[Albion] “Losing the dressing room”

[Cheshire Cat]

I could never find the dressing room in the first place.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

He held one-on-one discussions with some squad members including Veltman....

“He talked with some players about the best way to bounce back, with the more experienced players and also with some young lads,” Veltman tells The Athletic. “I think he did well. Sometimes the gaffer makes his own decisions, but he wants to feel the situation in the room and that is what makes him a really good gaffer. He has a sense of what is going on in the dressing room."

Link to article here:

Who should we believe though? Veltman or Dave on the radio?

 

[Martlet]

Surely if he loses anything, it will be the locker room?

Great bounce back last night and I thought his post match interview was excellent.
Always thought we would need some patience this season … luckily we have an owner with plenty of it.

UTA!

 

[Littlemo]

Interesting, especially Veltman's comments.

The cigarette lighter did make me think of David Brent though.

I remember watching the Arsenal ‘All or Nothing’ documentary and thinking how cringeworthy all of Arteta’s dressing room stuff was. Maybe all the dressing room talks are just cringefests? I wonder if footballers are just a certain breed and are used to finding that stuff motivational, because I don’t know how in that documentary, some of them weren’t laughing. I would have been.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Of course it’s possible but it’s almost never permanent. Going into last week (away and against a better team) we had Enciso sulkily shipped out, Ferguson knowing he was going, two key midfielders mysteriously “injured” last minute, causing us to play a formation we can’t have practiced and attacking players being asked to track and cover as well as press. It was an unmitigated disaster.

The test was always going to be if the coach could recover from it, and he did. But slightly easier with the transfer window closed, Baleba back and an overall feeling of “that was a shitshow, let’s not do that again”.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Do you believe this is really a thing?
That consumate professionals like Dunk and Welbeck wouldn’t try in a game, to spite the manager?
Imo our senior players would give their all even if they have no faith in the manager whatsoever.
They are good people and responsible professionals.
What does “losing the dressing room” even mean?

Losing the dressing room doesn’t necessarily mean players are against the manager, but it can mean factions have developed, some players aren’t happy, aren’t trying as hard as others, are playing for themselves rather than the team, arguments, disharmony. I think it can happen to a good manager with a bad bunch as well as a bad manager with a good bunch.

Of course down to the manager to navigate this, sometimes the cause of it, sometimes the one who heals it, but it must happen especially with like say a ManUtd where the egos are just out of control.

 

[One Teddy Maybank]

Do you believe this is really a thing?
That consumate professionals like Dunk and Welbeck wouldn’t try in a game, to spite the manager?
Imo our senior players would give their all even if they have no faith in the manager whatsoever.
They are good people and responsible professionals.
What does “losing the dressing room” even mean?

It is a thing for me.

It’s not about not trying or minimal effort, it’s more about losing faith and questioning decisions, and the manner in which it’s done. Players fragmenting into groups, stories being leaked, basically a complete loss of respect.

There are always stronger personalities in the changing room and ‘leaders’, that’s nothing new. However, I don’t think that’s where we are at all, hopefully/clearly the players don’t like getting humiliated or even losing, so all of the ‘noise’ last week, was nonsense.

 

[Mr Bridger]

According to reports the Palace coach driver was loose in the dressing room.

 

[Weststander]

Yes. There’s numerous interviews with ex-pros where they’ve admitted it’s a thing.

Yes. And at Chelsea and Leicester certain players met the owners rep’s to get managers the sack.

 

[Silverhatch]

My worry was the players just aren't getting his tactics.

It has been a common refrain, that many observers don't see a consistent approach.

Yesterday was probably our best 90 minutes so far.

Maybe it's starting to gel.
I hope so.

I strongly suspect there has been some unrest in the camp though.
More out of frustration than anything else.

Of course there has been unrest. They’re elite competitors and KNOW they could be doing better. We’d be rightly f***ing furious if there hasn’t been some (constructive) criticism being offered.

 

[BUTTERBALL]

The players are playing for him without a shadow of a doubt - he got a response and then some!

