[Politics] Protests/rioting in lots of places

[aftershavedave]

Agreed; one or two posters completely dominating a thread with a lot of posts (often repeating the same points many times) is massively dull - and is something that you would hope could addressed through just a modicum of self-moderation.

when virtually every thread is spammed the same way maybe that modicum of self-moderation doesn't exist?

 

[Durlston]

One assumes the rioters didn't conduct a vote and choose this fella to represent them on the radio.

Any thicker and he'd set.

 

[beorhthelm]

I’m astonished that you are trying to present some kind of apologist argument for online hate speech.

And ‘Yes’, absolutely. I fully admit that I am heavily biased against racist and any form of extremist content being allowed to flood the internet when there are laws in multiple territories clearly delineating what the limitations are to free speech and laws and provisions on Human Rights violations that very clearly define what constitutes ‘hate speech’. I also fully admit I am biased against those who think ‘freedom of speech’ is a passport to say wtf you like regardless of the harm it causes to national security, groups or other individuals.

Not even the ‘father’ of civil rights legislation, Thomas Payne, agreed to the unconditional and unfettered rights to freedom of speech.

‘The Declaration of Rights itself stipulated that laws could limit free speech in order to combat ‘abuses of this freedom’.

Thomas Paine

warwick.ac.uk

If I am appearing to you biased against Musk, it is because it’s relevant to the thread (but my points apply to all social media platforms) - Musk has taken it upon himself in recent days to get involved in the riots by spreading personally dangerous opinions …

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/08/06/tech/elon-musk-civil-war-uk-riots/index.html

And fake news …

You tell me how this irresponsible bollix falls under the universally accepted guidelines of ‘free speech’?

Elon Musk shares fake news about England rioters being sent to Falklands

X owner deletes post sharing faked Telegraph article that claimed convicted rioters would be sent to detention camps

www.theguardian.com

What is also relevant to the thread and the possibility of foreign agents being behind the far rights use of social media to incite violence and social unrest is where Musk got his funding from to purchase Titter which has implications for national security:

’Not only has Musk brought on a number of investors to help finance the deal, including entities with to China, Qatar, and Saudi Arabia but one of his other companies, Tesla, is increasingly dependent on the Chinese market and the goodwill of the Chinese government’

The national security grounds for investigating Musk’s Twitter acquisition

Patnaik, Litan, and Kunhardt make the case for a national security investigation of Elon Musk's acquisition of Twitter

www.brookings.edu

i wasn't making any apology for hate speech, grossly misreading the simple premise to go after the speaker not the platform.

 

[Igzilla]

Absolute top thread on X:



If you don't want to use X, here's a link to it in article form:


https://myblackface.wordpress.com/2024/08/08/riots-cartwheels-and-brains-interrupted/

 

[Guinness Boy]

So you

i wasn't making any apology for hate speech, grossly misreading the simple premise to go after the speaker not the platform.

Not that simple with X. The speaker often owns the platform. We’ve seen Musk claim a rescuer of children in Thailand was a nonce, claim Britain was on the verge of civil war and disseminate conspiracy theories and trans hate.

 

[aftershavedave]

Not that simple with X. The speaker often owns the platform. We’ve seen Musk claim a rescuer of children in Thailand was a nonce, claim Britain was on the verge of civil war and disseminate conspiracy theories and trans hate.

It's about time that our government, and others, addressed this. His intervention this week was vile

 

[Justice]

Any thicker and he'd set.

It’s when he says I’m not racist that gets me, why don’t these plums ever have the balls to say what they are?

 

[Bakero]

Sadly though, I believe there are a lot who do think like that.

In no small part due to the bile spouted in the tabloids for years which was then amplified with added hate on social media.

 

[Bakero]

As well as the content online, we also need to look at the algorithms that decide what content people see. I came off twitter because I realised that I was starting to live in an echo chamber where I never saw anything that didn't support my point of view, I recognised it was definitely taking my thinking down a more extreme path, giving me more and more reasons to become angry but without any balance. With the youTube algorithm their content seems really slanted towards right wing and conspiratorial content, for example if I watch a video with any mention of divisive characters like Andrew Tate or Tommy Robinson, even if that video is criticising them, I start to see lots of right wing propaganda pop up on my feed.

Anything that invokes a strong reaction is going to be prioritised and fed to people, which tends to be the more extreme stuff, and its therefore not difficult to see how misinformation spreads so quickly and how people views become polarised and radicalised when the algorithms of the social media platforms they use are designed in this way.

An echo-chamber would be a fine thing. My issue with Twitter in the age of Musk is that my FYP is full of racism and misogyny. Can't I just have a bit of football, philosophy and progressive politics?

 

[rippleman]

As

Of course, so what are the figures paid to landlords for their rooms and how do they compare with local rental rates.

I was going to suggest that they would be paid lower than the going rate. Then @Jim in the West pointed out that the Tories set up the contracts with Serco and Serco enjoyed huge profits. So actually you are probably right.

On a totally unrelated note, I wonder if there are any links between those making a profit out of Serco and the Conservative party?

