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[Politics] Labour suspend Derek Hatton
- Thread starter Invicta
- Start date
Weststander
Well-known member
I agree with all you say.
Also, that he’s a peripheral figure. But there are far too many of his ilk, now openly linking all Jews in the world to Israeli government action. It may just be words, but it encourages the next wave of left wing racists who appear far more aggressive.
We need to crush right and left wing racists at every opportunity.
That's what living off champagne and the hard work of others does for you.
Bold Seagull
strong and stable with me, or...
What does it have to do with Momentum? Hatton applied to be re-admitted to the party, provisionally given he was previously expelled, and was pending NEC approval. This has surfaced and they’ve rejected the application. Can’t win if you do, can’t win if you don’t.
So you don't think Momentum had anything to do with this? I can only see this as their work. No right minded Labour supporter over 50 would have anything to do with it. The guy is poisonous and brings the entire party into disrepute.
Garry Nelson's teacher
Well-known member
I lived in Liverpool - and worked for the city council - at the time when Militant and Degsi - were at their peak. It was all pretty sinister and - although I'm not necessarily a Kinnock fan, his speech at the Party Conference wasn't far off the mark.
el punal
Well-known member
If you were the brewery you could come up with some wonderful slogans and names, as in :
Try our deselection of ales
Having a local party? Enjoy a pint of “Ousted” - you’ll never go back!
Our signature beer “Momentum” - it goes on and on and on, with a bitter finish.
Popping in for a quick one? Sup a “Hatton”, an old ale - down the hatch and gone in a flash!
One of our continental range beers, “Lefftie” - speaks volumes but only appeals to a discerning few. Intense at first but then ends on a subdued note. Perfect for those that chatter!
And for those of you who wish to drink at home we have one of these beauties - “Trots Icepick” - a cold, refreshing lager that won’t go to your head.
P.S. We wish to inform our customers that we will no longer be stocking “Thatcher’s Old Gold” due to lack of demand
Ay theng yew!
It isn't criticism of Israel that is the issue. It is the uneven treatment of Israel (the 'illegal' state) versus the enemies of Israel (no criticism of the hostile surrounding nations, ever). We have Galloway who went to Iraq to fawn over the murdering despot, Saddam Hussain, saluting his 'indefatigability'. We have Livingstone, who thinks it amusing to argue that Hitler was a zionist, and we have Corbyn who steadfastly refuses to do anything about the jew-baiting and bullying in his party, agreeing to meet Jewish leaders then not turning up, and condemning only 'all forms or racism' while steadfastly refusing to acknowledge anything specific about Jews. There is a racist anti-Jewish narrative here. Criticising the state of Israel at the drop of a hat is not racist in itself, no more than repeatedly drawing attention to the number of black muggers in Brixton was racist in the 70s, but the target audience all knows what is meant, and insoucient denial is so, so easy, because it isn't racist to criticise Israel, is it? Anyway, we all know, the Jews bring it on themselves, don't they. We all know that..... Geddit now?
This.
Bold Seagull
strong and stable with me, or...
I don't know? I haven't read that it has anything to do with them, have you? Derek Hatton applied to rejoin the Labour Party, his application was to be approved by the NEC. You can't just refuse applications to be a member on an ad hoc basis, you have to apply the rules you have, which in this instance appears to have been done.
I 'geddited' it before and I geddit now. Anti-Semitism and criticism of Israel's behaviour towards its neighbours are two different things. End of.It isn't criticism of Israel that is the issue. It is the uneven treatment of Israel (the 'illegal' state) versus the enemies of Israel (no criticism of the hostile surrounding nations, ever). We have Galloway who went to Iraq to fawn over the murdering despot, Saddam Hussain, saluting his 'indefatigability'. We have Livingstone, who thinks it amusing to argue that Hitler was a zionist, and we have Corbyn who steadfastly refuses to do anything about the jew-baiting and bullying in his party, agreeing to meet Jewish leaders then not turning up, and condemning only 'all forms or racism' while steadfastly refusing to acknowledge anything specific about Jews. There is a racist anti-Jewish narrative here. Criticising the state of Israel at the drop of a hat is not racist in itself, no more than repeatedly drawing attention to the number of black muggers in Brixton was racist in the 70s, but the target audience all knows what is meant, and insoucient denial is so, so easy, because it isn't racist to criticise Israel, is it? Anyway, we all know, the Jews bring it on themselves, don't they. We all know that..... Geddit now?
Billy the Fish
Technocrat
One thing I still don't understand is why these hard left momentum types are so obsessed with Israel and Palestine 
You'd think with the current shambles of a government they'd focus on domestic problems a bit more.
You'd think with the current shambles of a government they'd focus on domestic problems a bit more.
Some day there will be an understanding that there is a world of difference between being anti-Zionist (against the policies of the State of Israel) and anti-Semetic (against the Jewish race).
Anti-Semitism is "hostility and prejudice directed against Jewish people" (OED).
