[Politics] Protests/rioting in lots of places

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

So Illegal refugees wasn't the right term?

those that are denied asylum are usually deported so it is unlikely to be them.

Who are the illegal immigrants you are referring to?

people usually call those claiming asylum illegal immigrants (although its not illegal to claim asylum from within a country - part of the language used to vilify them). I am unsure what the difference between these and the undocumented people you refer to. But neither of these groups are usually in the community as they are housed in hotels or centres while their claims are being processed.

I have the deepest suspicion of people using a term invented by the Tories to justify the Rwanda wheeze: "illegal asylum seeker".

And likewise an 'illegal immigrant'. The latter is someone who arrives here undetected and disappears into the 'black' economy. It is not someone in an asylum centre.

I am expecting this as a comeback: "the terminology isn't important - we all know what we are talking about".

But, sorry, you don't. You are talking SHIT. Language has meaning. Definitions have meaning.

The 'illegal asylum seeker' that triggered all this rioting is in fact a British citizen, born in Cardiff. So why are people rioting about asylum seekers and burning mosques. The boy isn't even a muslim.

"Because you don't understand the frustration of ordinary English people trying to earn a crust"

It isn't frustration. It is envy. Envy of 'wogs' being allowed to live here.

Why were they not out burning down Christian churches when Jimmy Savile was outed as a pedophile?

Because they are hypocritical selfish scum.

And they will go to jail in their dozens, if not hundreds. Where there will be nice warders and lovely inmates to listen to their Genuine Concerns.

 

[jcdenton08]

I am trying to figure out if you know what you are on about or if you used incorrect phrases like 'Illegal refugees" because you don't.

I think i am getting the picture, so could you link to the town or towns you were describing earlier and link to the numbers of Illegal refugee, asylum seekers undocumented persons and Illegal immigrants you mentioned. Then link to the rising crime rates, falling house prices and changin cultures of those towns?

I get the feeling we’re going to go around and around and you aren’t listening to anything I’m saying so let’s leave it there

 

[WATFORD zero]

Your tone is permanently condescending, you just can't see it.

The quote you highlighted, I stand by, who in their right mind being in a safe country already would then risk life and limb and pay thousands for the privilege to get on a tiny inflatable boat and go across a dangerous sea because they speak a better language over there. To be honest there's very little point debating with you (or some of the other usual suspects) as there won't be proper discussions back, just sniping (and another emoji).

321 Million French speakers in the world, 1.5 Billion English speakers

 

[Guinness Boy]

One that includes questions such as “what is the legal age of consent” that you can then hold people accountable to. I’ve seen the ‘I didn’t know the laws’ defence on too many occasions

Have you really?

Are you a Solicitor? Copper? Judge? Court Reporter?

Or have you just had a bit too much internet?

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

One that includes questions such as “what is the legal age of consent” that you can then hold people accountable to. I’ve seen the ‘I didn’t know the laws’ defence on too many occasions

Really? Well that won't wash because ignorance is no defense. If you have seen that defense succeed then the court that made the judgement is in contempt of the law and should re reported. Care to give some examples?

 

[BadFish]

I get the feeling we’re going to go around and around and you aren’t listening to anything I’m saying so let’s leave it there

Fair enough.

 

[dwayne]

Just the Muslims you don’t like then?

There's certain elements of the Muslim culture I can't abide with... The suppression of women being one of them. That doesn't make me anti Muslim though don't get it twisted. That applies to some African cultures as well.....

 

[Baldseagull]

O

We are a tiny island rammed with people, all the homes are gone and rents are sky high because of demand. It is an immigration issue and it’s to late to address it now the damage is done.

It's not our island that's tiny, and it isn't rammed with people. West Sussex has a population around 900,000. 100,000, of them live alongside me in Crawley.
There is room to build, but people don't want their villages to become towns.
There is a housing supply problem, with many contributing factors. Refugees are a tiny part of the problem, in that they slightly increase demand.
The main problems are foreign investment ownership, second homes for holidays or holiday lets, land banking, lack of social housing, due to right to buy and restrictions on councils to build more, planning delays, and houses allowed to stand empty for too long.
There is probably enough houses and bedrooms in the UK currently to house everyone comfortably, but in the wrong locations, or a single person living in a large house, whilst families are crammed in a small one, not available as a foreign owner just wants the appreciating asset, and isn't interested in renting, or owner has died and family can't agree what to do with it, so do nothing.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

You're.

