[Politics] Russia invades Ukraine (24/02/2022)

[jcdenton08]

Yes, NATO members need to increase defence spending. For too long we’ve (European members of Nato) relied on the break up of the Soviet Union to justify defence reductions - and depended too much on the US.

Have to agree.

 

[Triggaaar]

I've been hoping for a video like this one. It is two days old, so predates the Munich Security Conference.

Listen carefully to Jason Jay Smart from 7:40.

The war - and the peace - are both about money.

For Trump to get the rare earths, which are principally in the Russian controlled territories, how does he expect to get them, if he doesn't give the Ukrainians the weapons they need to liberate those territories? He wants Europeans to pay for those weapons.

I love the comment "North Vietnam argued over the shape of the table in the Paris peace talks for 6 months. So I think we should start talking about what the table's going to look like."

(because Russia is losing, and it gets worse for them as the war continues)

 

[Sirnormangall]

I've been hoping for a video like this one. It is two days old, so predates the Munich Security Conference.

Listen carefully to Jason Jay Smart from 7:40.

The war - and the peace - are both about money.

For Trump to get the rare earths, which are principally in the Russian controlled territories, how does he expect to get them, if he doesn't give the Ukrainians the weapons they need to liberate those territories? He wants Europeans to pay for those weapons.

Maybe Putin has promised Trump the rare earths if Trump supports Russian retention of the territory.
(I keep telling myself to stop speculating on all this stuff - unsuccessfully)

 

[Triggaaar]

Maybe Putin has promised Trump the rare earths if Trump supports Russian retention of the territory.

That would be tantamount to the US having invaded Ukraine. Not a good look.

 

[A1X]

Starmer opening the door to "boots on the ground". This is a moment and a half.

 

[GT49er]

Maybe Putin has promised Trump the rare earths if Trump supports Russian retention of the territory.
(I keep telling myself to stop speculating on all this stuff - unsuccessfully)

Probably better if you stop trying to kid yourself it's only speculation!

That would be tantamount to the US having invaded Ukraine. Not a good look.

Not to a piece of shit like Trump, it's a bloody good look in his eyes. Lots of dollars to be made, many of which will doubtless find their way to a firm which Trump has a substantial stake in!

 

[lasvegan]

Probably better if you stop trying to kid yourself it's only speculation!

Not to a piece of shit like Trump, it's a bloody good look in his eyes. Lots of dollars to be made, many of which will doubtless find their way to a firm which Trump has a substantial stake in!

More likely that Zelenskyy has promised Trump rare earth materials in exchange for the billions of dollars we have spent in their defense.

What firms does Trump have a stake in that would personally benefit him?

 

[GT49er]

More likely that Zelenskyy has promised Trump rare earth materials in exchange for the billions of dollars we have spent in their defense.

Oh right, OK, hadn't thought of that........ Which occasion when Trump asked for Zelensky's input did that offer get made?


.........oh!

What firms does Trump have a stake in that would personally benefit him?

I don't know. Perhaps he hasn't even bought one up, or bought shares in it yet. Are you seriously telling me for a fact that you know Trump has no plan to benefit himself at all? You didn't vote for him, did you?

Wowsers!

 

[Cotton Socks]

Starmer opening the door to "boots on the ground". This is a moment and a half.

That's actually quite scary.
Someone kept saying to me last year that Starmer would lead us into a war with Russia. I would like to be able to continue to say to him that he talks a load of s**t & not have him say 'I told you so'.
Seeing that they hit Chernobyl the other day gave me an 'Oh my God' feeling, now I'm feeling very uneasy.

 

[lasvegan]

Oh right, OK, hadn't thought of that........ Which occasion when Trump asked for Zelensky's input did that offer get made?


.........oh!

I don't know. Perhaps he hasn't even bought one up, or bought shares in it yet. Are you seriously telling me for a fact that you know Trump has no plan to benefit himself at all? You didn't vote for him, did you?

Wowsers!

So you don’t know, you’re speculating (me too, an educated guess).

Of course I voted for him. The alternative is insanity.

 

[cunning fergus]

You make it sound like we have a binary choice - an imperfect peace (which actually isn't one of the choices, as I will explain) or full scale war.

