Prevent Donald Trump from making a state visit to the United Kingdom - petition

[studio150]

Much of the protesting and outrage seems to be centred on the attempt to put temporary travel restrictions on citizens from seven Muslim-majority states. According to this ..

In our survey, carried out before President Trump’s executive order was announced, respondents were given the following statement: ‘All further migration from mainly Muslim countries should be stopped’. They were then asked to what extent did they agree or disagree with this statement. Overall, across all 10 of the European countries an average of 55% agreed that all further migration from mainly Muslim countries should be stopped, 25% neither agreed nor disagreed and 20% disagreed.

Majorities in all but two of the ten states agreed, ranging from 71% in Poland, 65% in Austria, 53% in Germany and 51% in Italy to 47% in the United Kingdom and 41% in Spain. In no country did the percentage that disagreed surpass 32%.

- See more at: https://www.chathamhouse.org/expert...about-muslim-immigration#sthash.airzawnh.dpuf

.. the protesters opinions are not very representative. If anything Trump's policy would be viewed as a bit tame by the majority.

And from the same report

It is also worth noting that in most of these states the radical right is, to varying degrees, entrenched as a political force and is looking to mobilize this angst over Islam into the ballot box, either at elections in 2017 or longer term.

Our findings also reveal how, across Europe, opposition to Muslim immigration is especially intense among retired, older age cohorts while those aged below 30 are notably less opposed. There is also a clear education divide. Of those with secondary level qualifications, 59% opposed further Muslim immigration. By contrast, less than half of all degree holders supported further migration curbs.


Which means that this effectively repeats the findings from the Brexit demographics.

I will leave others to comment on whether this means that Europe has far too many old uneducated xenophobic right wing supporters.

The fact that the survey shows more supporting a ban does not make it right but no doubt there will be cheering from all UKIP supporters

 

[BigGully]

Really? Really?


According to the Washington Post and Bloomberg, Trump’s ban did not include any of the Muslim-majority countries where the Trump Organization — which is now being run by his sons — holds business interests. Those countries reportedly include Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Turkey, the U.A.E. and Azerbaijan.

Here’s a look back at the major terrorist attacks that have taken place on U.S. soil since 9/11, including the nationalities of the perpetrator, or perpetrators.

Of this list, zero fatal attacks were carried out by immigrants from the seven Muslim-majority countries targeted by the ban. Two attacks were carried out by individuals with ties to the seven countries: the 2006 UNC SUV attack, and the 2016 Ohio State University attack. Neither of those plots resulted in American deaths.

9/11 attacks:

On Sept. 11, 2001, 19 militants hijacked four commercial airlines to carry out terrorist attacks on the U.S. that killed 2,996 people and wounded more than 6,000 others. The 19 men were associated with al-Qaeda, a decentralized terrorist network, at the time led by Osama bin Laden.

Of the 19 hijackers, 15 were from Saudi Arabia, two from the United Arab Emirates, one from Egypt and one from Lebanon.

2001 anthrax attacks:

Anonymous letters laced with deadly anthrax spores began arriving at media companies and congressional offices, killing five people and infecting 17 others. The FBI concluded Bruce Ivins, a top biodefense researcher, was the key suspect for the attacks, although he was never charged with any crime. Ivins was American.



2002 D.C. sniper attacks:

Over the course of three weeks in 2002, John Allen Muhammad and Lee Boyd Malvo killed 10 people and critically injured three others in Washington D.C., Baltimore, and Virginia.

Muhammad was born as John Allen Williams in Baton Rouge, Louisiana. Malvo is from Jamaica.

2006 UNC SUV attack:

Mohammed Reza Taheri-aza intentionally rammed into people on the UNC Chapel Hill campus. Nine people were injured, none seriously. Taheri-aza was reportedly an Iranian-born U.S. citizen.



2006 Seattle Capitol Hill massacre:

Kyle Aaron Huff opened fire in a rave afterparty in Seattle’s Capitol Hill, killing six and wounding two others. Huff was American, from Whitefish, Montana.

2006 Seattle Jewish Federation shooting:



Naveed Afzal Haq shot six people, one fatally, at the Jewish Federation of Greater Seattle building. Haq was a U.S. citizen of Pakistani descent.

2008 Knoxville Unitarian Universalist church shooting:

Jim David Adkisson killed two people and wounded seven others at the Tennessee Valley Unitarian Universalist Church in Knoxville, Tennessee. Adkisson was American.

2009 Arkansas recruiting office shooting:

Abdulhakim Mujahid Muhammad shot and killed one military recruiter and seriously wounded another at a Little Rock, Arkansas Army/Navy Career Center. Muhammad, previously known as Carlos Leon Bledsoe, was American.