What I don't understand is why the protesters are furious with the poor asylum seekers who are living in shit conditions in serco housing and not making huge profits and not furious with the Tories, and Serco who are making huge profits.

Some must be pretty angry with themselves for voting for this situation over the last 14 years too.

Edit: I seem to have assumed that Serco would pay landlords well in this post. How incredibly naive to think they would eat into their profits in such a way. Apologies.

Sorry - just catching up so apologies if fixtures.

Would you be surprised (no you wouldn't) to learn that the answer to your bolded question is.....of course!

But it's not just Tories who have had their snouts in the Serco trough according to this article from the Morning Star

A brief history of Serco and its revolving door with ministers

morningstaronline.co.uk

Here's the former top boss at Serco being appointed as a Minister in May's government.

Tory MP who was a boss at outsourcing firm Serco becomes new Justice Minister

Tory MP Edward Argar is the latest member of Theresa May's top team after he joined the Ministry of Justice

www.mirror.co.uk

 

[Eeyore]

One assumes the rioters didn't conduct a vote and choose this fella to represent them on the radio.

I would put a laughing emoji, but I can't on this one. That bloke is actually quite disturbed.

 

[AlbionBro]

That Ricky Jones chap isn't helping Labour, I can't believe what he said about slitting people's throats, surely he will get charged with such a statement. My sincere apologies if there is a thread on it, but I could not find it.
Does anyone know the legality on this?
We can't have these people in our labour party or on our streets.

 

[Guinness Boy]

That Ricky Jones chap isn't helping Labour, I can't believe what he said about slitting people's throats, surely he will get charged with such a statement. My sincere apologies if there is a thread on it, but I could not find it.
Does anyone know the legality on this?
We can't have these people in our labour party or on our streets.

It's on this thread and the Labour melt down one. Bloke's been slung immediately out of Labour and also arrested.

 

[ozzygull]

That Ricky Jones chap isn't helping Labour, I can't believe what he said about slitting people's throats, surely he will get charged with such a statement. My sincere apologies if there is a thread on it, but I could not find it.
Does anyone know the legality on this?
We can't have these people in our labour party or on our streets.

He was quickly suspended from the Labour Party and has been arrested. The Labour party will not have him back after this.

 

[El Presidente]

If there's one thing DULLER than one or two posters completely dominating a thread with a lot of posts (often repeating the same points many times), then its someone posting a load of really boring posts about post counts.

Did someone say dull?

 

[de la zouch]

No - again conveniently not understanding my earlier post - Im not saying you shouldn’t go after the speaker nor am I saying you should go after the platform - social media can also be a force for good when properly moderated but when that the owner of a platform refuses to remove content that has been deemed universally offensive and illegal, is using that platform to host extremist content as a means of pursuing a powerful and nefarious political agenda and is interfering in the domestic policing and governance of a Country he doesn’t even live in, I say, yes, yes, yes, go after the owner.

As regards my original post about Musk that you have so much difficulty with, read the follow up posts posting exactly the same points and the number of likes their posts have - I am not alone in this view of Musk or the view that he needs to be reigned in.

ps. not going to carry on this line of discussion- I think our differences in political leanings and moral compasses mean we won’t see eye to eye on this however much we understand what the other is saying, agree to disagree eh?.

So to provide some balance- what about the infamous twitter files, as you refuse to recognise “right wing publications” I’ve given you something from the Grauniad:

The Twitter Files should disturb liberal critics of Elon Musk – and here’s why | X | The Guardian

Leaked messages show an unhealthy link between social media and state security

amp.theguardian.com

Basically the previous owners silenced a whole group of stuff they didn’t like, which is equally as worrying as the current owners actions

 

[AlbionBro]

It's on this thread and the Labour melt down one. Bloke's been slung immediately out of Labour and also arrested.

He was quickly suspended from the Labour Party and has been arrested. The Labour party will not have him back after this.

That's good news, hopefully they we charge him heavily too, as he seemed to be encouraging all the people around him and worse still they applauded him. Keir needs to make and example of him and keep on top of all these hate demonstrations.
What a horrible country we are now living in.

 

[Weststander]

That's good news, hopefully they we charge him heavily too, as he seemed to be encouraging all the people around him and worse still they applauded him. Keir needs to make and example of him and keep on top of all these hate demonstrations.
What a horrible country we are now living in.

Imho 85% of us are decent people, possibly more. Still love the UK.

 

[Guinness Boy]

That's good news, hopefully they we charge him heavily too, as he seemed to be encouraging all the people around him and worse still they applauded him. Keir needs to make and example of him and keep on top of all these hate demonstrations.
What a horrible country we are now living in.

FFS he has already been thrown out of the party so SKS has made an example of him. Did you not read my reply?

 

[AlbionBro]

FFS he has already been thrown out of the party so SKS has made an example of him. Did you not read my reply?

I beg your pardon, I feel you may have misinterpreted what I was saying, I was suggesting perhaps Keir can ensure he is sentenced.
Do you feel he should be sentenced?