Fair cop.

 

[Eric the meek]

Let's hope there will be a succession of collars felt this week.

Preferably in the most embarrassing circumstances, when the rioters are back at work.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

If they aren’t documented, they aren’t paying tax. They are doing jobs, usually cash in hand, often in “modern slavery” conditions, which is hurting the economy. Meanwhile, they are consuming public services such as a hugely strained NHS. No documentation, no NI number. No legal right to work, no tax.

If you seek NHS emergency treatment (not just because you have a hurty) without any identity you will be treated, but you will also be arrested. Being in the black economy does not entitle you to perpetual virtual citizenship.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Do you honestly not know this, or are you trying and failing at some kind of attempt to use weasel words?

There are 800k-1.2m undocumented migrants in the UK. These are different to accepted immigrants and documented asylum seekers. These are people who have either outstayed their visa, arrived undocumented (by truck, boat etc) and have no legal right to remain in the UK.

Who are the UK’s undocumented population?

jcwi.org.uk

Selective quoting jcdenton from that link.

This paragraph stood out to me. It smacks of the Windrush scandal, where people came over, had children, who twenty or thirty years later were suddenly told there was no record of them, despite going to school and being treated by local doctors.

The UK’s undocumented communities are more settled than those in Europe, with over half having lived here for more than five years. Many came to the UK as children: just over a quarter of undocumented people (215,000) are children, half of whom were born in the UK. As a result, most undocumented people have family in the UK, often their only source of support. They are often part of mixed-status families, in which everybody suffers and lives under constant threat of a loved one being deported from the country.

 

[Jim in the West]

There's certain elements of the Muslim culture I can't abide with... The suppression of women being one of them. That doesn't make me anti Muslim though don't get it twisted. That applies to some African cultures as well.....

How about the Christian fundamentalists who seem to comprise a relatively large percentage of the Republican Party in the US?

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Let's hope there will be a succession of collars felt this week.

Preferably in the most embarrassing circumstances, when the rioters are back at work.

147 arrests so far.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Let's hope there will be a succession of collars felt this week.

Preferably in the most embarrassing circumstances, when the rioters are back at work.

When I was watching the riots earlier in the week, I was of the view that most were probably in work and on the packet..I said so on here. Watching the Tamworth riots i'm not so sure....who on earth would employ that fat youth in the jogging suit with tits? What job could he do?

 

[dwayne]

How about the Christian fundamentalists who seem to comprise a relatively large percentage of the Republican Party in the US?

Yep don't agree with a lot of them either. Luckily theyre not in England trying to push their views across.

 

[The Clamp]

O

We are a tiny island rammed with people, all the homes are gone and rents are sky high because of demand. It is an immigration issue and it’s to late to address it now the damage is done.

Piffle.

Swathes of our housing stock is used up housing work shy Brits who get about on one crutch claiming to have some form of hokum “unseen disability” and spending their PIP payments on holidays to Butlins.

 

[BevBHA]

Really? Well that won't wash because ignorance is no defense. If you have seen that defense succeed then the court that made the judgement is in contempt of the law and should re reported. Care to give some examples?

Oxford grooming gang: We will regret ignoring Asian thugs who target white girls

What a god-awful mess this country has got itself into over multiculturalism, and once again our fear of racism will lead to the betrayal of hundreds of young girls

www.telegraph.co.uk

Muslim abuser who 'didn't know' that sex with a girl of 13 was illegal is spared jail

Adil Rashid (pictured) admitted travelling to Nottingham in July last year and having sex with the teenager who can't be named for legal reasons.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Literally the first article which comes up on a very quick Google search. There are many more.

 

[Guinness Boy]

How about the Christian fundamentalists who seem to comprise a relatively large percentage of the Republican Party in the US?

Well, quite. Or the far right Jews currently directing the Israeli government?

Most religious people are happier and, frankly, 'nicer' because of their religious beliefs, regardless of the God or way or worship. ALL fundamentalists are lunatics IMO, no matter what the creed.

 

[Jim in the West]

Yep don't agree with a lot of them either. Luckily theyre not in England trying to push their views across.

Just checking your antipathy isn’t based on religion or race