Main Coronavirus / Covid-19 Discussion Thread

[The Clamp]

In the UK, that would mean over 50 million people catch it. Most would be fine, but millions would need a high level of care, which clearly wouldn't be available, as hospitals can't take on an extra few million patients. A lack of care would mean a higher fatality rate, but even if it was only 1%, then that's half a million deaths, as well as the other deaths caused by an NHS which wouldn't be able to cope.

If we can slow the spread down and hope that summer also helps stop it, we can hopefully keep the pressure on medical staff down, and hopefully have a vaccine ready before as much as 80% of the population get it.

Why would panicking put much more strain on medical services? Having a rampant, unchecked virus is what would put the most strain on medical services.
They have started applying restrictions because of the high rate of infection. Obviously had they had the restrictions in place earlier, the infections wouldn't have been so high.

They were talking about this on R4, a specialist in pandemic control pointed out that Italy actually had restrictions in place before the high infection rate. Closed schools, shutdown of public transport, no flights etc. Despite this, they have one of the highest infection rates in Europe.
To summarise he said that these restrictions don’t actually slow down the infection rate that much. It’s a virus. It will travel whatever the restrictions in place.
Authorities need to be seen to be doing something but measures are pretty ineffective.
As mentioned by many experts, all you can do is concentrate on helping the most vulnerable, work on a vaccine and let it run its course.
The rest is just ineffective placating which has the opposite effect and panics people rather than reassuring them.

Maybe they’re wrong, maybe I’m wrong to believe them but it makes the most sense to me.

It’s an opinion based on debates I’ve listened to. Either way, I guarantee you millions are not going to die in the UK.

 

[KoreanSeagull]

Here at South Korea, things got far worse comparing to a month ago.

People are desperate to get a mask, some people wait more than 5 hours to get 2 masks.
The price got higher as well. was originally about 30 pence but now If you buy from independent sellers you have to pay at least 2 pounds.

The place with the most infectees, Daegu ( over 5000 ) Most restaurants, Tourism destinations, library ... etc are closed.

I was at Daegu for work when the infection rate soared suddenly, so I had to stay in house for 14 days afterwards.

The first semester was supposed to start last week, but all school schedule is postponed until March 23th.

Hope It'll get better soon in both countries.

Virus didn't kill me, but Palace game nearly did

 

[Triggaaar]

They were talking about this on R4, a specialist in pandemic control pointed out that Italy actually had restrictions in place before the high infection rate. Closed schools, shutdown of public transport, no flights etc.

Did Italy close schools and shutdown public transport, and stop flights for no reason at all? No, they did it because they had the highest number of cases in Europe. But by that point, many people had just contracted the virus and hadn't yet shown symptoms, so they were closing the doors after the horse had bolted. I'd need to listen to their comments to be sure what they were getting at, but the virus was widespread in Italy before they started closing things down.

To summarise he said that these restrictions don’t actually slow down the infection rate that much. It’s a virus. It will travel whatever the restrictions in place.

That doesn't appear to be the case in China, where the spread of the virus has been hugely limited by the extreme restrictions there. Virus aren't some intelligent life-form with a plan, they simply spread from person to person. Obviously they're not going to spread as much if people are restricted.

Authorities need to be seen to be doing something but measures are pretty ineffective.

China.

As mentioned by many experts, all you can do is concentrate on helping the most vulnerable, work on a vaccine and let it run its course.

That is not what the experts around the world are saying. They are saying that it's too late to stop the spread of the virus, but we can slow it down, and slowing it down gives us time to work on a vaccine and can also prevent hospitals being overloaded. The number of people that require hospital treatment, who would go on to recover with the right care, is extremely high.

The rest is just ineffective placating which has the opposite effect and panics people rather than reassuring them.

Most of us here aren't panicking. Quite a few of us are concerned about what it will do to our NHS and most vulnerable people, but we're not panicking. But if we don't slow down the spread of the virus, and we quickly head towards 80% of the population having it, then you'll see panic. And death.

Maybe they’re wrong, maybe I’m wrong to believe them but it makes the most sense to me.

I believe what the experts are telling us, but somehow we're either listening to very different experts, or interpreting what they're saying differently.

 

[Triggaaar]

Hope It'll get better soon in both countries.

Both? It's not particularly an issue here yet, but it will be.

Virus didn't kill me

Did you contract the virus?

