[Technology] Petrol and diesel cars banned from 2035...

[Notters]

Double ppst

 

[wellquickwoody]

They're only banning SALES in 15 years.

Exactly. Aiming to buy my ‘car for life’ in the next two or three years and then run it forever. Before they are all fitted with speed limiting technology and trackers as standard.

 

[Hugo Rune]

its realism, understanding the scale of the problems. Car companies are not going to be building power stations and upgrading national grid and local electric distribution.

We’re going to move to predominantly hydrogen not electricity.

Indeed Doon, it is defeatism and ignorance to believe that all viable non petrol/diesel cars are electric. Only boomer-bull would have you believe that we can’t make quick radical changes to save the planet.

Never ever underestimate the power of Political pressure. The moon landing is testament that if a government really wants something done, it can achieve it.

Anyway, this is NOT something a popularist government would do as the ‘top gear’ watching climate change denying right wingers are in the ear of Boris, not the people trying to save the planet.

 

[Diablo]

Lot of petrol/diesel cars will be sold in 2034..........Probably worth buying a few and registering them for sale from 2035 onwards.

 

[Diablo]

I wonder if Heavy goods vehicles/Tractors etc will also be electric.

 

[Half Time Pies]

its realism, understanding the scale of the problems. as posted:



car companies are not going to be building power stations and upgrading national grid and local electric distribution.

Funny that the National Grid don't share your concerns, do you know something that they don't?!

https://theenergyst.com/millions-electric-vehicles-sooner-predicted-no-sweat-says-national-grid/

 

[Creaky]

Lot of petrol/diesel cars will be sold in 2034..........Probably worth buying a few and registering them for sale from 2035 onwards.

Can you imagine how much petrol and diesel will cost, if you are able to find anyone selling it.

 

[Dick Head]

Lamppost charging is the way forward

https://www.driving.co.uk/news/lamp-post-powered-electric-car-charging-points-arrive-london/

My street's got 100 houses and three street lamps, one of which hasn't been working for the best part of a year. Just saying.

 

[beorhthelm]

Funny that the National Grid don't share your concerns, do you know something that they don't?!

https://theenergyst.com/millions-electric-vehicles-sooner-predicted-no-sweat-says-national-grid/

i know there are about 38million vehicles, that article profess they can cope with 9 million. if they know 8GW of power is coming online thats great, hopefully they'll know where the other 30GW odd is too. not for the car company to solve either way.

point being made is its not a problem for the car companies, they can and are making changes. its the infrastructure thats the problem. and its a simple problem too, add lots of power, uprate peoples supply. its the cost and time to do this thats being overlooked.

similar issues apply to hydrogen too, fan of that, just technical issues need to be solved.

 

[Dick Head]

I drive a fairly big, old(ish) diesel Nissan X trail. I would welcome an affordable, reliable alternative to fossil fuels but what? Use bio fuel and people say under developed countries will starve as the price of plants used in the making of these will be more than food crops. Is it financially viable to pursue other routes like electric and hydrogen without the infrastructure in place?
How quickly can technology be released to the masses without breaking the bank?
There will be no cheap way to do this and it will piss people off whatever way they go.

Get the bus?

 

[Doonhamer7]

The big ‘energy’ companies (those formally called Oil&Gas). Are going to invest well in excess of $100bn in the next decade in Ammonia plants to allow them to move hydrogen across the globe (I don’t think h2 can’t be economically liquified like natural gas), then we’ll have localised ammonia plant converting to hydrogen for you car. Also Our gas boilers supposedly can run on 20% hydrogen so soon this will be added to the gas network, once the tests are completed up in Cheshire, thus reducing our carbon footprint. The best thing is that we (the UK) with our renewable (wind) energy capability can kept the turbines going at night and use the ‘free’ electricity to create hydrogen overnight - so a win win situation.

 

[Coldeanseagull]

Get the bus?

Were you being serious? Expecting me to mingle with the worker minions?
I'd rather be accused of killing the planet than mix with.....them!