2009 Fort Hood shooting:

Nidal Malik Hasan, a U.S. Army major and psychiatrist, fatally shot 13 people and injured more than 30 others in Fort Hood, Texas. Hasan was born in the U.S. to Palestinian parents.

2010 Austin suicide attack:

Andrew Joseph Stack III deliberately crashed his single engine plane into the Austin, Texas, IRS building, killing himself, one IRS employee and injuring 13 others. Stack was American.

2012 Wisconsin Sikh temple shooting:

Wade Michael Page fatally shot six people and wounded four others at a Sikh temple is Oak Creek, Wisconsin. Page, who was active in white supremacist groups, was an American.


2013 Boston marathon bombing:

Double bombings near the finish line of the Boston marathon killed three people and injured at least 264. The perpetrators were brothers Tamerlan and Dzhokhar Tsarnaev. According to FBI interrogators, the two were motivated by extremist Islamic beliefs, but were not connected to any known terrorist groups. Tamerlan was born in Russia but was a permanent resident of the U.S., while Dzhokhar was born in Kyrgyzstan and became a naturalized U.S. citizen in 2012. Both were ethnically Chechen.

2013 Los Angeles International Airport shooting:

Paul Anthony Ciancia opened fire at Terminal 3 in LAX, killing one and injuring several others. Ciancia is American and grew up in Pennsville, New Jersey.

2014 Overland Park Jewish Community Center shooting:

Frazier Glenn Miller, Jr., a neo-Nazi white supremacist, committed a pair of shootings at the Jewish Community Center in Overland Park, Kansas, killing a total of three people. Miller was American.

2014 Las Vegas shooting:

A married couple, Jerad and Amanda Miller, committed a shooting spree in Las Vegas, killing three people as well as themselves. Both were American and supported extreme anti-government views.

2014 Queens hatchet attack:

Zale H. Thompson attacked four New York City Police Department officers with a metal hatchet, injuring two. A civilian was also injured after police opened fire on Thompson. Thompson, who was American, was described by police officials as a self-radicalized Muslim convert who was inspired by terrorist groups.

2014 slayings of NYPD officers:

Ismaaiyl Abdullah Brinsley killed two on-duty NYPD officers, reportedly as revenge for the deaths of Eric Garner and Michael Brown. Brinsley was born in the U.S. to a Muslim African-American family.



2015 Charleston church shooting:

Dylann Roof killed nine people and injured one during a mass shooting at Emanuel African Methodist Episcopal Church in downtown Charleston, South Carolina. Roof, a white supremacist, is American and was sentenced to death on Jan. 10.

2015 Chattanooga shooting:

Muhammad Youssef Abdulazeez opened fire on two military installations in Chattanooga, Tennessee, killing four Marines and wounding two others. A fifth Marine died from his injuries two days later. Abdulazeez, a naturalized U.S. citizen, was born in Kuwait to Palestinian-Jordanian parents.

2015 Colorado Springs Planned Parenthood shooting:

Robert Lewis Dear, Jr. committed a mass shooting at a Colorado Springs Planned Parenthood clinic, killing three and injury nine others. Dear, who is American, was ruled incompetent to stand trial and was indefinitely confined to a Colorado state mental hospital.

2015 San Bernardino attack:

A married couple, Syed Rizwan Farook and Tashfeen Malik, killed 14 civilians and injured 22 others in a mass shooting at the Inland Regional Center in San Bernardino, California. Farook was born in the U.S. to Pakistani parents, and Malik, who was a permanent U.S. resident, was born in Pakistan but grew up in Saudi Arabia.

2016 Orlando nightclub shooting:

Omar Mateen killed 49 people and wounded 53 in a mass shooting at the gay nightclub Pulse in Orlando, Florida. Mateen was an American born in the U.S. to Afghan parents.

2016 shooting of Dallas police officers: Micah Xavier Johnson ambushed a group of Dallas police officers, killing five and injuring nine others. Johnson, a former Army reservist, was an American.



2016 Minnesota mall stabbing:

Dahir A. Adan committed a mass stabbing at the Crossroads Center shopping mall in St. Cloud, Minnesota, injuring 10 people. Adan was born in Kenya and became a naturalized U.S. citizen in 2008.

2016 New York and New Jersey bombings:

Over the course of three days in September, three bombs exploded and several explosive devices were found in New Jersey and New York City, injuring at least 30 people. The alleged perpetrator was Ahmad Khan Rahimi, an Afghan-born U.S. citizen.

2016 Ohio State university attack:

Abdul Razal Ali Artan carried out an attack on the Ohio State University campus, injuring 13. Artan, a student of the university, was a Muslim Somali immigrant.

