***Official England v USA thread***
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Ninja Elephant
Doctor Elephant
- Feb 16, 2009
- 18,855
For what it's worth, I had to work at Lingfield racecourse today. When we scored, the roof came off. When the USA scored, the place died. When Heskey went down after being caught in the face in the second half, there was an almighty roar in celebration. When he came off, people were jeering like they were actually there. That sums that up, frankly. I didn't catch enough of the game to pass an accurate judgement, so I won't even try. But a 1-1 draw against the second best team in the group isn't a bad result in the context of the competition. I would rather we saved our convincing thrashing of another team for the knock-out stages. You have to peak at the right time in this competition, have a little look at France in 2006 when they, amazingly, got to the final despite being rubbish in the group stages.
I disagee with the team selection completely, however. Rob Green as first choice? I understand not wanting to play Hart considering he's not got the experience of playing for England in a game that matters. But James does. Surely, James should have been the first choice. It was a big call, it didn't work. And neither did playing Milner. Certainly not to play out on the left. But, again, I didn't see the game and can't pass judgement on what actually happened., so won't. But I never thought the starting 11 was going to be able to comfortably see their way past a better than given credit for USA team.
Heskey, well. I read the first 12 pages of this thread before replying, with certain people falling over themselves to big him up. Seriously, shut up. Just, shut up. He is rubbish, he offers next to nothing, and he can't finish a simple 1 on 1 chance, which should be bread and butter. I saw that part, no problems. What happened to Heskey? I remember his 20 goal season at Liverpool, he was unplayable. Why did he decide he had to become a donkey-targetman? Pity. But he's not International quality, not even close. Sadly, I think the only position on the pitch we're lacking in World Class players, is up front (and in goal!). Rooney, that's it. One good striker, and one good striker isn't enough.
I disagee with the team selection completely, however. Rob Green as first choice? I understand not wanting to play Hart considering he's not got the experience of playing for England in a game that matters. But James does. Surely, James should have been the first choice. It was a big call, it didn't work. And neither did playing Milner. Certainly not to play out on the left. But, again, I didn't see the game and can't pass judgement on what actually happened., so won't. But I never thought the starting 11 was going to be able to comfortably see their way past a better than given credit for USA team.
Heskey, well. I read the first 12 pages of this thread before replying, with certain people falling over themselves to big him up. Seriously, shut up. Just, shut up. He is rubbish, he offers next to nothing, and he can't finish a simple 1 on 1 chance, which should be bread and butter. I saw that part, no problems. What happened to Heskey? I remember his 20 goal season at Liverpool, he was unplayable. Why did he decide he had to become a donkey-targetman? Pity. But he's not International quality, not even close. Sadly, I think the only position on the pitch we're lacking in World Class players, is up front (and in goal!). Rooney, that's it. One good striker, and one good striker isn't enough.
I don't care who broadcast it, it is ITV that is presenting it, it is their name in the corner, it is broadcast for them. If people don't complain to ITV, they will have no motivation to prevent it happening, either by highlighting the issue with the company that handles broadcasting, or replacing that company. But they will only be able to take action if viewers make them aware of the issue.
This is the company ITV has chosen to do the work, the company that ITV has chosen to represent them. When that company screws up, it is reflecting on itv, and itv are the ones who will take the brunt of the criticism.
Someone mentioned BBC being given footie and the response was they also outsource their broadcasting. That may well be true, but bbc don't have commercials in their playlist, so won't have them interrupting a broadcast, so the suggestion would provide an improvement.
I'm sleepy and rambling. Sorry.
This is the company ITV has chosen to do the work, the company that ITV has chosen to represent them. When that company screws up, it is reflecting on itv, and itv are the ones who will take the brunt of the criticism.
Someone mentioned BBC being given footie and the response was they also outsource their broadcasting. That may well be true, but bbc don't have commercials in their playlist, so won't have them interrupting a broadcast, so the suggestion would provide an improvement.
