Peace Ship Attacked

[Greeno]

Gaza is one big concentration camp right now.

Not a very good one at that:

In 2009 -

738,576 tons (30,576 trucks) of humanitarian commodities were transferred to the Gaza Strip.
22,849 Palestinians exited the Strip, among them 10,544 patients and their companions, exiting for medical treatment in Israel.
21,200 international organization staff members entered the Gaza Strip.
4,883 tons of medical equipment and medicine entered the Strip, in 572 trucks, based on requests made by the PA and the international community.

I'm not familiar with many concentration camps which lets 22,000 people leave, and over 30,000 trucks of aid in. Remind me how much aid went in to Auschwitz?

(Israel's humanitarian aid efforts
)

Before you dismiss as false/bias, I challenge you to give me statistics which prove otherwise.

Furthermore:

A new Olympic Sized Swimming pool opens...So much for the water shortage and lack of building materials

Maan News Agency: Gaza opens first Olympic-size swimming pool



You're gona have to do better than that mate.

 

[The Phoenix]

If you believe that the Palestinians are getting it easy then you are seriously deluded!

 

[Greeno]

I never said they were getting it easy.

A dreadful situation it is. A concentration camp it is not.

 

[User removed 4]

Bushy, could you remind us what the British soldiers were doing there, and how Britain had more of a right to occupy the land than the Jews?

Sure, they were there under a league of nations mandate (the predecessor to the UN)which called for them to allow a government to emerge which reflected the wishes of the population(90% arab at the time), preserve the pattern of land ownership and to avoid altering the population ratios, anything else i can help with ?

 

[dazzalewis1968]

If you believe that the Palestinians are getting it easy then you are seriously deluded!

Palestinians do not have it easy ! but Gazza is run by Hamas who only want to kill jews and wipe Israel off the face of the earth.

I am talking as a person who was born in Brighton, that has first hand knowledge
of Gazza as I was staioned there when I was in the IDF.

This was defo a PR nightmare for Isreal and problem they have only brought on them selfs.
but lets not get a way from the fact Hamas have blood of woman and children on there hands.

 

[User removed 4]

I am talking as a person who was born in Brighton, that has first hand knowledge
of Gazza as I was staioned there when I was in the IDF.

This is the problem in a nutshell, born in brighton, yet was a member of the IDF, explain to me what you think gives you more rights to land than someone whose family has probably been there for thousands of years ?

 

[Scampi]

I see the isaraeli pr machine has sprung into action. Lots of overtime earned by the chosen this week.

 

[daveinprague]

IDF doesnt have blood on its hands? Come on man.
Ive seen Israeli tanks fire shells at children/beach parties/protests in the past.
Murdered journalists. Used phosphorous in built up civilian areas. Dont try and paint the Israeli state as innocents.

on Bushy's note..

I remember a few years back, that idiot Kilroy did a session in Israel, and had Israelis and Palestinians in the audience and panel. A girl from Nottingham, who by her own admission had been in Israel for less than a month, was telling the Palestinian mayor of Hebron, that if he didnt like the situation, he should leave. The arrogance of some Israelis/Settlers is breathtaking.

PS Ive also first hand experience of Gazza. I saw him play for Spurs.

 

[dazzalewis1968]

This is the problem in a nutshell, born in brighton, yet was a member of the IDF, explain to me what you think gives you more rights to land than someone whose family has probably been there for thousands of years ?

Bushy my people where there first !!!!

 

[dazzalewis1968]

IDF doesnt have blood on its hands? Come on man.
Ive seen Israeli tanks fire shells at children/beach parties/protests in the past.
Murdered journalists. Used phosphorous in built up civilian areas. Dont try and paint the Israeli state as innocent. Youre not talking to fools here.

on Bushy's note..

I remember a few years back, that idiot Kilroy did a session in Israel, and had Israelis and Palestinians in the audience and panel. A girl from Nottingham, who by her own admission had been in Israel for less than a month, was telling the Palestinian mayor of Hebron, that if he didnt like the situation, he should leave. The arrogance of some Israelis/Settlers is breathtaking.

IDF...........israel defence force not a Terroist organisation on a world wide list!

 

[Scampi]

Bushy my people where there first !!!!

Like 2000 years ago. My people, were probably from somewhere in central europe at that time. Doesn't give me a right to invade the Czech Republic.

 

[daveinprague]

My ancestors are from the Ukraine, im going to head back there and claim my land and 'heritage'.