2017 Fort Lauderdale Airport attack:

A mass shooting occurred at Fort Lauderdale-Hollywood International Airport near the baggage claim in Terminal 2 on Jan. 6. A total of five people were killed and six others were injured. Esteban Ruiz Santiago, the alleged shooter, was indicted on 22 counts by a federal grand jury on Thursday. Santiago is an American, born to Puerto Rican parents in New Jersey.


source: AURELIE CORINTHIOS People Politics.

delete.

 

[BigGully]

Im not sure the governments of the countries named support Islamic terror. They tend to be in the front of the fighting against it. Suffer the most from it. It is interesting that the country that has supplied the greater number of terrorists to attack the USA is not on the list.

But surely those countries in the frontline of fighting 'it' by default have the largest problems of 'it'.

 

[daveinprague]

But surely those countries in the frontline of fighting 'it' by default have the largest problems of 'it'.

Egypt has ISIS in the Sinai, Saudi Arabia? Turkey? Both have suffered, particularly Turkey, recent terror attacks. Both involved in wars, Turkey against the kurds, and islamist groups, and Saudi Arabia in the Yemen.
The ban seems a little illogical, and made in haste, with a touch of petulance, ans possibly self interests in mind.

 

[BigGully]

Egypt has ISIS in the Sinai, Saudi Arabia? Turkey? Both have suffered, particularly Turkey, recent terror attacks. Both involved in wars, Turkey against the kurds, and islamist groups, and Saudi Arabia in the Yemen.
The ban seems a little illogical, and made in haste, with a touch of petulance, ans possibly self interests in mind.

You seemed to start advocating a wider overall ban, before reining yourself in on the USA stance.

You yourself have identified other areas, countries that have a genuine problem with ISIS, a cult that undoubtedly wish harm to the West particularly USA, would you not think it reasonable to have regulation on immigration from these areas ??

 

[JC Footy Genius]

And from the same report

It is also worth noting that in most of these states the radical right is, to varying degrees, entrenched as a political force and is looking to mobilize this angst over Islam into the ballot box, either at elections in 2017 or longer term.

Our findings also reveal how, across Europe, opposition to Muslim immigration is especially intense among retired, older age cohorts while those aged below 30 are notably less opposed. There is also a clear education divide. Of those with secondary level qualifications, 59% opposed further Muslim immigration. By contrast, less than half of all degree holders supported further migration curbs.


Which means that this effectively repeats the findings from the Brexit demographics.

I will leave others to comment on whether this means that Europe has far too many old uneducated xenophobic right wing supporters.

The fact that the survey shows more supporting a ban does not make it right but no doubt there will be cheering from all UKIP supporters

Comments about 44% of 18 - 29-year-olds supporting a complete ban compared to 27% disagree and 48% to 27 % of the highest academically educated category also welcome.

Agree it doesn't necessarily make their view right but it does suggest the protester's views are unrepresentative. It also undermines a certain view that Europeans are very different from the US populace.

 

[daveinprague]

You seemed to start advocating a wider overall ban, before reining yourself in on the USA stance.

You yourself have identified other areas, countries that have a genuine problem with ISIS, a cult that undoubtedly wish harm to the West particularly USA, would you not think it reasonable to have regulation on immigration from these areas ??

The fear is that hundreds of terrorists are flooding into the USA without a ban. Thats fairly ridiculous. So I think the ban, is just for the redneck vote to feel good about Regulate, maybe have more security, but a ban. Its not like its particularly easy to get into the USA.
Yes, there can be false paperwork etc, but the false paperwork would let it somebody from Turkey, or Egypt if the false paperwork was believed etc. Its just a bit too random.

 

[Two Professors]

And from the same report

It is also worth noting that in most of these states the radical right is, to varying degrees, entrenched as a political force and is looking to mobilize this angst over Islam into the ballot box, either at elections in 2017 or longer term.

Our findings also reveal how, across Europe, opposition to Muslim immigration is especially intense among retired, older age cohorts while those aged below 30 are notably less opposed. There is also a clear education divide. Of those with secondary level qualifications, 59% opposed further Muslim immigration. By contrast, less than half of all degree holders supported further migration curbs.


Which means that this effectively repeats the findings from the Brexit demographics.

I will leave others to comment on whether this means that Europe has far too many old uneducated xenophobic right wing supporters.

The fact that the survey shows more supporting a ban does not make it right but no doubt there will be cheering from all UKIP supporters

More fake news?Have you said sorry yet for your last set of lies?

 

[BigGully]

The fear is that hundreds of terrorists are flooding into the USA without a ban. Thats fairly ridiculous. So I think the ban, is just for the redneck vote to feel good about Regulate, maybe have more security, but a ban. Its not like its particularly easy to get into the USA.
Yes, there can be false paperwork etc, but the false paperwork would let it somebody from Turkey, or Egypt if the false paperwork was believed etc. Its just a bit too random.

Again, if your view is that the ban wouldnt work in its current format but perhaps accept that some restriction necessary, surely the conclusion if you feel you countries security might be compromised is for an even more restrictive policy.

