

 

[zefarelly]

I was going to go for a swim this afternoon, but yet another massive shitshow. C***s

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

I was going to go for a swim this afternoon, but yet another massive shitshow. C***s

Well ..... Yes it is

 

[Wozza]

Due down to Bexhill this weekend. No point checking to see if it's beach weather.

 

[Mental Lental]

Good old sewage in the sea.....
Good old sewage in the sea.....
Tell them all we're sure that we voted for......
Sewage in the sea.

 

[Guy Fawkes]

Some context to my earlier post

Southern Water admitted dumping unpermitted raw sewage multiple times between 2010-15. (pre-Brexit) and they were fined £90m for this in 2021.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-kent-57777935

During periods of heavy rain, water companies are permitted to divert untreated waste water away from treatment plants, discharging sewage straight into the environment to prevent sewers backing up.

However, the Environment Agency found that on thousands of occasions untreated sewage had left Southern Water sites through this route during periods of lower rainfall.

Directing sewage straight into rivers and seas improved the quality of treated water leaving the works, which is regularly tested and can lead to heavy fines if standards fall, the court heard.

Mr Justice Johnson said the offences had been motivated by a desire to "focus the company's attention on those metrics that increase its income, disregarding its wider compliance obligations".

Chief executive Ian McAulay, who was appointed in 2017, was in court on Friday alongside chairman Keith Lough, who joined in 2019.

After the hearing, Mr McAulay said: "We have heard what the judge has said today and will reflect closely on the sentence and his remarks.

"He has rightly put the environment front and centre which is what matters to all of us. "

Mr McAulay said the fine would not affect customers' bills or infrastructure investments, with shareholders due to bear the cost.

Basically you'd hope that the actions of the court case and public opinion will have focused minds in that (and other water companies) to tackle this issue as a priority ever since (hence my asking what they were doing to tackle it, timeframe, etc...)


I've also found this article which was published after my post and covers a lot of what i was asking about too.
Why is raw sewage pumped into the sea?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-62631320
It covered why, how often, health risks, and what's being done

it also includes a part where it states that there are times when the EA agree and permit legal spills of raw sewage into the rivers and seas

It also covers the bill that was voted down and the likely reasons why, the cost of the proposal to stop all untreated raw sewage (including rainwater only drainage systems) discharges had an estimated cost of between £350bn and £600bn) and which would have added between £595 and £999 to household bills per year, and it would be very disruptive and difficult to deliver

In March, the government said it wanted to tackle sewage pollution which included reducing "most damaging" storm overflows by 75% by 2035, and 80% of all sewage discharges by 2050.

- basically it would take time to deal with it and that spills of this nature are normal industry practice in the event of heavy rainfall.

Recent public opinion on this subject since this became a hot topic is that there should be zero spills, that the problem is very cheap and quick to fix and should be completed by the time of the next heavy rain but that is wholly unrealistic so public opinion needed to be tempered

Going from my own knowledge, older buildings used soakaways to take rainwater that fell on roofs, but more recent builds connected that rainwater and added it to the sewer system to be taken away and treated yet the sewer system is unlikely to have increased in capacity to counter this (from pipes to storage tanks to treatment works). A move away from directing rainwater away from that system, or finding a practical way to delay it would be one avenue to explore. is there new legislation to require all new builds to use some sort of soakaway or similar scheme to tackle rainwater, and if not, should there be?

Reading some of the comments on here and elsewhere it sounds like the rainwater needs to be treated, even if it is kept away from household waste that needs to be treated.

1 thought that occurred to me is that we use fresh drinking water for things like toilets, and why isn't rainwater captured and used? help limit fresh water use (especially useful during hot spells / droughts) and limit damage to the environment by reducing what needs to be removed from rivers, etc to be treated and turned into fresh drinking water as well as helping to reduce water into the sewage system when there is heavy rain as some of it could be captured for that use instead (although not sure how practical it may be, but may be an option to consider for new builds?)

All this current hysteria and jumping on the band waggon shows a lack of understanding about how complex something like this may be to deal with, yet you know that he next time there is heavy rain, and permitted discharges, there will be those up in arms about it and calling for heads

And finally, when i was young and before the water companies were privatised, there used to be raw sewage pumped into the sea as i remember swimming and turds, etc floating by so it is in no way a new thing that has just started to happen because of (insert favourite subject to blame - privatisation, Brexit, Political party, etc) It's been going on for a very long time but has only really entered the public consciousness recently 9something we see with many other hot topics when they become flavour of the month)

i think it's important to gain as much knowledge and to try to develop an understanding of an issue then judge it but that goes against the norm nowadays where a lot just read a headline and have already make their minds up and are quick to anger

 

[Baldseagull]

Some context to my earlier post

Southern Water admitted dumping unpermitted raw sewage multiple times between 2010-15. (pre-Brexit) and they were fined £90m for this in 2021.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-kent-57777935



Basically you'd hope that the actions of the court case and public opinion will have focused minds in that (and other water companies) to tackle this issue as a priority ever since (hence my asking what they were doing to tackle it, timeframe, etc...)


