[Politics] Labour Leader would step down.

[Dick Swiveller]

I've actually campaigned consistently knocking on doors for Labour for the best part of 3 decades and the single biggest thing that I've heard back from people by far in all that time is that they are all the same. The notion that it was all pretty much OK before Johnson came along forgets stuff like the expenses scandal, lies to get us into wars, huge numbers of deaths of vulnerable people because of austerity etc

Did you tell the public of your admiration for Gorgeous George?

 

[London Irish]

Did you tell the public of your admiration for Gorgeous George?

That rightwing transphobic bigot who stands in electoral pacts with the Tories in Scotland? Yeh that happened pal, given we are all clutching pearls about how terrible liars are

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I think they were a week or two too slow shifting focus to the cost of living crisis. But they did ultimately do it - and it's telling that once they did, the Tories responded by reviving beergate.

My main concern is that Labour seems unable to tackle Boris on multiple fronts at the same time. Fine, pick one attack line to lead on (be that partygate, cost of living, or something else) - but don't let that lead attack line completely submerse other avenues. I'm still flabbergasted that they haven't pressed Boris harder on his repeated use of misleading employment statistics in Parliament - stats that he's been told multiple times are misleading but continues to trot out. As much as I know the Tory machine would vote any attempt to censure him over it down, I still think Labour should force them to at least make that vote.

They (Starmer / Labour) also need to be a lot better at reactive defensive moves. They've been far too meek in the face of Boris trotting out his "if Labour were in power we'd still be in lockdown" lines as a diversionary tactic, for example.

Starmer is getting there, slowly. But I do worry a little that it's too slowly. My main concern being that I think Starmer would be a fantastic PM ... but he's not a great Opposition leader. And he won't get to be PM unless he can change that.

Case in point: his initial handling of being questioned about whether Durham police had contacted him was poor. He prevaricated instead of coming through with a definitive yes or no. And then he was too slow arriving at the announcement made yesterday. A natural opposition leader with the instinct to get ahead of the story would have been on the front foot and got that announcement out much sooner. Starmer's more cautious approach will great for a PM. But he needs to be more agile as Oppo leader.

Indeed. Blair was very effective at rebutting and had a team working on it, after the right wingers in the media had made a mockery of labour's flat footed response to their absurd lies (the fictitious banning of "Baa Baa Black sheep" being a classic).

I suspect all that knowhow was allowed to wither after McBroon and others followed him. If I were Starmer I would be looking for my equivalent of Alistair Campbell.

The hatred of Blair and Campbell by the loony right is a testament to their effectiveness.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

My point was only, from what I can tell with a very light consumption of the news, that Starmer/Labour were repeatedly banging the lockdown-breaking drum for some months. Entirely understandably, obviously, given what went on.

So, it doesn't strike me as particularly surprising to see the Tory-cheerleading press doing the same thing, when the opportunity has presented itself.

I'm not calling for Starmer to resign, but it is a fact he called for Johnson to resign simply because he was being investigated by the police. (What happened since, whilst highly relevant to further revealing the character of our Prime Minister, is neither here nor there when it comes to this point.)

But that simply isn't true.

He called for Boris to resign for lying to Parliament.

January 26:

""I think the prime minister said yes, he agrees the code does apply to him. Therefore, if he misled parliament, he must resign,” the Labour leader told MPs."

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...-resign-immediately-for-misleading-parliament

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I agree with all you have said with the exception of Gordon Brown being nervous, the World was frozen with inaction when the world financial crash occurred it was Gordon Browns led Government that made the monumental decision and led the world to buy out the banks and poor state money into the economy, in my opinion Gordon was quite unwell during the election a victim of years of being chancellor not helped by a lack of support from Tony Blair and his supporters within the Labour Party, the total u turn of all media from broadly supporting of labour to heavily hostile and some real blunders by him personally and his election team. I am of a view Gordon Brown had the potential to have been a great PM had Tony Blair stood down earlier.

I agree that Brown did brilliantly to lead the western world after the global financial crash. And he gets no credit for that - with the tory jackasses blaming Brown for the crash and using it as an excuse for 'austerity'. Unbelievable cheek!

But just watch the show reel of Brown suddenly realising he's on camera and trying to switch on a rictus smile. It is excruciating. I think Blair thought that Brown simply did not have the personality to be a good leader, and I would agree with him. The fits of temper, the sulking....the insecurity (that made him think he needed to smile when it just made him look false and weird....)

 

[Dick Swiveller]

That rightwing transphobic bigot who stands in electoral pacts with the Tories in Scotland? Yeh that happened pal, given we are all clutching pearls about how terrible liars are

Noe entirely sure that was your view of him when he was pretending to be a cat.

