Legal challenge to FFP in the offing? Guardian piece inc. Mr Barber

[BBassic]

Parachute payments should be stopped outright.

It would force clubs to be sensible when it comes to negotiating player contracts with things like relegation wage drops etc. and would also stop the reward of failure.

"Oh, you weren't good enough to stay up? And you want money for that? Run along"

 

[Mileoakman]

A simple solution you say?

What when all the clubs solicitors pummel the football league into the ground, surely has to be one of the silliest ideas ever.

Yes it is simple and effective. If they bring any legal challenge to the Football League its 20 points off! Bang, Now. By the time they took anything to court we would be halfway through next season and they would still be in the Championship, with fines and transfer embargoes.

 

[Goldstone1976]

This is a pretty major moment for football in this country - if there are legal challenges to pre-agreed rules then it's no different to West Ham trying to overturn Carroll's red card in the courts.

yes, it really is. It'll take a couple of years for the dust to settle, but the FL's stance during that period to the inevitable challenges will define football's finances in the lower leagues for maybe a generation. I think that at least one club, probably more, will seek legal redress through the Courts; the FL has to meet that challenge head on and be prepared to go to Court too, otherwise the whole thing will be a farce, and, further, they may well find themselves on the end of suit from those clubs who have complied.

 

[Jim D]

Yes it is simple and effective. If they bring any legal challenge to the Football League its 20 points off! Bang, Now. By the time they took anything to court we would be halfway through next season and they would still be in the Championship, with fines and transfer embargoes.

Or they could get an injunction preventing the league season starting until the case was heard. That would have to include all the Championship and Prem.

 

[Twinkle Toes]

yes, it really is. It'll take a couple of years for the dust to settle, but the FL's stance during that period to the inevitable challenges will define football's finances in the lower leagues for maybe a generation. I think that at least one club, probably more, will seek legal redress through the Courts; the FL has to meet that challenge head on and be prepared to go to Court too, otherwise the whole thing will be a farce, and, further, they may well find themselves on the end of suit from those clubs who have complied.

Absolutely. The Football League will have to have the balls & the organisation to meet any challenges head-on, otherwise the whole basis of FFP - and indeed The FL's ability to administrate effectively - will become untenable.

 

[Loadicus Trux]

Makes you wonder if we are ever going to be able to get there , doing it the right way

I think we can, but the academy is going to have to produce most of the team, spearheaded by two 20 goals a season strikers!

 

[El Presidente]

There is a simple solution to this if the Football League had any balls. Write to every club in the Championship now and say that unless they get a written statement back from each club saying they won't challenge the FFP rules that have been agreed by, say, the end of March this year, those clubs will have an automatic 20 point deduction this season.

Forest, QPR, Leicester etc, would have to agree otherwise its goodbye promotion.

Except for that to be the case, the chairmen of Football League clubs in the Championship would have to vote for such an agreement, and we're into a circularity issue.

 

[Tubby-McFat-Fuc]

Palace were put into administration over a £4.5 million debt. The Albion have debts of over £100 million.

Big difference though. Ours are manageable. Theirs were not.

 

[El Presidente]

Big difference though. Ours are manageable. Theirs were not.

If you know your history of the Albion, there have been plenty of occasions when ours were not either.

 

[fosters headband]

Palace were put into administration over a £4.5 million debt. The Albion have debts of over £100 million.

Are you sure about that? Yes they were placed into administration by Agilo for the £4.5 million owed to them by the club, but my understanding was they did this to try an protect their money due to a HMRC winding up petition for close on £3million owed to them and their total debt I think was around £32 million.
Players at the time were not even being paid I believe.

 

[fosters headband]

If you know your history of the Albion, there have been plenty of occasions when ours were not either.

I agree, but we have none the less never been in administration have we?

 

[Tubby-McFat-Fuc]

If you know your history of the Albion, there have been plenty of occasions when ours were not either.

I fully know the history. But the bottom line is when we were on our knees, had we have "gone into administration" we would have folded, along with the likes of Maidstone, Aldershot etc. I feel if a club cannot keep its finances in order to the extent they go into administration, then they should have there membership of the football league removed, until which time that they can earn it back.

 

[El Presidente]

Are you sure about that? Yes they were placed into administration by Agilo for the £4.5 million owed to them by the club, but my understanding was they did this to try an protect their money due to a HMRC winding up petition for close on £3million owed to them and their total debt I think was around £32 million.
Players at the time were not even being paid I believe.

Agreed. But we're not in a position to act superior. We've had informal rather than formal agreements with suppliers and creditors in the past which resulted in them not being fully paid, and players have not been paid on many occasions.

This issue is far bigger than petty Albion Palace point scoring

 

[drew]

It is no good everyone banging on about point deduction here there and everywhere. What we need to hear from the FL is that they have looked into various deals and whether or not those deals are valid under FFP eg the Forest sponsorship deal. I doubt this has happened as in the recent meeting they voted on introducing mid season checks which suggest they are not currently doing it.

I also would like to hear more positive news that Uefa are backing the FL FFP rules as that would put pressure on the Premier league to ensure that they comply with the fines. After all, Uefa have their own FFP so you would think they would want to see sanctions successfully imposed rather than legally challenged!

 

[Landgull]

It is no good everyone banging on about point deduction here there and everywhere. What we need to hear from the FL is that they have looked into various deals and whether or not those deals are valid under FFP eg the Forest sponsorship deal. I doubt this has happened as in the recent meeting they voted on introducing mid season checks which suggest they are not currently doing it.

I also would like to hear more positive news that Uefa are backing the FL FFP rules as that would put pressure on the Premier league to ensure that they comply with the fines. After all, Uefa have their own FFP so you would think they would want to see sanctions successfully imposed rather than legally challenged!

Spot on.

 

[father_and_son]

Palace were put into administration over a £4.5 million debt. The Albion have debts of over £100 million.

Debt itself is not the problem... its whether the debt is serviceable. An interest free loan with a distant repayment date would not worry an accountant signing off on company accounts - it has little material impact on your ability to trade as a going concern. Owing £100 to a loan shark like Wonga when you have the square root of f**k all income is a serious issue because the debt will only ever get bigger!

 

[B.W.]

Here's hoping the FL have the balls (for once).

 

[Czechmate]

Here's hoping the FL have the balls (for once).

I hope too , but when the FL is still thinking seriously in allowing an Italian fraud invested mafia guy (allegedly) to take over Leeds then I don't hold much hope .

 

[Ernest]

Reading Charles Sales column he says one of the points causing concern is the way the fines were changed from being distributed to the clubs to being given to charity, not sure if this change was voted on but if it wasn't then that would be grounds for the legal challenge

 

[Captain Sensible]

This was always going to happen, after all if an owner wants to lose 50m getting his team to the prem, I think that sort of owner will always challenge FFP because who are the league to say what he/she does with his money?
There is a way around this, if owners pay the players directly instead of the club. The whole FFP thing is ment well but poorly implemented.