 

[dazzalewis1968]

One more note I have a buddy in Israel who is a real life spooks.
and they foil attacks on Israel every day so lets not get away from the eveil of Hamas.

 

[daveinprague]

IDF...........israel defence force not a Terroist organisation on a world wide list!

Oh well, thats ok then. Feel free to drop phosphorous on civilian areas.
Feel free to use tank shells on children playing football. Feel free to use artillery on beach parties. Feel free to shoot journalists recording IDF crimes. Feel free to stand by and watch your allies massacre hundreds at Chabra and Shatila. If your not on a terror list, its fine.
Do you really believe that there are no countries or individuals that consider Israel a terrorist state? Founded by TERRORISTS. Terrorists that attacked and killed soldiers from the country of your birth?

 

[dazzalewis1968]

My ancestors are from the Ukraine, im going to head back there and claim my land and 'heritage'.

good luck to you!!! can i come as my great granmother was born there!
i will have some of that.

 

[User removed 4]

Bushy my people where there first !!!!

oh do me a favour !

 

[Dandyman]

good luck to you!!! can i come as my great granmother was born there!
i will have some of that.

Which rather makes Bushy's point for him.

Israel has a right to exist under UN Resolution 181. It does not have the right to colonise the West Bank and Gaza or to keep the Palestinians in a state of permanent seige and occupation.

As an aside, Arab Palestinians have been in modern Israel/Palestine since the Arab invasion in 638. Non-Arabs (be they Jews, Christians, Muslims, Druze or others) predate that. The Jewish population in the 1920's was around 11%.

 

[Greeno]

Which rather makes Bushy's point for him.

Israel has a right to exist under UN Resolution 181. It does not have the right to colonise the West Bank and Gaza or to keep the Palestinians in a state of permanent seige and occupation.

As an aside, Arab Palestinians have been in modern Israel/Palestine since the Arab invasion in 638. Non-Arabs (be they Jews, Christians, Muslims, Druze or others) predate that. The Jewish population in the 1920's was around 11%.

Agree with the bold to an extent. However, i think its important to remember that Israel does not want to be in the West Bank or in Gaza. This is shown by the fact that immediately after 1967 war, they offered a practically complete withdrawal and have offered the same ever since. Also, we can even go as far back as 1947 when the UN partition was proposed which was accepted by the jews and did not include gaza/west bank. As many are aware, Israel has a thriving technology industry and would much rather invest its money in that rather than paying its soldiers to man checkpoints for the sake of national security, yet the current situation I'm sure you will appreciate, cannot allow for a complete withdrawal from the west bank without any safeguards in place especially with the instability of the current Fatah government.

Of course the settlements are an issue but then again Israel has shown, as it did when it withdrew from Gaza, that it is willing to uproot the settlements in the name of peace.It is also generally accepted that some settlements will remain as part of an Israeli state whilst some Arab towns currently in Israel will remain part of a Palestinian state. Also, the settlers are incredibly marginalised and isolated in israeli socieity in that nobody likes them. I personally think they are a disgrace.

 

[Dandyman]

Agree with the bold to an extent. However, i think its important to remember that Israel does not want to be in the West Bank or in Gaza. This is shown by the fact that immediately after 1967 war, they offered a practically complete withdrawal and have offered the same ever since. Also, we can even go as far back as 1947 when the UN partition was proposed which was accepted by the jews and did not include gaza/west bank. As many are aware, Israel has a thriving technology industry and would much rather invest its money in that rather than paying its soldiers to man checkpoints for the sake of national security, yet the current situation I'm sure you will appreciate, cannot allow for a complete withdrawal from the west bank without any safeguards in place especially with the instability of the current Fatah government.

Of course the settlements are an issue but then again Israel has shown, as it did when it withdrew from Gaza, that it is willing to uproot the settlements in the name of peace.It is also generally accepted that some settlements will remain as part of an Israeli state whilst some Arab towns currently in Israel will remain part of a Palestinian state. Also, the settlers are incredibly marginalised and isolated in israeli socieity in that nobody likes them. I personally think they are a disgrace.

Where to start ? The withdrawl from Gaza was because it has little value in relation to the effort required to occupy it. Settlements continue to be built illegally in the West Bank and in Arab Jerusalem and the sincerity of any claimed offer to withdraw is massively undermined by this.

The problem IMO is that Israel has moved more and more to the right over the years due both to the Orthodox and Russian and US Immigrants. This makes it more likely that Israel is on the path to self-destruction rather than lasting peace and genuine security.

 

[Dave the OAP]

where is Blue Peter when you want him?