[Politics] Liz Truss **RESIGNS 20/10/2022**

[Frutos]

From a Mail on Sunday political commentator:

 

[Half Time Pies]

The thread ban was spot on. Would like to read about the Trusterfuck and fall out instead of a theory which is a complete irrelevance to the current goings on.

Yes the MMT stuff is completely off topic but theres obviously a lot of interest in it, even from people who seem to have a extreme aversion to the very idea! For those that are interested I will leave this here: a technical analysis of UK government spending from researchers at the University College London, which proves that the commonly claimed idea that the UK Government has no agency to create money and must instead obtain funding from taxpayers or lenders is fundamentally not true!

https://www.ucl.ac.uk/bartlett/public-purpose/sites/bartlett_public_purpose/files/the_self-financing_state_an_institutional_analysis_of_government_expenditure_revenue_collection_and_debt_issuance_operations_in_the_united_kingdom.pdf

 

[Blues Guitarist]

Truss is toast

Cheese on toast

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I have heard BTL landlords bemoaning legislation protecting tenants and how it will effect their ability to pay the mortgage. I imagine sympathy will be in short supply among rising interest rates. I've always thought an interest only mortgage a fairly terrible idea personally.

We should be bit careful though, while we're a nation obsessed with home ownership. There is a need for a strong and affordable rental market, reducing supply doesn't support that.

A friend of mine bought an apartment in Hampstead on interest free, his plan was to live in this for about 20 years and sell up. He did this and recently bought a house in Hampstead Garden Suburbs for cash from the profit. I can see how it works in some situations.

As fir BTL...sadly interest rate hikes will most likely be partly passed onto tenants.

 

[jcdenton08]

Cheese on toast

Pork on toast

 

[Half Time Pies]

Hopefully this little experiment by Truss and her friends in the ERG and at the IEA and taxpayers alliance will finally put to bed the idea of the UK ending up as some sort of Libertarian utopia with small government, low taxation, zero regulation and trickledown economics. The idea that the UK was going to reproduce 'Reagonomics' without the worlds reserve currency has been seen through by the financial markets in 10 minutes and the public now can see clearly that this portion of the conservative party are only in existence to support the needs of the big business and the ultra rich.

 

[A1X]

 

[Frutos]

She is sending Penny Mordaunt to answer the UQ this afternoon.

 

[nicko31]

Hang in there Lizz, if they try and remove you just immediately go and see Charlie, dissolve parliament and call an election. We're all behind you, ignore the polls, its fake news

 

[A1X]

 

[Ethelwulf]

She is sending Penny Mordaunt to answer the UQ this afternoon.

Was just about to post this .

What a absolute disgrace. The latest opinion poll would make the SNP the official opposition with the tories on 43 seats
Truss has to go today and those f***ing tories never to get into power again
Been 12 years of lies and shit while the rich get rich and the poor get poorer
Just f*** off Truss you see you next Tuesday

 

[Pavilionaire]

Cheese on toast

^ That. Is. A. Disgrace!

 

[Audax]

I`ll keep it brief - MMT has not been discredited - please give evidence of this. MMT is a school of economic thought. All of economics is a pseudoscience in that sense as economic is a social science unlike chemistry or physics. MMT does not propose the unlimited printing of addtional money - where did you get that idea from? Some elements of MMT are undisputable observable facts or can be deduced from simple logic. For example, banks and the central government do create money out of thin air by keystrokes on a computer, and tax does not fund government spending in the UK as citizens must have money in their pockets first before they can pay tax, and the money of course is produced by the government or their agents, the banks. Also, yes I agree maybe MMT should have been called something else like modern monetary description but in addtion to the purely descriptive stuff, Professor Bill Mitchell and others have done a lot of work on issues like the need for a job guarantee and unemployment buffer stocks etc which involve a lot of theoretical work.

Name as many economies as you can who have successfully implemented MMT. I suspect the answer is "none" and it remains nothing more than a theory.

From what I understand of your posts about it in here, I suspect the reality is that it is a theory that won't actually work in the real world for the same reason that Truss' mini-budget failed: the financial markets won't accept it.

Edit: And I mean full MMT, not just the bits of it that overlap with existing implemented systems.

 

[Half Time Pies]

BTL landlords are amongst the last people I will be shedding a tear for, using renters to buy a property for them.

Is there anything wrong with this? The vast majority are everyday people with a single property used as an investment for retirement.

I was talking to a friend thats a landlord and he told me that the government in recent years has made it harder and harder for Landlords to make their properties financially viable, the system has been geared up to support large companies that own thousands of rental homes. He also just had a quote of 6.3% for a 5 years fixed mortgage!

 

[beorhthelm]

Yes the MMT stuff is completely off topic but theres obviously a lot of interest in it, even from people who seem to have a extreme aversion to the very idea! For those that are interested I will leave this here: a technical analysis of UK government spending from researchers at the University College London, which proves that the commonly claimed idea that the UK Government has no agency to create money and must instead obtain funding from taxpayers or lenders is fundamentally not true!

https://www.ucl.ac.uk/bartlett/public-purpose/sites/bartlett_public_purpose/files/the_self-financing_state_an_institutional_analysis_of_government_expenditure_revenue_collection_and_debt_issuance_operations_in_the_united_kingdom.pdf

other than the circluar "here's some proof from supporters of the theory", its interesting the proposition is based around the mechanics of Consolidated Fund, which existed during the gold standard, predating fiat. so either MMT applies to non-fiat monetary systems or their interpretation is flawed. i.e. a gold sovereign is not money and never has been, government never needed income tax for the Napoleonic wars.

 

[jakarta]

She is sending Penny Mordaunt to answer the UQ this afternoon.

Dreadful, cowardly as well as inept, she has to go ASAP.

1922 Committee need to change the re-election rules sharpish or most of them won't be convening in Westminster in the near future.

 

[schmunk]

She is sending Penny Mordaunt to answer the UQ this afternoon.

She's taking the afternoon off to arrange the movers and set up mail redirection...

 

[Silverhatch]

Hopefully this little experiment by Truss and her friends in the ERG and at the IEA and taxpayers alliance will finally put to bed the idea of the UK ending up as some sort of Libertarian utopia with small government, low taxation, zero regulation and trickledown economics. The idea that the UK was going to reproduce 'Reagonomics' without the worlds reserve currency has been seen through by the financial markets in 10 minutes and the public now can see clearly that this portion of the conservative party are only in existence to support the needs of the big business and the ultra rich.

The ERG are the really dangerous fuckers in this whole thing. Skewered this country and probably the conservative party. As malevolent as any part of the militant left.

 

[Half Time Pies]

other than the circluar "here's some proof from supporters of the theory", its interesting the proposition is based around the mechanics of Consolidated Fund, which existed during the gold standard, predating fiat. so either MMT applies to non-fiat monetary systems or their interpretation is flawed. i.e. a gold sovereign is not money and never has been, government never needed income tax for the Napoleonic wars.

Im not going to go back and forth with you over this issue because you only hear what you want to hear and translate it to something that supports your narrative, you keep moving discussion anywhere that you can (other economic systems, systems historically etc, all of which is irrelevant) rather than looking at the current UK economic system and seeing whether the model fits.

Im also not going to post anymore about it because the back and forth is clearly (and understandably) annoying others on this thread.

Ive posted a paper which lays it all out in Black and White, from one of the top universities in the UK. If you are interested in MMT then why don't you read it properly instead of persisting in trying to argue about something that you clearly don't understand.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

She is sending Penny Mordaunt to answer the UQ this afternoon.

She is a coward. She wanted to be PM so she can act like one or resign.