Middlesbrough's goals analysed

[Dick Knights Mumm]

The critisicm of Stockdale comes from between 8 and 9 secs in when he went down and made no attempt to push, stop or divert the ball, that is the only critisicm I have.

Just can't see it. If that is the criticism it is barely worth making. Let alone repeating.

 

[Mellotron]

I don't blame Stockdale. It's just for SO MANY of our goals I can't help but think "he could've done a bit better with that."

At no point does it feel like our penalty box is HIS box. Schmeichel was king of owning his own box. You saw it in Kuszczak and even in Kuipers at times. Stockdale doesn't own his box, if anything he's behind on rent payments.

 

[Hastings gull]

Thanks for the still. He certainly looks closer than DS, agreed, but I saw it from a different angle. what the still doesn't show is when he actually took the touch. Anyway, we could argue this all day. Thanks for the reply.

 

[Mellotron]

Thanks for the still. He certainly looks closer than DS, agreed, but I saw it from a different angle. what the still doesn't show is when he actually took the touch. Anyway, we could argue this all day. Thanks for the reply.

This. From the vantage point in WSU there was definitely a split second where Stockdale could've come and taken ball and man, but hesitated.

 

[Napier's Knee]

thanks for these. I need to apologise to Stockdale - I thought he might have been slightly to blame for the second. He did exactly what any good goalkeeper would do in both situations - but most good goalkeepers are also backed up by defenders playing in a sensible system. And as i've said before, I don't blame the defenders either.

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

I don't blame Stockdale. It's just for SO MANY of our goals I can't help but think "he could've done a bit better with that."

At no point does it feel like our penalty box is HIS box. Schmeichel was king of owning his own box. You saw it in Kuszczak and even in Kuipers at times. Stockdale doesn't own his box, if anything he's behind on rent payments.

To me Stockdale does command his box. He is excellent coming off his line and claiming the ball. He loves the sweeper/keeper business. He loves passing the ball.

His mistakes have been that. Mistakes. There have been a worrying number - but he is having to settle into a new club, new town, new system. Give the bloke a chance.

He will be fine for the Albion. I hope he is with us for many years.

 

[Bozza]

Thanks for the still. He certainly looks closer than DS, agreed, but I saw it from a different angle. what the still doesn't show is when he actually took the touch. Anyway, we could argue this all day. Thanks for the reply.

This. From the vantage point in WSU there was definitely a split second where Stockdale could've come and taken ball and man, but hesitated.

I've watched it on Player a few times now too - this is just as the forward plays the ball with his heavy touch. I really don't think he could have got there unless he'd been reckless earlier and raced off his line. The subsequent result of the forward slotting into an empty net would have had Stockdale getting all kinds of grief.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Incorrect - If you look at the bottom left image, you can see Stockdale pointing to Dunk to stay with his man, as Stockdale comes out to engage the winger. This would be the correct thing to do, it forced the winger to shoot rather than cross and after that the deflection from Stockdale to Tomlin was unfortunate.

As mentioned elsewhere, the key is for Greer not to give the ball away when your full backs are so high up the pitch.

If Dunk has done as he's been told by his keeper, then that error is therefore Stockdale's rather than Dunk's in terms of the positioning and Dunk has done little wrong if he's obeyed instructions. In that instance in my opinion (and as part of the centre halves union) the defender has to close the ball down, not the keeper. When you watch it again, had Dunk instinctively gone for the ball as soon as Greer lost it (not on the youtube clip), he wouldn't have been far off on top of the winger as he entered the box, and a good chance of blocking any shot/cross himself - if he crosses it then that is Stockdale's to try to deal with it from the middle of his goal.

As it happened, Stockdale actually allows him to run in to pretty much 10 yards out before he comes off his line - when he does, he's out of the game with a block Dunk could have made and the goal is left open for a rebound tap in (or bit of call into the top corner…).

Even with what I'm saying they'd have likely scored, but personally I'd rather have the situation of the winger being closed down, having to put a decent ball in and the striker beat the keeper, than the situation where the winger has a free unchallenged run to almost the 6 yard box, allowed to get a shot in.

The key is for Greer not to give the ball away - totally, but just thought we still got it a bit wrong thereafter.

 

[y2dave]

Great stuff, Mr T ... and a most interesting debate. I too fail to see the merit in playing full backs as wingers, wingers in central midfield, and midfielders as full backs. It makes absolutely no sense to me and certainly doesn't play to the strengths of the individual players.

Sadly this sums it up.

