[Politics] Labour suspend Derek Hatton

[GT49er]

i think the problem is that an element use the support for Palestine as cover for anti-semitism.

Conversely there is an element that will call out anyone who expresses any support or sympathy for the Palestinian cause as anti-Semitic. Which is equally bollox.

 

[Weststander]

Yes they are separate, but the problem arises when the two are blurred ie, asking Jewish people to condemn the Israeli state. It's about as relevant as asking the people of Hastings to condemn the Israeli state. Or asking black people to condemn an African dictatorship or Muslims to condemn Saudi Arabia.

If people of Pakistani origin in the world had any decency, they’d condemn grooming gangs in northern UK towns.
If slavs of the world had any decency, they’d condemn Russia waging war in Crimea.
If ethnic Chinese in the UK had any decency, they’d condemn the annexation of Tibet.
If Shia Muslims in the UK had any decency, they’d condemn Hamas.

Any of the above statements would be condemned as lumping together and linking an entire racial, ethnic or religious group with criminal acts. Deeming any silent folk within the racial grouping as human beings lacking decency. That’s Hatton’s snide approach.

 

[Wardy's twin]

I'm firmly of the opinion that the Labour Party is not anti-Semitic ie. is not hostile to people of the Jewish faith. Why on earth would they be? I do believe that the party IS hostile to the actions of the Israeli State as regards the Occupied Territories. Two completely different things shirley?

Quite simply the Labour party left wing has supported the Palestinians since the 70s and has had an anti-Israel position since that time and they can't be friends with both sides. Is the discussion anti-semitic ? Possibly the comments are not intended to be anti-semitic by most people but the symbiotic relationship between State and Religion ultimately means an attack on Israel is an attack on being Jewish.

 

[beorhthelm]

Conversely there is an element that will call out anyone who expresses any support or sympathy for the Palestinian cause as anti-Semitic. Which is equally bollox.

true, and they dont help the situation very much, a lot of crying wolf.

 

[Lower West Stander]

I don't know? I haven't read that it has anything to do with them, have you? Derek Hatton applied to rejoin the Labour Party, his application was to be approved by the NEC. You can't just refuse applications to be a member on an ad hoc basis, you have to apply the rules you have, which in this instance appears to have been done.

Do you remember Militant Tendency?


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[Weststander]

Quite simply the Labour party left wing has supported the Palestinians since the 70s and has had an anti-Israel position since that time and they can't be friends with both sides. Is the discussion anti-semitic ? Possibly the comments are not intended to be anti-semitic by most people but the symbiotic relationship between State and Religion ultimately means an attack on Israel is an attack on being Jewish.

But - many key Labour people in history and in recent times are Jewish. So the party can oppose Israeli government brutality and be friends with Jewish people.

The anti semitism against Jews in general in parts of the Labour Party now, comes from racists emboldened by social media stirring and a new found feeling of power instead of being in the fringes. Ironically, in the very same way that right wing racists are having a field day in these times (England First, etc).

 

[Wardy's twin]

But - many key Labour people in history and in recent times are Jewish. So the party can oppose Israeli government brutality and be friends with Jewish people.

The anti semitism against Jews in general in parts of the Labour Party now, comes from racists emboldened by social media stirring and a new found feeling of power instead of being in the fringes. Ironically, in the very same way that right wing racists are having a field day in these times (England First, etc).

many key Labour people in history and in recent times are Jewish. True

So the party can oppose Israeli government brutality and be friends with Jewish people. I don't think that is as easy as it seems. But it is not just about the current Israeli extremism it is about challenging the right of Israel to exist and the Palestians don't want it to exist and the left wing of the Labour Party have always felt the Palestinian cause was right

The anti semitism against Jews in general in parts of the Labour Party now, comes from racists emboldened by social media stirring and a new found feeling of power instead of being in the fringes. Ironically, in the very same way that right wing racists are having a field day in these times (England First, etc). Its about English nationalism so its not just antisemitism , its also being anti- European and any other group who get's in their way.