Starting with the imperfect peace you mention, Putin won't offer that. He'll offer a ceasefire (which he will pretend is peace) and he'll use the time to build his war economy and his army, ready for a much bigger invasion of Ukraine and the Baltics in the coming years. An imperfect peace would be where Ukraine lose some of its land, but it does get a lasting peace with guarantees (like joining Nato and having Western troops stationed there) - and that's not on offer.

There are of course more sensible options than the 2 you offer. For example, Nato members increasing spending, and increasing support of Ukraine, and making it clear to Putin that he will never win a war against either Ukraine or the rest of Europe. Once that became clear, the only reason for Putin to continue his lost war would be to keep the vultures at bay and protect himself, and those around him would realise the game is up.

I also disagree with your analysis of our will to fight. If our country were under threat I think you'll find a lot of people are willing to fight.

You know more than me, I have no difficulty with that, I’m just a BHA lad.

It’s reassuring you and others are going to get serious in the trenches because there’s a lot of trumpets these days

End the generation blame game and start trusting gen Z | Sarah Manavis

Demonising young people for their opinions won’t help anyone. Let’s opt instead for openness

www.theguardian.com

I’m sure someone will be along later to say that we will turn over their the russkis….

 

[Nobby]

So you don’t know, you’re speculating (me too, an educated guess).

Of course I voted for him. The alternative is insanity.

Get off this thread.
We have friends and family in Ukraine.
Just feck off. Please

Everything about the man is deep seated evil. Allied to moronic stupidity

Take your swivel eyed comments elsewhere.

Please

 

[Triggaaar]

You know more than me, I have no difficulty with that, I’m just a BHA lad.

It’s reassuring you and others are going to get serious in the trenches because there’s a lot of trumpets these days

I'm no expert on the willingness to fight of the British people and I'm no tough military man myself, but I like to think that if push came to shove, I'd have joined in the defence of our country. The alternative (being ruled by the likes of Russia) doesn't bear thinking about.

 

[Triggaaar]

Starmer opening the door to "boots on the ground". This is a moment and a half.

It's all the right words in all the right places.

 

[Triggaaar]

That's actually quite scary.
Someone kept saying to me last year that Starmer would lead us into a war with Russia. I would like to be able to continue to say to him that he talks a load of s**t & not have him say 'I told you so'.

He's talking about putting troops on the ground after the war has ended, not during the war.

 

[Hugo Rune]

It's all the right words in all the right places.

One would think that there needs to be a peace keeping troop in Ukraine if there is to be lasting peace. A suggestion that 100,000 troops seems about right. I suspect almost all European countries will be offering their soldiers. The fear of Russian invasion is profound in Eastern Europe, I’d be surprised if we have to provide more than 10% of this force, so many Eastern Europeans want to go and secure the border to Russia.

 

[GoldstoneVintage]

So you don’t know, you’re speculating (me too, an educated guess).

Of course I voted for him. The alternative is insanity.

I imagine you voted for him because he would end Russia's war on Ukraine in 24 hours.

 

[Triggaaar]

One would think that there needs to be a peace keeping troop in Ukraine if there is to be lasting peace. A suggestion that 100,000 troops seems about right. I suspect almost all European countries will be offering their soldiers.

The thing is, that's basically the same as letting Ukraine join Nato. Might as well just do the latter. And to do that, the first job is to support them in the war until Russia lose. Once Russia have lost, they'll be in no position to stop Ukraine joining.

The fear of Russian invasion is profound in Eastern Europe, I’d be surprised if we have to provide more than 10% of this force, so many Eastern Europeans want to go and secure the border to Russia.

Indeed

 

[Eric the meek]

I imagine you voted for him because he would end Russia's war on Ukraine in 24 hours.

And as every subsequent 24 hours passes, the difference between reality and Trump's campaign claims continues to widen.

According to Kellogg, the peace timescale is no longer 100 days, but is now 180 days.

 

[Eric the meek]

Jake Broe severely criticises the Trump administration for not having a plan.

Speeches are ill-judged, and met with shock and bewilderment. Trump team members contradict each other, revealing that the messaging is inconsistent or absent. They don't know what they're doing, because there isn't a plan. Result: confusion and chaos. This is in Russia's favour.