 

[The Clamp]

Sorry you’re wrong, because it’s an over reaction due to 96 year who was lucky to not be bombed in the war, never had a dangerous illness or got a life threatening disease or got cancer. She never had a days illness in life so why would anyone else. Might as well shut down the nhs, don’t need it.

It’s silly reactions like this that make it hard to see the facts. Very unhelpful.

 

[The Clamp]

Did Italy close schools and shutdown public transport, and stop flights for no reason at all? No, they did it because they had the highest number of cases in Europe. But by that point, many people had just contracted the virus and hadn't yet shown symptoms, so they were closing the doors after the horse had bolted. I'd need to listen to their comments to be sure what they were getting at, but the virus was widespread in Italy before they started closing things down.

That doesn't appear to be the case in China, where the spread of the virus has been hugely limited by the extreme restrictions there. Virus aren't some intelligent life-form with a plan, they simply spread from person to person. Obviously they're not going to spread as much if people are restricted.

China.
That is not what the experts around the world are saying. They are saying that it's too late to stop the spread of the virus, but we can slow it down, and slowing it down gives us time to work on a vaccine and can also prevent hospitals being overloaded. The number of people that require hospital treatment, who would go on to recover with the right care, is extremely high.

Most of us here aren't panicking. Quite a few of us are concerned about what it will do to our NHS and most vulnerable people, but we're not panicking. But if we don't slow down the spread of the virus, and we quickly head towards 80% of the population having it, then you'll see panic. And death.

I believe what the experts are telling us, but somehow we're either listening to very different experts, or interpreting what they're saying differently.

I’m not getting into one of your endless multi quote epics but yuh are wrong. Italy got the high rate of infection DESPITE restrictions. The restrictions were there BEFORE the high infection rate. That’s why the doctor mentioned it as a pertinent point.
Often the correct responses seem counter-intuitive.

As for the rest, time will tell.

 

[Triggaaar]

I’m not getting into one of your endless multi quote epics but yuh are wrong.

 

[KoreanSeagull]

Both? It's not particularly an issue here yet, but it will be.

Did you contract the virus?

Hope it dosen't get worse like here!

I didn't, but was suggested to be isolated by much people.

나의 LGM-G600L 의 Tapatalk에서 보냄

 

[Triggaaar]

Hope it dosen't get worse like here!

I'm kinda expecting it will. Unless the precautions currently being taken, along with a change in weather, helps us out.

I didn't, but was suggested to be isolated by much people.

Presumably you're still at risk of getting it then (although young and healthy I trust).

 

[wellquickwoody]

It’s not the media that are overblowing so much. The government have openly announced that they are preparing for 100,000 deaths. Have the media sensationalised this? No.

Orwellian political procedure dictates that a government full of privileged, power hungry nasty talentless pigs (such as the one we have) should create a ‘common enemy’ (Coronavirus) to deflect from their own incompetence and shady decisions. The media are underplaying their messages now because they know what the awful cretins are up to.

Top things to deflect:

1. Huge tax cuts for the rich and privileged in the next budget.
2. Priti Patel.
3. The vanished ‘Russian report’.
4. The Prime Minister’s compulsive lies.
5. Priti Patel.

Now is the time to grow up, and stop being a childish, point scoring , wannabe politician.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Never been easier getting a table at one of the better Chinese restaurants in Chinatown. When we left at 9 am half the tables were empty - unheard of for a Saturday night.

Expected better of my fellow New Yorkers

Same in London. https://www.theguardian.com/food/20...ct-of-solidarity-that-also-gets-me-roast-duck Absurd.

I shall be showing solidarity with my Italian friends on Saturday and taking my usual seat at Cin Cin (it’s only air kisses and no touching when I arrive at the AMEX though).

 

[Giraffe]

There really does need to be a sense of proportion here.

We have had just 3 cases in West Sussex and they were were all related to that Surrey person.

None in East Sussex.

7 in Brighton and Hove - all related to Steve Walsh outbreak a few weeks ago.

It’s not exactly rampant in these parts is it.

Oh and there have been none in Wolverhampton yet either.

 

[AmexRuislip]

Same in London. https://www.theguardian.com/food/20...ct-of-solidarity-that-also-gets-me-roast-duck Absurd.

I shall be showing solidarity with my Italian friends on Saturday and taking my usual seat at Cin Cin (it’s only air kisses and no touching when I arrive at the AMEX though).

What about on peak times on the tube.
People stick their elbows out to create space, now elbow is the new greeting, they'll be a lot of over familiarity on the tube

 

[Triggaaar]

There really does need to be a sense of proportion here.