 

[A1X]

I agree that Brown did brilliantly to lead the western world after the global financial crash. And he gets no credit for that - with the tory jackasses blaming Brown for the crash and using it as an excuse for 'austerity'. Unbelievable cheek!

There was a documentary series about the New Labour years on BBC2 a few months ago and it was clear all the real movers and shakers in the world (including Obama) basically took their lead from Brown and he deserves a huge amount of credit which he doesn't get. Unfortunately he was up against the oily condom in a suit that was Cameron in 2010 and the public preferred him. Ironic considering I'd argue Cameron is now about the most widely hated PM in recent history.

 

[beorhthelm]

There was a documentary series about the New Labour years on BBC2 a few months ago and it was clear all the real movers and shakers in the world (including Obama) basically took their lead from Brown and he deserves a huge amount of credit which he doesn't get. Unfortunately he was up against the oily condom in a suit that was Cameron in 2010 and the public preferred him. Ironic considering I'd argue Cameron is now about the most widely hated PM in recent history.

it was Darling and Treasury that set out the plan, Brown introduced it to others. they needed anything as a plan and to work together on it to ensure market confidence, that was more important that what the details where. it worked and they stuck with it, we're still experiencing the consequences, as QE carried on until recently and arguably pumped all markets without concern.

 

[jcdenton08]

That's the thing though isn't it. Starmer has said he would "offer" his resignation, not that he would resign. Could be construed as brazenly clinging on to power if his offered resignation wasn't accepted, no?

Time will tell.

 

[jcdenton08]

What I find really sad, is how agitated and even distressed old white men get arguing politics with strangers over the internet. It is absolutely insane, but they can't stop themselves. It's desperately sad, to be honest. They get so angry and it is so pointless.

What tends to happen is people with fantastic careers, who have done loads of very positive and altruistic work, can be reduced to looking frankly like a "forum cretin". It doesn't matter how many big words we use, reputation is lost each time one acts out.

 

[London Irish]

Noe entirely sure that was your view of him when he was pretending to be a cat.

And how the long ago was that fella, yes I liked him tearing a strip off the US Senators over the Iraq war because they were MUCH bigger dangers than him but the rest of his politics are rancid because I've been paying attention, not just vaguely remembering reality shows from two decades ago

 

[lawros left foot]

As Prime Ministers since Brown have got progressively worse, I’m hoping that we have reached the nadir with Johnson. If Starmer survives this gutter media storm, I trust, if he succeeds the present incumbent, he will begin the return from the depths of the worst governance of this country in modern history.

 

[knocky1]

As Prime Ministers since Brown have got progressively worse, I’m hoping that we have reached the nadir with Johnson. If Starmer survives this gutter media storm, I trust, if he succeeds the present incumbent, he will begin the return from the depths of the worst governance of this country in modern history.

Theresa May stopped the Tory rot for a short time before she was seen off. Just a little uplift from the fast descent to more and more depravity.

 

[razer]

What a terrible take.

You think he's above that type of thought?? He's a politician FFS and yes, I tar them all with the same brush until one proves otherwise (very unlikely).

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

There was a documentary series about the New Labour years on BBC2 a few months ago and it was clear all the real movers and shakers in the world (including Obama) basically took their lead from Brown and he deserves a huge amount of credit which he doesn't get. Unfortunately he was up against the oily condom in a suit that was Cameron in 2010 and the public preferred him. Ironic considering I'd argue Cameron is now about the most widely hated PM in recent history.

Indeed! Yes I saw that.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

What I find really sad, is how agitated and even distressed old white men get arguing politics with strangers over the internet. It is absolutely insane, but they can't stop themselves. It's desperately sad, to be honest. They get so angry and it is so pointless.

What tends to happen is people with fantastic careers, who have done loads of very positive and altruistic work, can be reduced to looking frankly like a "forum cretin". It doesn't matter how many big words we use, reputation is lost each time one acts out.

What a condescending and pompous comment. And indeed, post.

If you don't wish to play you're welcome to sod off, O enlightened one

 

[pocketseagull]

That's the thing though isn't it. Starmer has said he would "offer" his resignation, not that he would resign. Could be construed as brazenly clinging on to power if his offered resignation wasn't accepted, no?

Have you got a link to a quote where he's offering to resign?

 

[WATFORD zero]

You think he's above that type of thought?? He's a politician FFS and yes, I tar them all with the same brush until one proves otherwise (very unlikely).

'They are all the same'

The plaintive pathetic plea of a Johnson 'cheerleader' (and I use this term advisedly) after all logic has failed

 

[razer]

'They are all the same'

The plaintive pathetic plea of a Johnson 'cheerleader' (and I use this term advisedly) after all logic has failed

I despise Johnson. I can also see past the end of my nose.

 

[razer]

Have you got a link to a quote where he's offering to resign?

Nope.