[News] Nigel Farage and Reform

[dsr-burnley]

Pre-Blair?? You mean the Thatcher era - Thatcher who did more to divide this country into the haves and have nots than anyone else. Thatcher who broke the industrial base of the country - the base which held together vast communities.

That's the breakdown in communities right there.

The Lancashire cotton industry was almost extinct before 1979. No doubt other industries were struggling, though the motor industry was still strong with British Leyland!

BBC - Nation on Film - Decline of the cotton industry

Witness the rise and fall of the Lancashire cotton industry in the North West of Engalnd

www.bbc.co.uk

The primary reason for the decline of factory work was cheap overseas labour and globalisation. We could still have plenty of heavy industry if there were more people who wanted to work in factory conditions for very low wages. But of course there aren't.

 

[BadFish]

Food banks are a prime example of Margaret Thatcher's point. You might feel they are being run by "society", but they aren't. They are being run by the individual men and women that she was referring to.

Prosperity was undoubtedly improved in the period 1979-1991. Whether or not that was a good thing is a moot point.

No I don't feel like they are being run by 'society', they are run by a charity. If they were being run by society, and society was valued as a method of looking after everyone then no one would feel the need to point out who is paying for stuff.

I would imagine the numbers show an improvement in prosperity during the Thatcher's reign. Just as you can use the numbers to show that the UK has the 7th (is that right? ) largest economy in the world. I don't really think that a country's GDP is a great measure of how everyone is doing because it doesn't explain where the money is going.

I would suggest that if you have the 7th largest GDP in the world and still need food banks then you could run your economy better.

 

[5Ways Gull]

Which good old days?
Paying the panel every Friday to clear the doctor’s bill?
Rationing?
Polio?
Diptheria?
Moors Murders?
Three day week?
IRA bombings?
Rampant inflation?
Women not being allowed to open bank accounts on their own or have a credit card?

National Service? ...oh hang on.

 

[nicko31]

Farage prefers feelings over logic. Big feelings are what is needed to vote Reform.

Reform is all about feelings over facts, as soon as Farage gets into any detail he gets tetchy.

Incidentally, did he get to see the Orange man in the end during the latest trip?

 

[BadFish]

Reform is all about feelings over facts, as soon as Farage gets into any detail he gets tetchy.

Incidentally, did he get to see the Orange man in the end during the latest trip?

Not sure, but I would imagine he has been back a while, safely ensconsed in Clacton, serving his electorate in a tireless and and selfless manner.

 

[BadFish]

Not sure, but I would imagine he has been back a while, safely ensconsed in Clacton, serving his electorate in a tireless and and selfless manner.

.

Bloody wrong again BadFish, with yer woke agenda!!!!

He was in fact last heard of in the US, tweeting some racist tosh about the Leeds riots and the 'sub continent'.

If I had the technical wherewithal, motivation and time I would create a website that showed Nigel's whereabouts at any given time. This would amuse me.

Perhaps the site can play a notification sound or send out a tweet whenever he is in Clacton or Westminster.

 

[The Clamp]

When people used to talk and Communities used to have a crack with one another.

How do we get back there?
Well there is a question.

How would you do it?

Or are you happy in the way our country is now?

Communities do still talk. People do have craic with one another.

Perhaps they just don’t do it with you?

 

[beorhthelm]

I would suggest that if you have the 7th largest GDP in the world and still need food banks then you could run your economy better.

maybe, though every european nation has foodbanks. are they all running economies badly? or perhaps it says something about how we provide some social services, insisting on general payments rather than targeted aid.

 

[The Clamp]

I know the question wasn't directed at me, but IMHO I'd like to go back to 2012. Specifically the period of the London Olympics, it felt like we (Britain) were a welcoming, inclusive, multicultural society working together and celebrating the Olympics together. I think that was peak UK.

It kinda went downhill from there.

Funnily enough, I think the Olympics opening ceremony pushed us towards leaving the EU.

 

[BadFish]

maybe, though every european nation has foodbanks. are they all running economies badly? or perhaps it says something about how we provide some social services, insisting on general payments rather than targeted aid.

Yeah I would say that if lots of your people need food banks then the economy could be run better. Especially when a chunk of those people are in employment.

My point though was more about using GDP as a measure of prosperity without acknowledging how that prosperity is distributed.