Yep.

It’s not exactly rampant in these parts is it.

Nope, it's not. But you'd be mad to think we're not going to get a lot more cases. Guinness Boy was repeatedly telling us there had been only 15 cases. Fifteen! One week later and it was over 200. It'll be a thousand before long, but if we can control it a little, just by people being more careful (less personal contact, more personal hygiene) then great.

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

It’s silly reactions like this that make it hard to see the facts. Very unhelpful.

Think you’ll find your post triggered the response. Post bollox get bollox in reply. Not trying to be helpful.

 

[The Clamp]

A calm, realistic take on the virus and the reaction to it;

Abdu Sharkawy - Doctor and infectious diseases specialist.


I'm a doctor and an Infectious Diseases Specialist. I've been at this for more than 20 years seeing sick patients on a daily basis. I have worked in inner city hospitals and in the poorest slums of Africa. HIV-AIDS, Hepatitis,TB, SARS, Measles, Shingles, Whooping cough, Diphtheria...there is little I haven't been exposed to in my profession. And with notable exception of SARS, very little has left me feeling vulnerable, overwhelmed or downright scared.
I am not scared of Covid-19. I am concerned about the implications of a novel infectious agent that has spread the world over and continues to find new footholds in different soil. I am rightly concerned for the welfare of those who are elderly, in frail health or disenfranchised who stand to suffer mostly, and disproportionately, at the hands of this new scourge. But I am not scared of Covid-19.

What I am scared about is the loss of reason and wave of fear that has induced the masses of society into a spellbinding spiral of panic, stockpiling obscene quantities of anything that could fill a bomb shelter adequately in a post-apocalyptic world. I am scared of the N95 masks that are stolen from hospitals and urgent care clinics where they are actually needed for front line healthcare providers and instead are being donned in airports, malls, and coffee lounges, perpetuating even more fear and suspicion of others. I am scared that our hospitals will be overwhelmed with anyone who thinks they " probably don't have it but may as well get checked out no matter what because you just never know..." and those with heart failure, emphysema, pneumonia and strokes will pay the price for overfilled ER waiting rooms with only so many doctors and nurses to assess.
I am scared that travel restrictions will become so far reaching that weddings will be canceled, graduations missed and family reunions will not materialize. And well, even that big party called the Olympic Games...that could be kyboshed too. Can you even
imagine?
I'm scared those same epidemic fears will limit trade, harm partnerships in multiple sectors, business and otherwise and ultimately culminate in a global recession.

But mostly, I'm scared about what message we are telling our kids when faced with a threat. Instead of reason, rationality, openmindedness and altruism, we are telling them to panic, be fearful, suspicious, reactionary and self-interested.
Covid-19 is nowhere near over. It will be coming to a city, a hospital, a friend, even a family member near you at some point. Expect it. Stop waiting to be surprised further. The fact is the virus itself will not likely do much harm when it arrives. But our own behaviors and "fight for yourself above all else" attitude could prove disastrous.

I implore you all. Temper fear with reason, panic with patience and uncertainty with education. We have an opportunity to learn a great deal about health hygiene and limiting the spread of innumerable transmissible diseases in our society. Let's meet this challenge together in the best spirit of compassion for others, patience, and above all, an unfailing effort to seek truth, facts and knowledge as opposed to conjecture, speculation and catastrophizing.
Facts not fear. Clean hands. Open hearts.
Our children will thank us for it.

 

[The Clamp]

Think you’ll find your post triggered the response. Post bollox get bollox in reply. Not trying to be helpful.

I did not claim you were trying to be helpful. I said you were being unhelpful.

 

[Ernest]

Italy about to stop all Serie A matches even behind closed doors, teams ready to kick off at Parma and now been delayed, pathetic

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

I did not claim you were trying to be helpful. I said you were being unhelpful.

Why unhelpful?

You do come over as some holier than thou, listen to me I’m right type of person. I picked up on some stupid remarks followed by some more from you, that is all.

 

[The Clamp]

Why unhelpful?

You do come over as some holier than thou, listen to me I’m right type of person. I picked up on some stupid remarks followed by some more from you, that is all.

Not sure there’s any need for the personal insults but that’s up to you.
Sincerely hope your wife avoids the virus and all the best for her health.
I’m off out to mingle with the filthy masses, I’m gonna try and break my handshaking record today
All the best
TC