I've also found this article which was published after my post and covers a lot of what i was asking about too.
Why is raw sewage pumped into the sea?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-62631320
It covered why, how often, health risks, and what's being done

it also includes a part where it states that there are times when the EA agree and permit legal spills of raw sewage into the rivers and seas

It also covers the bill that was voted down and the likely reasons why, the cost of the proposal to stop all untreated raw sewage (including rainwater only drainage systems) discharges had an estimated cost of between £350bn and £600bn) and which would have added between £595 and £999 to household bills per year, and it would be very disruptive and difficult to deliver

In March, the government said it wanted to tackle sewage pollution which included reducing "most damaging" storm overflows by 75% by 2035, and 80% of all sewage discharges by 2050.

- basically it would take time to deal with it and that spills of this nature are normal industry practice in the event of heavy rainfall.

Recent public opinion on this subject since this became a hot topic is that there should be zero spills, that the problem is very cheap and quick to fix and should be completed by the time of the next heavy rain but that is wholly unrealistic so public opinion needed to be tempered

Going from my own knowledge, older buildings used soakaways to take rainwater that fell on roofs, but more recent builds connected that rainwater and added it to the sewer system to be taken away and treated yet the sewer system is unlikely to have increased in capacity to counter this (from pipes to storage tanks to treatment works). A move away from directing rainwater away from that system, or finding a practical way to delay it would be one avenue to explore. is there new legislation to require all new builds to use some sort of soakaway or similar scheme to tackle rainwater, and if not, should there be?

Reading some of the comments on here and elsewhere it sounds like the rainwater needs to be treated, even if it is kept away from household waste that needs to be treated.

1 thought that occurred to me is that we use fresh drinking water for things like toilets, and why isn't rainwater captured and used? help limit fresh water use (especially useful during hot spells / droughts) and limit damage to the environment by reducing what needs to be removed from rivers, etc to be treated and turned into fresh drinking water as well as helping to reduce water into the sewage system when there is heavy rain as some of it could be captured for that use instead (although not sure how practical it may be, but may be an option to consider for new builds?)

All this current hysteria and jumping on the band waggon shows a lack of understanding about how complex something like this may be to deal with, yet you know that he next time there is heavy rain, and permitted discharges, there will be those up in arms about it and calling for heads

And finally, when i was young and before the water companies were privatised, there used to be raw sewage pumped into the sea as i remember swimming and turds, etc floating by so it is in no way a new thing that has just started to happen because of (insert favourite subject to blame - privatisation, Brexit, Political party, etc) It's been going on for a very long time but has only really entered the public consciousness recently 9something we see with many other hot topics when they become flavour of the month)

i think it's important to gain as much knowledge and to try to develop an understanding of an issue then judge it but that goes against the norm nowadays where a lot just read a headline and have already make their minds up and are quick to anger

Most new builds today do not connect surface water to sewers, the exception is where the ground is unsuitable for soakaways because of a high water table or heavy clay ground that does not drain. Building on flood plains is generally not going to be good for this.

We have had plenty of time to have got on top of this, but we haven't, and I believe the reason is that it is cheaper to be taken to court and pay the fines than fix the problem.

Edit: To add, when we did not treat sewage and just piped it 5 miles offshore, connecting rainwater services to sewers was beneficial in diluting the sewage I guess. Today, with anaerobic digestion of sewage sludge, water companies become energy companies by creating bio methane. It is not just polluting rivers and the sea, it is a wasted resource.

 

[Seasider78]

Good old sewage in the sea.....
Good old sewage in the sea.....
Tell them all we're sure that we voted for......
Sewage in the sea.

Coming down the shoreham outfall to see the Brighton Faeces

 

[portlock seagull]

One of her first acts as PM may be to issue the Government's plan for reducing sewage spills - due out in early September.

You just know the consultation period will last longer than any government, and nothing will be done.

 

[Bodian]

Going from my own knowledge, older buildings used soakaways to take rainwater that fell on roofs, but more recent builds connected that rainwater and added it to the sewer system to be taken away and treated yet the sewer system is unlikely to have increased in capacity to counter this (from pipes to storage tanks to treatment works). A move away from directing rainwater away from that system, or finding a practical way to delay it would be one avenue to explore. is there new legislation to require all new builds to use some sort of soakaway or similar scheme to tackle rainwater, and if not, should there be?



1 thought that occurred to me is that we use fresh drinking water for things like toilets, and why isn't rainwater captured and used? help limit fresh water use (especially useful during hot spells / droughts) and limit damage to the environment by reducing what needs to be removed from rivers, etc to be treated and turned into fresh drinking water as well as helping to reduce water into the sewage system when there is heavy rain as some of it could be captured for that use instead (although not sure how practical it may be, but may be an option to consider for new builds?)



And finally, when i was young and before the water companies were privatised, there used to be raw sewage pumped into the sea as i remember swimming and turds, etc floating by so it is in no way a new thing that has just started to happen because of (insert favourite subject to blame - privatisation, Brexit, Political party, etc) It's been going on for a very long time but has only really entered the public consciousness recently 9something we see with many other hot topics when they become flavour of the month)

1. One of the issues with keeping surface water and sewage separate is that the sewage needs decent level of surface water to keep it 'moving along'.

2. Some new builds now have rainwater storage tanks under the garden or house - which is used as 'grey water' for the toilets, outside taps for garden and so on. Trouble with this is that it's difficult to retro-fit, as it needs two sets of piping.

3. Yes - I well remember swimming off Southwick Beach in the early/mid 1980s, then the next day's Daily Mirror had a front page aerial photo showing polluted beaches - clearly showing the outflow pipe and a sort of horrid colour spreading out from it back towards the very beach where I had spent the day bathing and listening to Malcolm Marshall ripping through our batting once again.