 

[BadFish]

Funnily enough, I think the Olympics opening ceremony pushed us towards leaving the EU.

Interesting idea, why do you think that?

 

[de la zouch]

Regardless of which party controlled those individual councils, the REASON they were in difficulty has a lot more to do with huge cuts in central government funding, than irresponsible local financial management.

If there is any worth in trying to apportion BLAME, then you'd need to cast your eye beyond the walls of the town hall.

A degree of truth, however what’s happening in Nottingham is almost entirely down to the ineptitude and possibly illegal activities of the Labour controlled council.
Have a google search, Robin Hood Energy, housing spend & Icelandic banks

 

[The Clamp]

Interesting idea, why do you think that?

I think it was incorrectly perceived as a nationalistic celebration of a past Britain we need to return to.

It was no such thing but people are odd.

 

[beorhthelm]

Yeah I would say that if lots of your people need food banks then the economy could be run better. Especially when a chunk of those people are in employment.

My point though was more about using GDP as a measure of prosperity without acknowledging how that prosperity is distributed.

agree GDP is flawed, or misused when applied to individuals. troubles its very difficult to track anything at lower granularity levels. it does though indicate general prosperity as the economy acts as a whole, all benefit from increasing GDP.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Funnily enough, I think the Olympics opening ceremony pushed us towards leaving the EU.

Interesting idea, why do you think that?

I agree with The Clamp; many foaming-at-the-mouth-right-wingers will have hated how multi-culturism was celebrated.

A brilliant book that alluded to this is Middle England by Jonathan Coe. I think I recommended this to you once, @The Clamp ?

 

[nicko31]

I think it was incorrectly perceived as a nationalistic celebration of a past Britain we need to return to.

It was no such thing but people are odd.

My thinking would be more along the lines of "this is an example of London getting all the good stuff and we get nothing here".

Time to f**k em over, Leave Europe that will upset them.

The reality is London has weathered the storm and left behind areas have been hit the hardest.

 

[dsr-burnley]

No I don't feel like they are being run by 'society', they are run by a charity. If they were being run by society, and society was valued as a method of looking after everyone then no one would feel the need to point out who is paying for stuff.

I would imagine the numbers show an improvement in prosperity during the Thatcher's reign. Just as you can use the numbers to show that the UK has the 7th (is that right? ) largest economy in the world. I don't really think that a country's GDP is a great measure of how everyone is doing because it doesn't explain where the money is going.

I would suggest that if you have the 7th largest GDP in the world and still need food banks then you could run your economy better.

The numbers show an average 28.4% increase in wages in real terms while Margaret Thatcher was PM. That's 2.1% p.a.

Measuring Worth - Annual RPI and Average Earnings for Britain

www.measuringworth.com

This compares with 1.1% p.a. under Major, 1.5% p.a. under Blair, and since then real wages have been falling - by 0.7% p.a. under Brown, 1.3% p.a. under the coalition, and 06.% p.a. under the Tories since then. That's what I mean by the increase in prosperity - nothing to do with GDP, just that wages rose.

 

[The Clamp]

My thinking would be more along the lines of "this is an example of London getting all the good stuff and we get nothing here".

Time to f**k em over, Leave Europe that will upset them.

The reality is London has weathered the storm and left behind areas have been hit the hardest.

Interesting point.

I’ve tried to find an essay I read which explains the idea much better than I could. I’ll keep looking.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Food banks are a prime example of Margaret Thatcher's point. You might feel they are being run by "society", but they aren't. They are being run by the individual men and women that she was referring to.

Prosperity was undoubtedly improved in the period 1979-1991. Whether or not that was a good thing is a moot point.

No food bank that I know of is run by an individual. Volunteers take it in turns to be present, and many people donate.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

No I don't feel like they are being run by 'society', they are run by a charity. If they were being run by society, and society was valued as a method of looking after everyone then no one would feel the need to point out who is paying for stuff.

I would imagine the numbers show an improvement in prosperity during the Thatcher's reign. Just as you can use the numbers to show that the UK has the 7th (is that right? ) largest economy in the world. I don't really think that a country's GDP is a great measure of how everyone is doing because it doesn't explain where the money is going.

I would suggest that if you have the 7th largest GDP in the world and still need food banks then you could run your economy better.

There is the Trussel Trust which is a charity, but I know of many churches running food banks so therefore part of society.