 

[hans kraay fan club]

I've watched it on Player a few times now too - this is just as the forward plays the ball with his heavy touch. I really don't think he could have got there unless he'd been reckless earlier and raced off his line. The subsequent result of the forward slotting into an empty net would have had Stockdale getting all kinds of grief.

View attachment 59477

This.

The only people who are blaming Stockdale for the first, are those who WANT to be blaming Stockdale.

Baffling.

 

[Mellotron]

the forward slotting into an empty net would have had Stockdale getting all kinds of grief.

But...that's exactly what DID happen. A striker did slot into an empty net because Stockdale didn't really try to claim the ball, so it was an easy pass across.

I think there is a bit of a depth perception issue with the angle from which your still is taken.

 

[Mellotron]

This.

The only people who are blaming Stockdale for the first, are those who WANT to be blaming Stockdale.

Baffling.

I don't have anything against Stockdale. I don't believe him to be fully to blame, but I certainly think he could've done better and many keepers would've handled the situation better. He hesitated. It's understandable, his confidence must be through the floor at the moment after the multiple apologies he's had to make recently (that's been an interesting one, people absolving DS of all blame even after he comes out and completely admits certain goals have been his fault), and now coming off social media altogether.

 

[Bladders]

This.

The only people who are blaming Stockdale for the first, are those who WANT to be blaming Stockdale.

Baffling.

I'm not blaming Stockdale for the first, though his attempt at going down to spread himself looked more like that of an outfield player who had been stuck in goal after the proper keeper had been sent off.

He doesn't seem to 'shape' himself like a keeper, looks very odd.

 

[Mellotron]

I'm not blaming Stockdale for the first, though his attempt at going down to spread himself looked more like that of an outfield player who had been stuck in goal after the proper keeper had been sent off.

He doesn't seem to 'shape' himself like a keeper, looks very odd.

Confidence. Lack thereof. As you say, he doesn't LOOK like a keeper at the moment. He looks like a bloke who'd rather be anywhere than in goal. And I don't blame him for that at all.

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

How did a thread about tactics turn into the blame game for Stockdale ? There are other threads.

 

[Bladders]

Confidence. Lack thereof. As you say, he doesn't LOOK like a keeper at the moment. He looks like a bloke who'd rather be anywhere than in goal. And I don't blame him for that at all.

The non penalty incident, he also looked awkward there as well, hesitation didn't help.

Confidence must be pretty low for him, especially after the Cardiff debacle.

 

[Mellotron]

How did a thread about tactics turn into the blame game for Stockdale ? There are other threads.

It didn't. Pretty much everyone here is saying they aren't solely blaming Stockdale. It is as a result of the tactics that he is being left exposed at points.

The buck stops at Hyppia. The system ISN'T working with the players being put out. It needs tweaking. I'm generally in the "give managers time" camp but if Hyppia persists with a system that is clearly pretty flawed then he will need to start taking some blame. Up to him now to try a few other things out, we don't have the players to play exactly as he wants right now.

 

[hans kraay fan club]

Confidence must be pretty low for him, especially after the Cardiff debacle.

The lot of a keeper is fcking shit sometimes (and I've played there long enough to know), and this quote sums it up. Two big momnets for Stockdale in that game. One appalling error and one absolutely terrific point-blank save. Its akin to a striker missing an absolute sitter, but then curling in a worldy.

For the striker the miss is forgotten and he's a hero for scoring the second. For the keeper the great save is forgotten and he's a villain.

Bit shit really.

 

[Bozza]

But...that's exactly what DID happen. A striker did slot into an empty net because Stockdale didn't really try to claim the ball, so it was an easy pass across.

I think there is a bit of a depth perception issue with the angle from which your still is taken.

We'll have to agree to disagree. From what was clearly a very dangerous attacking position, the Albion defence had recovered reasonably well. From my still above, if Stockdale stays on his line, the ball is crossed in front of him and behind our defence for them to easily score at the back post. As it is, Stockdale does enough to prevent a direct shot on goal and the recovering Albion defenders have a reasonable handle on those rushing forward.

We got a bit unlucky in that the cross was blocked by us but fell directly to Tomlin who finished pretty smartly into the top corner.

 

[Bladders]

The lot of a keeper is fcking shit sometimes (and I've played there long enough to know), and this quote sums it up. Two big momnets for Stockdale in that game. One appalling error and one absolutely terrific point-blank save. Its akin to a striker missing an absolute sitter, but then curling in a worldy.

For the striker the miss is forgotten and he's a hero for scoring the second. For the keeper the great save is forgotten and he's a villain.

Bit shit really.

Fair points, but the nature of the first goal was so amateurish it sticks out more than a point blank save, which is a 50/50 anyway at that range.

I was a GK myself as well by the way.