[Politics] Russia invades Ukraine (24/02/2022)

[raymondo]

 

[A1X]

Moscow’s on fire
Your defence is terrified…

 

[nicko31]

I think we should take this stuff about as seriously as Tucker Carlson

 

[Eric the meek]

*** Checks in to the war thread. Sees nothing is happening, so checks out again ***

 

[Eric the meek]

Remember this? I don't think this was just an act of bravado.

I think it was a statement of intent.

 

[raymondo]

View attachment 175259

Remember this? I don't think this was just an act of bravado.

I think it was a statement of intent.

I don't remember that... remind me please!

 

[Eric the meek]

I don't remember that... remind me please!

Unfortunately I don't remember when it first appeared, but I would guess soon after a Ukrainian success in warmer weather, maybe September/October?

In the light of subsequent events, I have come to see it as more than just a risky show of defiance. Holding the Ukrainian trident in Red Square, next to the Kremlin, was probably a message. Symbolic. A hint of things to come.

 

[raymondo]

Unfortunately I don't remember when it first appeared, but I would guess soon after a Ukrainian success in warmer weather, maybe September/October?

In the light of subsequent events, I have come to see it as more than just a risky show of defiance. Holding the Ukrainian trident in Red Square, next to the Kremlin, was probably a message. Symbolic. A hint of things to come.

Ok, got it thanks. So, having drone bombed a Moscow airport, the Kremlin might be in their targets soon.

 

[Mellotron]

I saw a program that the Russian economy has bot been decimated by western sanctions as expected and has been revived in a war economy.

Surely you cannot run an economy on a war footing forever?

 

[Eric the meek]

Surely you cannot run an economy on a war footing forever?

Not when the pesky Ukrainians are bombing your arms factories, no.

 

[sparkie]

Unfortunately I don't remember when it first appeared, but I would guess soon after a Ukrainian success in warmer weather, maybe September/October?

In the light of subsequent events, I have come to see it as more than just a risky show of defiance. Holding the Ukrainian trident in Red Square, next to the Kremlin, was probably a message. Symbolic. A hint of things to come.

The red and black is the traditional flag of the Ukrainian Insurgent Army. Red signifying the blood of the heros and black the Ukrainian earth.

 

[Eric the meek]

Ok, got it thanks. So, having drone bombed a Moscow airport, the Kremlin might be in their targets soon.

I took notice of something you highlighted a while back. I think it was in the context of long distance drone attacks by Ukraine to St. Petersburg and elsewhere.
You pointed out that there are many Ukrainian nationals who live in Russia (with the implication that maybe the drones didn't have to fly that far).

I've just googled it, and Wiki says 'The Russian census identified that there were more than 5,864,000 Ukrainians living in Russia in 2015'. Today, there are probably more, and they are probably angrier than they were in 2015.

Ukraine's tentacles are reaching deep inside Russia.

@sparkie, thank you for your comment - very relevant.

 

[schmunk]

Ukraine's testicles are reaching deep inside Russia's mouth.

FTFY.

 

[raymondo]

The red and black is the traditional flag of the Ukrainian Insurgent Army. Red signifying the blood of the heros and black the Ukrainian earth.

Thank you

 

[raymondo]

I took notice of something you highlighted a while back. I think it was in the context of long distance drone attacks by Ukraine to St. Petersburg and elsewhere.
You pointed out that there are many Ukrainian nationals who live in Russia (with the implication that maybe the drones didn't have to fly that far).

I've just googled it, and Wiki says 'The Russian census identified that there were more than 5,864,000 Ukrainians living in Russia in 2015'. Today, there are probably more, and they are probably angrier than they were in 2015.

Ukraine's tentacles are reaching deep inside Russia.

@sparkie, thank you for your comment - very relevant.

I dunno, could be more or less . I wonder how many went back to Ukraine after the invasion of Donbas and Crimea? I wonder what the job/ professional spread is of those millions of Ukrainians still in Russia? Manual? Infrastructure workers ()? Engineers? Medical professionals? Teachers?
I'm pretty sure Russia wouldn't be able to conscript them into their army; then again, if they want to see out the war in relative safety... neither would the males return to Ukraine to face possible conscription there.
Hopefully enough of them are an invisible army executing some of these attacks we see in Russia.
These complexities are something I haven't seen duscussed anywhere in the press.

 

[Eric the meek]

FTFY.

I dunno, could be more or less . I wonder how many went back to Ukraine after the invasion of Donbas and Crimea? I wonder what the job/ professional spread is of those millions of Ukrainians still in Russia? Manual? Infrastructure workers ()? Engineers? Medical professionals? Teachers?
I'm pretty sure Russia wouldn't be able to conscript them into their army; then again, if they want to see out the war in relative safety... neither would the males return to Ukraine to face possible conscription there.
Hopefully enough of them are an invisible army executing some of these attacks we see in Russia.
These complexities are something I haven't seen duscussed anywhere in the press.

I googled 'Ukrainians in Russia' but it isn't an easy read.

Ukrainians in Russia - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Ukrainians are spread widely across Russia, but there are a few agglomerations:

Kuban/Krasnodar (east of the Kerch bridge)
Moscow
St. Petersburg
Green Ukraine - Far Eastern Siberia
Grey Ukraine - Omsk, western Siberia
Yellow Ukraine - Lower Volga/Saratov

Just from memory, there is some correlation between these populations and where Ukrainian attacks have been reported so far. We had an oil refinery in Krasnodar go up just last night. The exception (IIRC) is far eastern Siberia.

 

[Commander]

I dunno, could be more or less . I wonder how many went back to Ukraine after the invasion of Donbas and Crimea? I wonder what the job/ professional spread is of those millions of Ukrainians still in Russia? Manual? Infrastructure workers ()? Engineers? Medical professionals? Teachers?
I'm pretty sure Russia wouldn't be able to conscript them into their army; then again, if they want to see out the war in relative safety... neither would the males return to Ukraine to face possible conscription there.
Hopefully enough of them are an invisible army executing some of these attacks we see in Russia.
These complexities are something I haven't seen duscussed anywhere in the press.

It’s a credit to the Ukrainians that we aren’t seeing terrorist attacks on civilians in the streets of Moscow. In fact, I think it’s a genuine surprise that we aren’t.

 

[Sirnormangall]

I dunno, could be more or less . I wonder how many went back to Ukraine after the invasion of Donbas and Crimea? I wonder what the job/ professional spread is of those millions of Ukrainians still in Russia? Manual? Infrastructure workers ()? Engineers? Medical professionals? Teachers?
I'm pretty sure Russia wouldn't be able to conscript them into their army; then again, if they want to see out the war in relative safety... neither would the males return to Ukraine to face possible conscription there.
Hopefully enough of them are an invisible army executing some of these attacks we see in Russia.
These complexities are something I haven't seen duscussed anywhere in the press.

I know it sounds very John Le Carre, but It wouldn’t surprise me if some of them had moved to Russia several years ago to wait and prepare for days like these - ‘sleepers’.

 

[beorhthelm]

Surely you cannot run an economy on a war footing forever?

of course not. its just the GDP goes up, not improving peoples lives. same happend during war, UK GDP rose significantly while people were on rations.
the trouble is most have underestimated Russian's tolerance of war economy conditions, they'll lump it a long time. and so with the Ukrainians.

 

[raymondo]

It’s a credit to the Ukrainians that we aren’t seeing terrorist attacks on civilians in the streets of Moscow. In fact, I think it’s a genuine surprise that we aren’t.

Yes, I agree. They do seem to blame the Russian leadership 100%.