[Politics] Russia invades Ukraine (24/02/2022)

[Eric the meek]

France would be my reckoning.

As long as they can take three hours off for lunch during any conflict.

I know. I'll get my coat.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

So let's support all efforts made to help Ukraine, and then worry about whether or not to keep Johnson as the next election approaches.

It doesn't help when his sister is prepared to hand Ukraine over to Russia. 'I could live with that'.

[tweet]1508151165363658757[/tweet]

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

re Zelenky and Macron

Again, smart play from Zelenky to heap pressure on Macron in an election year. Supporting Ukraine is a popular cause and he is doing something unpopular.

Macron now has to be seen to act

 

[vegster]

Sounds like multiple sources saying that the Russians are counter attacking NW and East of Kyiv. Heavy artillery incoming.

 

[Seagull27]

So let's support all efforts made to help Ukraine, and then worry about whether or not to keep Johnson as the next election approaches.

I very begrudgingly agree. Which is very unfortunate, as I'd like nothing more than for Johnson to fall on his sword and this gives him a way out of the party stuff - that will all be forgotten about now, and the Russia report will not be released while Johnson is in power, especially now.

But now is not the time.

 

[heathgate]

re Zelenky and Macron

Again, smart play from Zelenky to heap pressure on Macron in an election year. Supporting Ukraine is a popular cause and he is doing something unpopular.

Macron now has to be seen to act

He cannot win here really, his military is just leaving Mali after a fairly rugged encounter with Jihadist extremists there,.... years of French involvement has barely scratched the surface, casualties, poor leadership and political constraints have meant others are now replacing them in country,... UK is sending 300. French society isn't keen on another military adventure... they have a decent military, but lack ambition or motivation to carry it through,... public opinion is firmly anti-war,.... even if it essential.

 

[Randy McNob]

It doesn't help when his sister is prepared to hand Ukraine over to Russia. 'I could live with that'.

[tweet]1508151165363658757[/tweet]

Blimey, didn't know the whole Johnson family were in Putin's pocket. Nothing suprises me anymore

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

He cannot win here really, his military is just leaving Mali after a fairly rugged encounter with Jihadist extremists there,.... years of French involvement has barely scratched the surface, casualties, poor leadership and political constraints have meant others are now replacing them in country,... UK is sending 300. French society isn't keen on another military adventure... they have a decent military, but lack ambition or motivation to carry it through,... public opinion is firmly anti-war,.... even if it essential.

Nobody is talking about France sending troops, just equipment. And every western government has some surpluses which they can send. France just choosing not to

 

[Baldseagull]

I very begrudgingly agree. Which is very unfortunate, as I'd like nothing more than for Johnson to fall on his sword and this gives him a way out of the party stuff - that will all be forgotten about now, and the Russia report will not be released while Johnson is in power, especially now.

But now is not the time.

It's out, been out 18 months or so, just with 175 redactions so not as revealing as we would like. Basic conclusion is UK Government and security services were blase about the risks posed by Russian interference, and lack of monitoring means we don't know to what extent their actions affected the Brexit result. Personally, given the narrow margin of decision, I think it hard to argue it was not decisive.
https://isc.independent.gov.uk/wp-c...6010-001_Russia-Report-v02-Web_Accessible.pdf

 

[British Bulldog]

It doesn't help when his sister is prepared to hand Ukraine over to Russia. 'I could live with that'.

[tweet]1508151165363658757[/tweet]

It's the only way the war can end, Russia can't take Ukraine without using Nukes, Ukraine cant defeat Russia without Nato getting involved, Russia won't allow Nato to be on it's border and Nato doesn't want Russia on it's border. The Berlin Wall will be rebuilt but further east this time and then there will be 2 no fly zones, 1 by Nato and 1 by Russia and we have Cold War part 2.

 

[British Bulldog]

Blimey this is a difficult question? https://twitter.com/InnaSovsun/status/1508390743228006400

 

[drew]

It's the only way the war can end, Russia can't take Ukraine without using Nukes, Ukraine cant defeat Russia without Nato getting involved, Russia won't allow Nato to be on it's border and Nato doesn't want Russia on it's border. The Berlin Wall will be rebuilt but further east this time and then there will be 2 no fly zones, 1 by Nato and 1 by Russia and we have Cold War part 2.

Where do you get the idea that NATO doesn't want Russia on it's border when Estonia and Latvia are both members but border Russia?

 

[drew]

Blimey this is a difficult question? https://twitter.com/InnaSovsun/status/1508390743228006400

Simple, draw a line from the Wash to the Seven estuary and they can have everything north of that!!!

 

[beorhthelm]

Blimey this is a difficult question? https://twitter.com/InnaSovsun/status/1508390743228006400

reckon its a lot easier than she thinks for different groups in different countries. while its not for us to say to Ukraine they should agree to, its not unrealistic to discuss this is likely the path, and a legitmate question. i dont see a route to peace that involves Russia coming away with less then they held before February.

 

[Triggaaar]

I very begrudgingly agree. Which is very unfortunate, as I'd like nothing more than for Johnson to fall on his sword and this gives him a way out of the party stuff - that will all be forgotten about now, and the Russia report will not be released while Johnson is in power, especially now.

But now is not the time.

Don't worry, there are a million and one things we can criticise Johnson for and I see no reason to stop that. Let's just do it on the other threads, and make it about his general leadership of this country, but not about his support of Ukraine.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

It doesn't help when his sister is prepared to hand Ukraine over to Russia. 'I could live with that'.

[tweet]1508151165363658757[/tweet]

It is clearly not the only possible outcome.

Frankly whether she could "live with that" or not is just self centered hubris.

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

Blimey this is a difficult question? https://twitter.com/InnaSovsun/status/1508390743228006400

Easy question difficult answer.

 

[Triggaaar]

It's the only way the war can end, Russia can't take Ukraine without using Nukes, Ukraine cant defeat Russia without Nato getting involved, Russia won't allow Nato to be on it's border and Nato doesn't want Russia on it's border. The Berlin Wall will be rebuilt but further east this time and then there will be 2 no fly zones, 1 by Nato and 1 by Russia and we have Cold War part 2.

I disagree. I'm not saying that you're suggestion cannot happen, but I disagree that it's the only way the war can end. Ukraine can't defeat Russia, but they don't have to. If the west continue sanctions against Russia, eventually they may decide that leaving Ukraine is what's best for Russia. And I disagree about NATO and Russia not allowing each other on their border - they already do!

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

[Tweet]1508201460487659528[/Tweet]

Interesting.

 

[Seaview Seagull]

Where do you get the idea that NATO doesn't want Russia on it's border when Estonia and Latvia are both members but border Russia?

Not forgetting Norway in the far north!