I'm sleepy and rambling. Sorry.
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portlock seagull
Well-known member
- Jul 28, 2003
- 17,787
ARSE
beorhthelm
A. Virgo, Football Genius
- Jul 21, 2003
- 36,029
comical. you acknowledge you didnt see the game, yet profess Heskey is rubbish? no, he offers nothing except creating space and goal scoring opportuities for others.
so he missed a 1 on 1, it wasnt great, but thats not his thing. as for the ad break debate, watched on ordinary terrestrial ITV and had no dodgy ads (though still subjected to the shite commentary)... surely someone at ITV HD division f***ed up the broadcast?
He played a major part in our goal. He allowed Rooney to drop deep, he pulled a defender out and played the ball off giving Gerrard the ball and space to run clear. That is fact. Not typical nsc "I think... FACT!" Actual fact. Backed up by video footage of it happening and all.
The one-on-one is a generous definition considering there was a defender on his shoulder and he shot from the edge of the area, a distance from which top strikers have been stopped with enough frequency for it not to be noteworthy.
That's not to say he was perfect, or that he couldn't do better, and personally I thought he should have come off sooner. But when he played such a key part in the goal it's simply wrong to say he offers nothing.
And regarding the discussion elsewhere in the thread about Lennon, every one of his crosses I noticed were over hit, and/or behind the england players.
murraymints4brighton
Well-known member
Have to agree and due to ITV's shoddy broadcasting of late I wouldn't be surprised if they continue to use the same company and I wonder if it is the same one the did the Chelsea v Liverpool champions league game? Remember the tick tack advert coming on when Liverpool? scored? It's happened before...
Ninja Elephant
Doctor Elephant
- Feb 16, 2009
- 18,855
No, Heskey offers nothing that Crouch doesn't, and Crouch gives you a goal threat aswell. Heskey won't score another goal for England. He's never been good enough, and we'll never win a World Cup with him up front. Either play Rooney up front alone from now on, or play Crouch. The longer we insist on putting up with Heskey, the longer it will be until we actually threaten to win something.
The team for the next game is going to be very interesting.
The team for the next game is going to be very interesting.
I now remember it happening in the Chelsea Liverpool match but what happened in the FA Cup final (did they miss the only goal?) - which final?
Absolute f*cking nonsense.
Heskey was BRILLIANT tonight, completely did his job, if Rooney had done his we would've won 2 or 3-1. Offers next to nothing? You clearly don't understand the first thing about football if you think he offered nothing tonight.
Southwick_Seagull
Well-known member
- Oct 8, 2008
- 2,035
Twat. You know nothing about football.
Heskey is SUPERB positionally. Crouch isn't.
Heskey pulls defenders out of position. Crouch doesn't.
Heskey brings the best out of Rooney. Crouch doesn't.
Guivarc'h played up front in ALL of France 98s WORLD CUP WINNING team. Upfront. He scored NO goals.
Four reasons why you're utterly wrong.
Ninja Elephant
Doctor Elephant
- Feb 16, 2009
- 18,855
No, nothing wrong with my understanding of football. Heskey wouldn't even be considered by a Nation with good strikers. We have Rooney, and then fillers. The difference between us and everyone else, is that we're relying on a useless lump up front who can do nothing but hold the ball up. He's an awful individual player doing his very best. I've nothing against the man, he's a passionate Englishman doing his very best for the country and the team. But it doesn't mean he's doing any good. By all accounts he played well today, and he played a large part in the goal. But his finish when through on the goalkeeper... well. Rooney would have scored. Lampard, Gerrard, Joe Cole.. maybe even Milner.. they would have scored. But our STRIKER didn't know what to do with it, and did nothing with it. Poor, and that's not good enough.
If you want to excuse him and say he adds something to the team, go ahead. But don't start getting offensive when the opposite view is offered. It's not like I'm in the minority for thinking he's an awful player.