However, I suspect that you cannot see any real risk and do not wish to address anything in particular, you dont need to be a redneck to think that absurd.

 

[daveinprague]

Again, if your view is that the ban wouldnt work in its current format but perhaps accept that some restriction necessary, surely the conclusion if you feel you countries security might be compromised is for an even more restrictive policy.

However, I suspect that you cannot see any real risk and do not wish to address anything in particular, you dont need to be a redneck to think that absurd.

Theres always a risk, and there always will be from some threat or another. Nothing has happened in the US involving people from those countries, and they are the countries in the forefront of the war against terror for years, I just think a blanket ban like that is fairly ludicrous, in its concept, and execution.
I think Trump wants people to have terror on their minds constantly. Easier to manipulate then.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

You seemed to start advocating a wider overall ban, before reining yourself in on the USA stance.

You yourself have identified other areas, countries that have a genuine problem with ISIS, a cult that undoubtedly wish harm to the West particularly USA, would you not think it reasonable to have regulation on immigration from these areas ??

In the US there is already regulation on immigration from these areas. It is normal border control and is something we need to emulate in this country. The Trump blanket ban is something different as I don't think it will make
America a safer place to live. Terrorists are pretty determined and will circumvent the ban so the net effect is likely to be simply
inconvenience for ordinary people from those countries which may turn to hostility. It is
counter productive. My earlier comments were simply to point out that this same argument applies to Saudi Arabia and indeed the travel ban some countries have on Israeli citizens.

 

[hans kraay fan club]

In the US there is already regulation on immigration from these areas. It is normal border control and is something we need to emulate in this country. The Trump blanket ban is something different as I don't think it will make
America a safer place to live. Terrorists are pretty determined and will circumvent the ban so the net effect is likely to be simply
inconvenience for ordinary people from those countries which may turn to hostility. It is counter productive.

Don't often see eye-to-eye, but this is absolutely spot on, IMO.

 

[BigGully]

Theres always a risk, and there always will be from some threat or another. Nothing has happened in the US involving people from those countries, and they are the countries in the forefront of the war against terror for years, I just think a blanket ban like that is fairly ludicrous, in its concept, and execution.
I think Trump wants people to have terror on their minds constantly. Easier to manipulate then.

That simply isnt true, since 9/11 they have arrested and convicted something like 70+ people from these countries on terrorism charges and non from Isle of Wight.

Its an absurdity in light of some atrocities that have happened in europe and the UK that it isnt already on the forefront of our minds and so it should be, you cannot blame Trump for that.

 

[BigGully]

In the US there is already regulation on immigration from these areas. It is normal border control and is something we need to emulate in this country. The Trump blanket ban is something different as I don't think it will make
America a safer place to live. Terrorists are pretty determined and will circumvent the ban so the net effect is likely to be simply
inconvenience for ordinary people from those countries which may turn to hostility. It is
counter productive. My earlier comments were simply to point out that this same argument applies to Saudi Arabia and indeed the travel ban some countries have on Israeli citizens.

Why would these clever and cunning terrorists circumvent tighter vetting and Trumps immigration policy whilst not the regulations and border controls that are already in place ?

 

[wellquickwoody]

And the petition has been rejected, and rightly so.

 

[nicko31]

And the petition has been rejected, and rightly so.

Get the Don over, take him to a few Brexit towns, we need to massage his ego

 

[The Clamp]

And the petition has been rejected, and rightly so.[/QUOTE

Nice that people made their feelings known though. It was pretty obvious it was going to be ignored by decision makers from the off but nice to see the true Spirit of Britain is fighting fit, it's what won us two world wars. Not rolling over and being told what to do.

 

[wellquickwoody]

And the petition has been rejected, and rightly so.[/QUOTE

Nice that people made their feelings known though. It was pretty obvious it was going to be ignored by decision makers from the off but nice to see the true Spirit of Britain is fighting fit, it's what won us two world wars. Not rolling over and being told what to do.

When did Captain Orange tell Britain what to do?

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

Why would these clever and cunning terrorists circumvent tighter vetting and Trumps immigration policy whilst not the regulations and border controls that are already in place ?

They may circumvent either but a clear border control policy that is applied to everyone is a lot less divisive than Trump's travel ban which is applied only to certain countries. If one follows Trump's logic through there are a lot more countries that should be added to the list e.g. Somalia, Saudi Arabia, Russia (Chechnya). Both sides are to blame for this as Trump has really only acquired a mandate on immigration as a reaction to the increasingly open borders ideology of the liberal left. Common sense has departed from all sides.

 

[alfredmizen]

That reminds me, a few weeks back you said you had not had a pay rise for about 10 years. Why are you still in that job?

it most certainly wasnt me who said that.