[Misc] Putin's Least Believable BS Yet?

[Triggaaar]

Why not, who or what organisation is going to bring him to account....

None, he can do what he wants, and he knows it...

Aren't Russia in danger of facing further sanctions because of this? That's at least slightly bringing to account.

 

[Triggaaar]

123 metre spire indeed but no mention of the fact it also houses an original Magna Carta

Being the well travelled chap that I am, I have been to said cathedral. The local patrons waxed lyrical about the Magna Carta, but no one even mentioned the tower. Apart from Wiki.

 

[Triggaaar]

I don't understand Russia's thinking on this - they just look like incompetent liars. How can this be a good thing?

Maybe Putin had a bet with a mate on what BS they thought he could give, with a straight face. He may have lost the bet, having failed at the last, so the drinks are on him.

 

[Insel affe]

Aren't Russia in danger of facing further sanctions because of this? That's at least slightly bringing to account.

Sanctions are not going to work with a multi millionaire in control of a country that is force fed it's leaders agenda and ideology (us against the world) any sanctions will be used against us in a propaganda war, in which Putin has total control over.

 

[Triggaaar]

Having spent a couple of weeks in Russia in two different visits I have to say I no longer know who to believe.

There is more to this than meets the eye and I really wouldn't be so quick to believe the British Government and press account over that of the Russians. The Russians are good people, it has never been clear to me why they are viewed as the enemy by us or the Americans.

Is this now a full-time comedy account?

 

[dingodan]

It's interesting that we have said that we have sufficient evidence for a prosecution. So far all we know is that these guys were in and around the area at the time, I'm no legal expert but that certainly doesn't meet the evidentiary standard to convict for attempted murder. You would think if we had solid evidence to convict like we say we do it would be disclosed and waved around with glee.

 

[Giraffe]

Is this now a full-time comedy account?

Yes I get paid by Bozza

 

[Triggaaar]

Yes I get paid by Bozza

Same, but I'm paid to be antagonistic.

 

[Insel affe]

So far all we know is that these guys were in and around the area at the time

"All we know"

You must have watched 24 hours in police custody, the proof they have to bring to the prosecution service has to be strong, and this having the potential to have far reaching consequences around the world, I would think it is pretty safe to say they did it.

 

[dingodan]

"All we know"

You must have watched 24 hours in police custody, the proof they have to bring to the prosecution service has to be strong, and this having the potential to have far reaching consequences around the world, I would think it is pretty safe to say they did it.

Based on what though?

 

[LlcoolJ]

I'd be shitting myself if I was one of these blokes.

Said this to the Mrs and she was saying "but they did their job etc". I said "so what?".

Either they didn't do it properly or Putin actually wanted the shitstorm that they've created. One way or the other, you'd be looking over your shoulder forever (or probably not very long).

Then we were watching some stuff about it last night which said that they would probably come forward straight away and tell "their story" purely to make sure they didn't just disappear.

It makes sense that they've come up with the most half arsed excuse as that's not really the point. It's just to go "look, here I am" in an attempt to avoid being killed.

 

[LlcoolJ]

Having spent a couple of weeks in Russia in two different visits I have to say I no longer know who to believe.

There is more to this than meets the eye and I really wouldn't be so quick to believe the British Government and press account over that of the Russians. The Russians are good people, it has never been clear to me why they are viewed as the enemy by us or the Americans.

Of course there are good people in Russia. That's not the point.

Their government is run by gangsters and they answer to no one.

 

[dingodan]

Surely, the approach to this kind of operation would include:

1) Enter the country on false passports, and passports which suggest a nationality other than Russian.

2) If you are going to walk around the second most CCTV surveilled city in the entire world, do it with a baseball cap on. Most CCTV is above head height.

3) Use a method of assasination which is guaranteed to be successful, it's an operation with high risk and high potential costs, the last thing you would want is for it to be for nothing.

4) If you are going to use a method which makes it clearly a case of murder, do it in such a way that it won't attract significantly more attention than any other case of murder.

Am I smarter than the Russian intelligence services? I doubt it.

 

[Insel affe]

Based on what though?

Other than the footage of them entering the country, going to Salisbury, staying a few hours and jetting off back home.....

Well as I said, there must be some more, we do not know obviously, you never show your full hand, for the Americans and other nations to clearly back us, we must have shared some intelligence.
What that is I do not know, so other than that lot I have nothing more to offer, is that not enough for you ?

 

[LlcoolJ]

Surely, the approach to this kind of operation would include:

1) Enter the country on false passports, and passports which suggest a nationality other than Russian.

2) If you are going to walk around the second most CCTV surveilled city in the entire world, do it with a baseball cap on. Most CCTV is above head height.

3) Use a method of assasination which is guaranteed to be successful, it's an operation with high risk and high potential costs, the last thing you would want is for it to be for nothing.

4) If you are going to use a method which makes it clearly a case of murder, do it in such a way that it won't attract significantly more attention than any other case of murder.

Am I smarter than the Russian intelligence services? I doubt it.

You're missing the other option which is that the screwed up operation was on purpose.

Putin thrives off an "us vs them" agenda and, at home, all this has done is strengthen that.

I know a few Russians. Some cannot stand him and some believe absolutely everything he says. For the latter group this stuff just makes him stronger, and he doesn't care about the former group as they'll never get rid of him.

 

[Ernest]

I still can't see any evidence except a couple of Russian guys visiting Salisbury to see the cathedral , I'm glad they were able to point out the truth about what they were doing

 

[Insel affe]

Surely, the approach to this kind of operation would include:

1) Enter the country on false passports, and passports which suggest a nationality other than Russian.

2) If you are going to walk around the second most CCTV surveilled city in the entire world, do it with a baseball cap on. Most CCTV is above head height.

3) Use a method of assasination which is guaranteed to be successful, it's an operation with high risk and high potential costs, the last thing you would want is for it to be for nothing.

4) If you are going to use a method which makes it clearly a case of murder, do it in such a way that it won't attract significantly more attention than any other case of murder.

Am I smarter than the Russian intelligence services? I doubt it.

Your points are valid, but your talking about a leader who does not give a shit if we know it is them, he clearly has done it before.

Points 1 through to 4 are so simple that no country dare do that.......

It seems to me, he wants the world to know that he can do what he wants, knowing there are no consequences look at Syria right now bombing away without so much as the UN lifting a finger.
Because the story is so absurd he will use it in the Russian media, pointing out how absurd the whole thing is, and who would do that, get behind your leader, the whole world is against us, trust me.

 

[Bladders]

I believe Putin, perfectly plausible explanation to me

Well you are a Communist so you probably do


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[Ernest]

Well you are a Communist so you probably do


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I didn't think Putin was a Communist at all, more like a Russian nationalist

 

[dingodan]

Other than the footage of them entering the country, going to Salisbury, staying a few hours and jetting off back home.....

Well as I said, there must be some more, we do not know obviously, you never show your full hand, for the Americans and other nations to clearly back us, we must have shared some intelligence.
What that is I do not know, so other than that lot I have nothing more to offer, is that not enough for you ?

No, the argument that "they must have evidence" is not evidence. It means you are trusting what you are told, and fair enough, but it's not evidence.

I'm sure plenty of Russians are trusting what they are being told too, and if your argument is just that we are trustworthy good guys and they are untrustworthy bad guys, no that's not good enough for me. I trust each side about equally, which isn't very much to be honest.

Nations don't back each other on a case by case basis and based on evidence. Friends back friends and that's pretty much all there is to it, so I don't read much into who is siding with who, those things are entirely predictable and are based on politics far more than they are based on evidence.