Lewes Bonfire

[ATFC Seagull]

Yep that's right all 10,000 of us. Arse.

You're not all bigots, but you march under a banner for something that has some deeply entrenched bigoted elements.

 

[Brovion]

You're not all bigots, but you march under a banner for something that has some deeply entrenched bigoted elements.

I'm sorry, but that IS a little bit rich coming from a Celtic fan.

 

[Gulls and Rooks]

You're not all bigots, but you march under a banner for something that has some deeply entrenched bigoted elements.

The banner I march under depicts Guido Fawkes and his co-conspirators who plotted to blow up the houses of parliament, lest we forget. What's your point as I think it's you that doesn't get it.

 

[ATFC Seagull]

I'm sorry, but that IS a little bit rich coming from a Celtic fan.

I see what you did there, but very different. Not going to argue about what you feel is/isn't bigoted about Celtic and their support, but its a football club that play in green and white and fly an Irish flag, and has in fact got nothing but praise for work to stamp out sectarian stuff. Whereas Lewes bonfire societies publish programmes with anti-Catholic poems in it and burn effigies of the Pope.

 

[ATFC Seagull]

The banner I march under depicts Guido Fawkes and his co-conspirators who plotted to blow up the houses of parliament, lest we forget. What's your point as I think it's you that doesn't get it.

See above. Although the "banner" I mentioned was a metaphorical one.

 

[Gulls and Rooks]

I see what you did there, but very different. Not going to argue about what you feel is/isn't bigoted about Celtic and their support, but its a football club that play in green and white and fly an Irish flag, and has in fact got nothing but praise for work to stamp out sectarian stuff. Whereas Lewes bonfire societies publish programmes with anti-Catholic poems in it and burn effigies of the Pope.

Absolute rubbish, they don't burn effigies of THE pope they burn effigies of a pope, one that frankly deserved everything he got.

 

[willingdon_seagull]

I used to go but its generally full of morons now, particularly bleedin students - just a sign of the times I guess? Now, I think what is the point in going somehwere which is absolutely rammed, queue for ages to get a pint, queue for ages for a train home when I can spend a perfectly good Saturday night down the local able to order a pint just like that when I want. Each to their own and all that, and Id reccomend everybody to do it once.

 

[ATFC Seagull]

Absolute rubbish, they don't burn effigies of THE pope they burn effigies of a pope, one that frankly deserved everything he got.

I'm afraid I have to disagree - its a very generic person wearing a papal outfit. You might see it as a representation of Pope Clement or whoever was around at the time (although I am not sure what he had to do with the gunpowder plot), but there are plenty involved who see it as a representation of Catholicism in general. When I was a child I also recall Cliffe bonfire burning an effigy of the actual Catholic priest in Lewes at the time in a row over something he said. And when you throw in the crosses for the martyrs thing (no mention of the Catholics killed under Henry or Elizabeth), the whole thing clearly has an underlying religious element.

As for the "lest we forget" element - aside from the historical debates about the legitimacy of the threat the GP really posed, we are talking about one failed terrorist attack from 400 years ago from a Catholicism barely recognisable from today against a government a million miles from today's, hardly an event that shaped the world we live in.

For what its worth I know loads of people who have been involved in Lewes Bonfire who (like most I'd imagine) do it out of local tradition and for the social element and have never had a bigoted thought in their life or strong religious point of view, but the event itself still has a very "us vs the nasty Catholics" element about it from my viewpoint.

 

[Dandyman]

I see what you did there, but very different. Not going to argue about what you feel is/isn't bigoted about Celtic and their support, but its a football club that play in green and white and fly an Irish flag, and has in fact got nothing but praise for work to stamp out sectarian stuff. Whereas Lewes bonfire societies publish programmes with anti-Catholic poems in it and burn effigies of the Pope.

The Societies burn effigies of Pope Paul V who Bishop of Rome in 1605 not the current Hitler Youth graduate.

The only "Anti- Catholic poems" are the traditional Bonfire Prayers which assert our freedom of conscience and rejection of a foreign priest.