"Heskey brings the best out of Rooney". When did Rooney last score a goal for England? All your 4 things above, with the exception of the Frenchman (we'll forget that France had the best player in the World supporting him), are opinions that can be debated. But not by me. I've not got the patience at this time of day to bang my head against a brick wall, because that's all it would be. Few people on this forum actually want to debate anything, they just want to namecall and be dismissive.
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murraymints4brighton
Well-known member
Yet again you spout more in-concise rubbish. "He offers next to nothing" f*** wit grading of 8/10. Lampard? People seem to be trying to justify his position in the team yet he is piss poor for England, or at least has been since Euro 2004. And unless I am mistaken it was HESKEY getting the assist for the goal? " What happened to Heskey? I remember his 20 goal season at Liverpool" f*** wit rating of 5/10. About 10 years and minus Owen is what has happened. He has also NEVER scored or looked like scoring that many for England so why should it surprise you. He creates. If we lump the ball up pitch, which every England side have done, he is there and wins them 80% of the time. He may not score many, but his role is pivotal to Rooney, Gerrard and hopefully fat Frank scoring for us.
"Not International quality, not even close" f*** wit rating of 10/10. How many caps has he got? How many tournaments has he been part of? who played in nearly all our qualifying games under Capello?...
"One good striker" f*** wit rating of 3/10. Err how many goals has Crouch got for England? How many has Defoe scored for Tottenham this year? We must have some good strikers if Darren Bent can score over 20 goals in the best league in the world and not get in. However they do HAVE to deliver at this world cup.
There are 3 main problem areas. The Gerrard/Lampard combo, The left side of the midfield/4-4-2 and who is our NO.1 goalkeeper. Heskey was great today, if you are going to criticize someone look elsewhere.
murraymints4brighton
Well-known member
Jokes aside, I wonder what bobby would have been like coming off the bench instead of Crouch, or even starting ahead of Heskey. Without being overly biased I think Heskey is a very good player, but I can't help feeling that Bobby Z would have offered that little bit more creative spark.
Ninja Elephant
Doctor Elephant
- Feb 16, 2009
- 18,855
" What happened to Heskey? I remember his 20 goal season at Liverpool" f*** wit rating of 5/10. About 10 years and minus Owen is what has happened. He has also NEVER scored or looked like scoring that many for England so why should it surprise you. He creates. If we lump the ball up pitch, which every England side have done, he is there and wins them 80% of the time. He may not score many, but his role is pivotal to Rooney, Gerrard and hopefully fat Frank scoring for us.
"Not International quality, not even close" f*** wit rating of 10/10. How many caps has he got? How many tournaments has he been part of? who played in nearly all our qualifying games under Capello?...
"One good striker" f*** wit rating of 3/10. Err how many goals has Crouch got for England? How many has Defoe scored for Tottenham this year? We must have some good strikers if Darren Bent can score over 20 goals in the best league in the world and not get in. However they do HAVE to deliver at this world cup.
There are 3 main problem areas. The Gerrard/Lampard combo, The left side of the midfield/4-4-2 and who is our NO.1 goalkeeper. Heskey was great today, if you are going to criticize someone look elsewhere.
Say what you like about my posts, this is one of the worst I've ever read on here. You're one of the people I mentioned in my last post. You decide what you're going to respond by who posted the comment, not by the content. I'll never understand the need to be offensive, either. If we were having this conversation in a pub, it would go very differently.
beorhthelm
A. Virgo, Football Genius
- Jul 21, 2003
- 36,029
nothing except Crouch cannot actually control any aerial ball if he wins it, and he only scores against poorer grade opposition where the defense are too shit to see past his height. dont get me wrong i like Crouch but he is not a good targetman, while Heskey is probably the best target man there is (just wish he had more cofidence in front of goal on his own). personally i think the problem with play either is we lump the ball up to bypass midfield, rather than keep it down and use the wings were we are quite strong.
yes it does rather, and i recall theres a similar correlation with Owen's scoring record too.