 

[Change at Barnham]

It helps the manager's cause when he has a large squad and healthy competition within the dressing room for starting positions.
If anyone starts sulking or showing any negativity it makes it a lot easier to ignore and isolate them (Enciso?).
If you only have a small squad, I think that's when you run the risk of the tail starting to wag the dog.

 

[Greg Bobkin]

Lots of bollocks was written on here after the forest game.

The players blatantly can't get the manager sacked here. We're not run by short term thinkers

But we ARE supported by a few!

 

[Greg Bobkin]

Interesting, especially Veltman's comments.

The cigarette lighter did make me think of David Brent though.

I read that and thought 'I bet someone says he's like DB'

 

[Professor Plum]

The interesting thing for me was that in 2 of the turnaround games this season the senior pros have been cited as influential. Milner was apparently instrumental in the Spurs game at half time and Welbeck in another I've forgotten (no, I can't be arsed to find the links)

Similarly, some players oozed praise about RDZ (and others clearly couldn't stand him for balance). Steele said he changed his life and Gross waxed lyrical about him.

No one seems to say anything about FH good or bad from the camp. We haven't much out of Ferguson or Enciso who I thought might gob off. I'd love to know what the players really think.

Read the Athletic article to get an idea of what the players think of him. You seem to have a downer on FH. He said at the outset that he was relying on the senior players for support, and that’s what he’s got. I’m not sure why Enciso and Ferguson should 'gob off' about the manager or the club. They are still contracted to us and are dependent on Brighton helping them take the next step in their careers - whether that’s with us or not.

 

[Professor Plum]

Interesting, especially Veltman's comments.

The cigarette lighter did make me think of David Brent though.

And I thought it an effective gesture. I can think of at least a couple of times in my career when managers have ripped up a document in front of a meeting to get a point across about things needing to change. It gets the point across much more vividly than just muttering a few platitudes about having to do better.

 

[Greg Bobkin]

He held one-on-one discussions with some squad members including Veltman....

“He talked with some players about the best way to bounce back, with the more experienced players and also with some young lads,” Veltman tells The Athletic. “I think he did well. Sometimes the gaffer makes his own decisions, but he wants to feel the situation in the room and that is what makes him a really good gaffer. He has a sense of what is going on in the dressing room."

Link to article here:

Naylor? What does HE know?



Very decent article, that.

 

[hart's shirt]

Do you believe this is really a thing?

Based on what I've seen at our club and others, yes, I do.

IMHO the last time for us was the end of Hughton's reign. Those 0-5 and 0-2 home defeats to Bournemouth and Cardiff in 4 days were abject for a side set up pragmatically.

3 wins out of the last 23 league games. None in the last 9. Another week longer and we'd possibly have gone down. Despite more wins than us, Cardiff just ran out of road.

For a calm and considered Tony Bloom to pull the trigger a day after the end of the season spoke volumes.

Every manager has a sell-by date. As good a job as he did to take us up and keep us up, Hughton had clearly reached his with us.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I remember watching the Arsenal ‘All or Nothing’ documentary and thinking how cringeworthy all of Arteta’s dressing room stuff was. Maybe all the dressing room talks are just cringefests? I wonder if footballers are just a certain breed and are used to finding that stuff motivational, because I don’t know how in that documentary, some of them weren’t laughing. I would have been.

Some of us on NSC are a rum lot.
I know I am.
So, conventional motivational stuff has me twitching to flip the bird.

That said, I have to do 'motivational' occasionally with my students.
A bit hit and miss.
One year I got a round of applause (unheard of for final year students).
Another year a student (admittedly only one out of 70) gave me some shirty feedback on course appraisal.
Apparently I had insulted students for being lazy rote-learning oaves who don't listen to advice.
What can I say?

 

[7dialssouthpaw]

Mourinho and Chelsea was a memorable example. The players, led by Fabregas (IMO) and with the exception of Willian (IMO), carried out a "work to rule" after Mourinho's spat with the phsyios. (2015-16) A clique of players basically stopped making an effort and he ended up sacked.