[Politics] Russia invades Ukraine (24/02/2022)

[raymondo]

Ukraine will never do a deal.

The rest of the sane world will up their efforts and fill the void left by the U.S.

Trump will stop all aid and arms, blame Ukraine and call them warmongers, them forget all about the situation in Europe.

If Ukraine concedes territory Putin will march his armies of darkness across Europe.

By not backing down Zelenskyy is protecting Europe and well as his own people.

I don’t think Trumps’ input into the war is of much consequence either way, tbh.

Here's hoping support continues for Ukraine

 

[raymondo]

Meanwhile... Not sure it's a hit, but this is on the Caspian Sea

 

[Eric the meek]

Meanwhile... Not sure it's a hit, but this is on the Caspian Sea

Caspian Sea eh?

Whisper it quietly, but a Trump win could be just the propellant that Ukraine needs to get this war over the line.

I wouldn't rule out their beating of Russia almost on their own. Slava Ukraini.

 

[raymondo]

Caspian Sea eh?

Whisper it quietly, but a Trump win could be just the propellant that Ukraine needs to get this war over the line.

I wouldn't rule out their beating of Russia almost on their own. Slava Ukraini.

I have to say it's quite joyful to watch those drones fly in to their target, and Russia's inability to stop them.

 

[Machiavelli]

We all need to process the result.

Given the result, and the need for the EU to step up, I wish with all my heart that Britain were still at that EU table.

We need to be in those meetings.

You make it sound as though the EU is a super-state with a foreign policy and an army.

 

[raymondo]

You make it sound as though the EU is a super-state with a foreign policy and an army.

Macron wanted a European army...he needed some support maybe.

 

[Eric the meek]

You make it sound as though the EU is a super-state with a foreign policy and an army.

Discussions around security, outside the NATO remit, will be held at that EU table, which I would prefer HM Government to be a) aware of, b) make contributions to and c) be a party to any joint decisions which affect UK national security.

 

[Eric the meek]

I have to say it's quite joyful to watch those drones fly in to their target, and Russia's inability to stop them.

Paul Warburg cites this as a fundamental reason why Russia has not used any nukes - because it knows its air defences are crap, and they will not stop any nukes lobbed in return.

 

[Machiavelli]

Discussions around security, outside the NATO remit, will be held at that EU table, which I would prefer HM Government to be a) aware of, b) make contributions to and c) be a party to any joint decisions which affect UK national security.

Depends on which of the EU's institutions you're referring to. If it's the Council, remember that there will be representatives of Hungary there so the extent to which they're generating strategies that Putin isn't privy to is open to question. If it's the parliament, then it's an open discussion. To the best of my knowledge, the Commission doesn't engage in such topics.

 

[Eric the meek]

Depends on which of the EU's institutions you're referring to. If it's the Council, remember that there will be representatives of Hungary there so the extent to which they're generating strategies that Putin isn't privy to is open to question. If it's the parliament, then it's an open discussion. To the best of my knowledge, the Commission doesn't engage in such topics.

The fact that Hungary may be passing on info to Russia, is another discussion, and does not detract from the value of Britain being party to EU security considerations.

When Russian agents deployed Novichok on UK soil, our government at the time, even though in the midst of leaving the EU, shared its findings with our European counterparts. Today, being outside the EU, if the situation were reversed, we are now reliant on the kindness of strangers to share their security information with us.

This is not ideal.

 

[Triggaaar]

When Russian agents deployed Novichok on UK soil, our government at the time, even though in the midst of leaving the EU, shared its findings with our European counterparts. Today, being outside the EU, if the situation were reversed, we are now reliant on the kindness of strangers to share their security information with us.

The EU are not strangers, any more than the US are strangers. We should be sharing security info with our allies.

We know who those allies are, and they don't include Hungary or Serbia.

 

[Triggaaar]

 

[Eric the meek]

The EU are not strangers, any more than the US are strangers. We should be sharing security info with our allies.

We know who those allies are, and they don't include Hungary or Serbia.

Or Slovakia. We did share our information on the Novichok expedition, and it was right that we did.

But there is no obligation on an EU member to share security information with us, if they are not in NATO.

 

[GT49er]

The fact that Hungary may be passing on info to Russia, is another discussion, and does not detract from the value of Britain being party to EU security considerations.

When Russian agents deployed Novichok on UK soil, our government at the time, even though in the midst of leaving the EU, shared its findings with our European counterparts. Today, being outside the EU, if the situation were reversed, we are now reliant on the kindness of strangers to share their security information with us.

This is not ideal.

We left the EU. That didn't - and hasn't - stopped us working with the EU, or the EU co-operating with us when there is a mutual interest - and right now there is! We're still geographically part of Europe, and friends with the nation states therein.
Just not with Hungary, perhaps.

 

[GT49er]

Or Slovakia. We did share our information on the Novichok expedition, and it was right that we did.

But there is no obligation on an EU member to share security information with us, if they are not in NATO.

Mostly (the ones that are big enough to matter anyway) they are in NATO - so what's the problem (apart from f***in' Russia)?

 

[raymondo]

Caspian Sea eh?

Whisper it quietly, but a Trump win could be just the propellant that Ukraine needs to get this war over the line.

I wouldn't rule out their beating of Russia almost on their own. Slava Ukraini.

Here's more detail on the hit in the Caspian Sea, from Joe Bloggs. Shows one drone being hit by small arms fire, and the one (at least) getting through. Also map, distances etc. Just the first three minutes.
Not that video

 

[Eric the meek]

Mostly (the ones that are big enough to matter anyway) they are in NATO - so what's the problem (apart from f***in' Russia)?

Mostly? The ones that matter? What are these filtering decisions based on? Have you shared them with UK security services?

Are you aware of any Russian activities off the west coast of Ireland? Did the Irish let us know about them, or did we find out about them another way?

 

[peterward]

Massive news. Olaf Scholz of Germany who has been weak and indecisive/appeasing re Ukraine, coalition government has just collapsed.

If Merz of CDU (Merkels party) who are largest opposition and ahead in most polls, becomes head of new coalition, he is massively pro Ukraine and says he will allow Taurus cruise missiles and long range strikes.

Risk is if Afd get in, the fascist party who will cut off Ukraine.

German government coalition collapses as Scholz sacks Finance Minister Lindner

Christian Lindner’s liberals are making demands for economic reforms that are hard for other coalition members to accept.

www.politico.eu

 

[Eric the meek]

Not that video

It happens to the best of us (and me as well). Last night, I posted a video of a beaver eating cabbage on the US election thread.

 

[GT49er]

Mostly? The ones that matter? What are these filtering decisions based on? Have you shared them with UK security services?

Are you aware of any Russian activities off the west coast of Ireland? Did the Irish let us know about them, or did we find out about them another way?

No change since WWII as far as Ireland is concerned then - as always, ABE.