 

[Weststander]

many key Labour people in history and in recent times are Jewish. True

So the party can oppose Israeli government brutality and be friends with Jewish people. I don't think that is as easy as it seems. But it is not just about the current Israeli extremism it is about challenging the right of Israel to exist and the Palestians don't want it to exist and the left wing of the Labour Party have always felt the Palestinian cause was right

The anti semitism against Jews in general in parts of the Labour Party now, comes from racists emboldened by social media stirring and a new found feeling of power instead of being in the fringes. Ironically, in the very same way that right wing racists are having a field day in these times (England First, etc). Its about English nationalism so its not just antisemitism , its also being anti- European and any other group who get's in their way.

On the last point, I do realise there’s far more to the shopping list of hates (and allying to some nasty regimes in the world), in both the far left and far right groupings. I was just commenting on the irony of their pincer movement on the race of Jews in the UK, and how they both feel emboldened in this social media age.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Do you remember Militant Tendency?

Not really, I was what, 9 - 13 yrs old when they had hold of Liverpool council. I remember Hatton, mainly because I'd never seen my Dad hate someone so much.

 

[Lower West Stander]

Not really, I was what, 9 - 13 yrs old when they had hold of Liverpool council. I remember Hatton, mainly because I'd never seen my Dad hate someone so much.

I remember him very well.

Which is why no matter how times he reapplies to the Labour Party, he should not be allowed in, regardless of the protocol.

The man is scum of the highest order.


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[Live by the sea]

If you want to have a much better understanding of Israel, I would recommend taking advantage of their free media. One of the best online and mainly free articles to read is the Jerusalem Post which is in English. It's online every day and has some very interesting articles. Israel has a totally free press like we have and often senior govt figures are strongly criticised.

The Jerusalem Post started off being.left leaning for many years then went a bit more right and now days is considered a centralist newspaper and quite a serious one , so it has credibility.

Www. Jerusalem Post.com.

Interesting, I've certainly learnt a lot.

 

[Live by the sea]

If you want to have a much better understanding of Israel, I would recommend taking advantage of their free media. One of the best online and mainly free articles to read is the Jerusalem Post which is in English. It's online every day and has some very interesting articles. Israel has a totally free press like we have and often senior govt figures are strongly criticised.

The Jerusalem Post started off being.left leaning for many years then went a bit more right and now days is considered a centralist newspaper and quite a serious one .

M.jpost.com or Google Jerusalem Post

Interesting, I've certainly learnt a lot.

 

[Hampster Gull]

By going on live tv and calling people “funny tinge”?

If that helps you, ok

 

[Boys 9d]

If you want to have a much better understanding of Israel, I would recommend taking advantage of their free media. One of the best online and mainly free articles to read is the Jerusalem Post which is in English. It's online every day and has some very interesting articles. Israel has a totally free press like we have and often senior govt figures are strongly criticised.

The Jerusalem Post started off being.left leaning for many years then went a bit more right and now days is considered a centralist newspaper and quite a serious one .

M.jpost.com or Google Jerusalem Post

Interesting, I've certainly learnt a lot.

I find "Haaretz" to be a more liberal publication.

 

[Hampster Gull]

Are we back in the eighties or have labour learnt nothing

 

[midnight_rendezvous]

If that helps you, ok

Doesn’t exactly help your claim they were taking a stand on racism though does it?

 

[Stat Brother]

I'm gonna need some help with this one:-

[tweet]1099597061861896193[/tweet]

 

[Weststander]

I'm gonna need some help with this one:-

[tweet]1099597061861896193[/tweet]

I wonder if Colin was complaining in the Blair years of great investment in schools and hospitals?

 

[Stat Brother]

I wonder if Colin was complaining in the Blair years of great investment in schools and hospitals?

I need to know who's chalk and who's cheese first.

Which one is Colin calling a Tory and which one is a hero to millions?

 

[Weststander]

I need to know who's chalk and who's cheese first.

Which one is Colin calling a Tory and which one is a hero to millions?

I did ponder who’s tangibly done more to help ordinary working people?

A maverick back bencher who tried to obstruct, or a Labour PM. Going by loads of the selective graphical stats put on NSC by Labour supporters over the years, the Blair years did quite a bit.