If you want to bring up bigotry then you may want to remember the 17 Protestants murdered by being burned alive during the Marian persecutions of 1555-1557.

The Societies contain Protestant, Catholic, and Dissenter along with those of other faiths and those such as myself of no religion faith.

 

[Frutos]

Bless, someone from Newhaven slagging off Lewes. Makes me feel quite nostalgic.

At least people in Newhaven aren't the kind of pretentious, up their own arse snobs that Lewes (in itself, a very nice town) is infested with.

 

[Dandyman]

I'm afraid I have to disagree - its a very generic person wearing a papal outfit. You might see it as a representation of Pope Clement or whoever was around at the time (although I am not sure what he had to do with the gunpowder plot), but there are plenty involved who see it as a representation of Catholicism in general. When I was a child I also recall Cliffe bonfire burning an effigy of the actual Catholic priest in Lewes at the time in a row over something he said. And when you throw in the crosses for the martyrs thing (no mention of the Catholics killed under Henry or Elizabeth), the whole thing clearly has an underlying religious element.

As for the "lest we forget" element - aside from the historical debates about the legitimacy of the threat the GP really posed, we are talking about one failed terrorist attack from 400 years ago from a Catholicism barely recognisable from today against a government a million miles from today's, hardly an event that shaped the world we live in.

For what its worth I know loads of people who have been involved in Lewes Bonfire who (like most I'd imagine) do it out of local tradition and for the social element and have never had a bigoted thought in their life or strong religious point of view, but the event itself still has a very "us vs the nasty Catholics" element about it from my viewpoint.

Henry V111 murdered Protestants not Roman Catholics. He was given the title "Defender of the Faith" by Leo X in 1521 - the split with Rome was about political power not theology.

 

[Dandyman]

At least people in Newhaven aren't the kind of pretentious, up their own arse snobs that Lewes (in itself, a very nice town) is infested with.

Never mind, I'm sure the Newhavenites are very grateful for the cleaning and other menial tasks offered to them by the residents of the County Town.

 

[ATFC Seagull]

Henry V111 murdered Protestants not Roman Catholics. He was given the title "Defender of the Faith" by Leo X in 1521 - the split with Rome was about political power not theology.

In Henry's mind perhaps, but there was without doubt a religious element to causes of the reformation. Not the issue anyway! I was referring mostly to the aftermath of the Pilgrimage of Grace (which I know was not as simple as flagrant persecution).

 

[Leekbrookgull]

Didn't they get into trouble for setting fire to a traveller caravan a few years ago in the main display?

Trouble,you say ? I believe Sussex's finest (?) arrested a few of them ?

 

[Dandyman]

Trouble,you say ? I believe Sussex's finest (?) arrested a few of them ?

As said above that was Firle not Lewes and there were no prosecutions in the end.

 

[Notters]

I hadn't figured out how to get back yet but that's an idea

The train station is a fair old walk from commercial sq and would take ages to get there and the queues will probably be as bad as the Amex

Where is the best place to meet a taxi? I'm thinking the cliffe industrial estate maybe??

Usually get one from the Kingston roundabout on the A27. Used to be easy to get one from by the prison but the police close that road now

 

[Dandyman]

In Henry's mind perhaps, but there was without doubt a religious element to causes of the reformation. Not the issue anyway! I was referring mostly to the aftermath of the Pilgrimage of Grace (which I know was not as simple as flagrant persecution).

England did not become Protestant until after Henry's death. While he was ruthless in suppressing the uprisings associated with the Pilgrimage of Grace, he was also consistent in the persecution, torture and killing of Protestants throughout his reign.

 

[maresfield seagull]

 

[Tux the albion Penguin]

Do you turn back at the sign that says "There be demons in thar" ?

Naw but that made me laugh xD

 

[Chamberpot]

Ha utter bollocks some of the posts on here. I've gotten into Lewes at 7.30ish last year from newhaven and I don't really see why some of the residents of Lewes have to be so negative about 'foreigners' coming in.