 

[beorhthelm]

The big ‘energy’ companies (those formally called Oil&Gas). Are going to invest well in excess of $100bn in the next decade in Ammonia plants to allow them to move hydrogen across the globe (I don’t think h2 can’t be economically liquified like natural gas), then we’ll have localised ammonia plant converting to hydrogen for you car. Also Our gas boilers supposedly can run on 20% hydrogen so soon this will be added to the gas network, once the tests are completed up in Cheshire, thus reducing our carbon footprint. The best thing is that we (the UK) with our renewable (wind) energy capability can kept the turbines going at night and use the ‘free’ electricity to create hydrogen overnight - so a win win situation.

ammonia transport sounds interesting. also like adding hydrogen to gas, or boilers that can run on both with minor adjustment. need to add some nuclear base supply for periods with little wind, read Rolls Royce are designing "mini" reactors for more local power generation. could put one in Newhaven

 

[zefarelly]

VW reckon that 97% of the materials in EV batteries are recyclable for the manufacture of new batteries. Mind you VW are hardly the Holy Bible when it comes to environmental statements.

If you want to get factual, they're probably pretty damned close!

 

[Bodian]

I wonder if Heavy goods vehicles/Tractors etc will also be electric.

We've tried out a few electric diggers. Not too bad - but the biggest problem is that we can't leave them out on site (on the fells / fields) during the job, as we can't charge them up. So, we have to load them up on the trailer and drive them back to charge them. (or take a diesel generator...!)

 

[portlock seagull]

Can’t see that snow scene happening in 20 years time! Rome’s already burning so it’s good to see everyone bickering about whether 15 years is achievable or not. By then, things will be irreversible and much worse so really, all these critics opinions are worth, well, about as much as mine!!

 

[Half Time Pies]

i know there are about 38million vehicles, that article profess they can cope with 9 million. if they know 8GW of power is coming online thats great, hopefully they'll know where the other 30GW odd is too. not for the car company to solve either way.

point being made is its not a problem for the car companies, they can and are making changes. its the infrastructure thats the problem. and its a simple problem too, add lots of power, uprate peoples supply. its the cost and time to do this thats being overlooked.

similar issues apply to hydrogen too, fan of that, just technical issues need to be solved.

But you are also overlooking the work that can be done on managing demand. Of course if every electric vehicle owner came home at 5pm and all plugged their car in at the same time you would have a massive problem but people arrive home at different times and have different routines. Peoples routines and behaviours can also be altered through a combination of incentives to encourage off peak charging and smart technology which would make charging automated and simple. As the article suggested (and which you overlooked) the 8GW is likely to become 4GW according to the National Grids forecasts.

The car manufacturers have a very important role to play in this, companies like Nissan for example are working with energy companies on vehicle to grid technology (using car batteries to help balance the grid) https://theenergyst.com/evs-v2g-vehicle-to-grid-battery-storage-smartgrid/

 

[beorhthelm]

... As the article suggested (and which you overlooked) the 8GW is likely to become 4GW according to the National Grids forecasts.

yep, i was discarding the goldilocks scenario, because power systems should consider peak load so that lights dont go out. the article is saying, if we assume only a quater of cars go electric, and people follow our best case for use of smart charging, then we can cope easily. do you not see how they may be understating the issue? it needs 10 Rampion sized wind farms, or another Hinkley nuke plant to cover the 4GW, if they are in the pipeline (in addition to projects replacing end of life power stations), it'll be fine.

 

[Brovion]

Yes comrade.

Can you not afford one?

Hence the bitterness?

Bitterness? Not bitter at all, just wondering why cars are getting bigger and bigger, especially given our current environmental concerns. And that's without mentioning the parking/road space needed by modern cars. (My new Fiesta is only three inches shorter than the Ford Escort I had in 1982). I suppose the demand for SUVs could be because people are getting fatter and fatter, in which case they probably do need super-sized transport. That of course is another problem entirely, but normal people, i.e. not a family of lard-arses, don't need something that is only two caterpillar tracks and a turret away from being a serviceable tank.

 

[Live by the sea]

Diesel cars probably will be banned. Petrol cars won’t happen unless there is a big improvement in electric cars.