Zionism refers to the movement to create a Jewish state in the Middle East, roughly corresponding to the historical land of Israel, and thus support for the modern state of Israel. Anti-Zionism opposes that.
Anti-Semitism is "hostility and prejudice directed against Jewish people" (OED).
Zionism refers to the movement to create a Jewish state in the Middle East, roughly corresponding to the historical land of Israel, and thus support for the modern state of Israel. Anti-Zionism opposes that.
Bold Seagull
strong and stable with me, or...
It isn't criticism of Israel that is the issue. It is the uneven treatment of Israel (the 'illegal' state) versus the enemies of Israel (no criticism of the hostile surrounding nations, ever). We have Galloway who went to Iraq to fawn over the murdering despot, Saddam Hussain, saluting his 'indefatigability'. We have Livingstone, who thinks it amusing to argue that Hitler was a zionist, and we have Corbyn who steadfastly refuses to do anything about the jew-baiting and bullying in his party, agreeing to meet Jewish leaders then not turning up, and condemning only 'all forms or racism' while steadfastly refusing to acknowledge anything specific about Jews. There is a racist anti-Jewish narrative here. Criticising the state of Israel at the drop of a hat is not racist in itself, no more than repeatedly drawing attention to the number of black muggers in Brixton was racist in the 70s, but the target audience all knows what is meant, and insoucient denial is so, so easy, because it isn't racist to criticise Israel, is it? Anyway, we all know, the Jews bring it on themselves, don't they. We all know that..... Geddit now?
You're pretty much so unbalanced on this so as to be conspiratorial yourself. This is starting to have McCarthyism written all over it. People don't like left wing politics, it is feared, and so everything is done to discredit it. Antisemitism is an issue, however Livingstone was indefinitely suspended and he resigned, and Galloway was kicked out. It was actually Momentum who called for Livingstone to leave politics altogether.
200 Jewish members and supporters signed a declaration only this week giving their support to Corbyn and Labour to tackle antisemitism. Doesn't exactly suit the current news cycle narrative though does it. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/feb/20/jeremy-corbyn-labour-party-crucial-ally-in-fight-against-antisemitism
Weststander
Well-known member
The 200 members acting in good faith, I’ve seen some of them on Newsnight are desparately anti the war/murderous actions of the Israeli government and keen for a JC government. They obviously are not anti semitic and do not make snide comments like Hatton tarring a race as indecent if they don’t agree with him.
There are double standards. You, I and HWT would equally condemn the murderous actions of Assad, Hamas, Israelis. Some awful people in this country refuse to for the former two, but are obsessed with the latter. These people really do exist. Some are Labour members, the party is beginning to deal with anti semites, the quotes and social media comments are a matter of fact.
I really the vast majority of Labour voters do no harbour that racism.
He really is a c*nt. Neil Kinnock remains the best PM we never had, and one of his greatest achievements was having Hatton removed from that party. The man is total scum, and he ruined Liverpool. Typical of Labour under it's current extremists to even consider letting this moron back into the fold and reason enough not to vote for them.
I remember this well. The sort of guts a leader needs to have - standing up to lunatics threatening to take over the party. And a good reason why Theresa May isn't and will never be fit to lick Kinnock's boots.
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I remember this well. The sort of guts a leader needs to have - standing up to lunatics threatening to take over the party. And a good reason why Theresa May isn't and will never be fit to lick Kinnock's boots.
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Neville's Breakfast
Well-known member
Your analogy would work if you were Muslim and someone had urged you to condemn Saudi Arabia if you have any sense of humanity. In the absence of your condemnation it would be assumed you have no humanity. Do you see the racism now ?
Bold Seagull
strong and stable with me, or...
As we know on these very boards, social media gives people the opportunity to post whatever they want, and some do it very carefully so to keep a veil of acceptability. I have no doubt some vile things have been and are posted, but I also don't think Politicians in general haven't evolved very well with the social media world, either legislating for it, or dealing with it – unfortunately they are fair game for a whole raft of abuse right up to not being able to walk from their job without having Hitler and Traitor shouted into their face.
What gets me is the racism that drove the Brexit campaign goes relatively unchecked still, despite the evidence as [MENTION=435]Stat Brother[/MENTION] posted the other day, freely available on YouTube, and yet cases of antisemitism in the Labour Party explode as if dwarfing all racism elsewhere in our society. It is disproportionate and agenda driven. Boris Johnson can make comment after comment, about muslims, about Obama being part-Kenyan with an ancestral dislike of Britain, that visiting the commonwealth you are greeted with 'watermelon smiles'...the lack of balance at times is unbelievable.
beorhthelm
A. Virgo, Football Genius
- Jul 21, 2003
- 36,031
and yet the accusations continue, from within Labour. Berger is part of an anti-left wing conspiracy? Watson is part of a anti-left wing conspiracy? Momentum seems to call for people to leave when it suits, and who are they to be directing who should be in and out of politics anyway?
Jews consider Israel as their homeland. Muslims do not see Saudi as their homeland, unless they are Saudi.