[Politics] Labour Files - 3 part Documentary

[Swansman]

The crux of the subject is antisemitism against Jewish people in the UK. Why does Israel keep being thrown into the mix by some people?

Who's saying it cannot be questioned? Corbyn, Al Jazeera and you are freely talking about.

I said it can not be questioned without being labelled as some kind of jew-hating nazi-apologist.

And no, the subject of this is not antisemitism against jews in the UK: the subject is to make allegations of antisemitism to force a change in political direction.

 

[Swansman]

Back on topic.

https://www.ajiunit.com/article/unprecedented-leak-exposes-inner-workings-of-uk-labour-party/

A real shitshow.

Here's their first article on the subject. With leaks going back to 1998, it will be interesting to see what they can find.

Apparently a leak of 500 gigabytes of emails from the second largest party in UK is not considered newsworthy by the British press.

 

[Deportivo Seagull]

The source is Al Jazeera who have often been the voice of terror groups out of the Middle East and have little love for a Israel or the Jewish people, so I would take with some caution.

You can be anti Israel without being Anti Jew however much of what came out of the labour left was anti Jewish sentiment hidden by the anti Israeli argument.

I sit in the middle of the political divide and the hard left and hard right are cut from the same cloth. I despise them all. They take great delight in hate and the persecution of minorities or those that don’t confirm to their racist and homophobic agenda. Wankers the lot of them.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Relevant how?

For someone who is allegedly "all about evidence", you seem to have a certain fetisch for disregarding information and evidence if they once shook hand with someone you don't like or uttered an opinion about something you don't agree with.

All I said was that it doesn't bode well. And you regard that as evidence that I have a fetish for disregarding information? That is evidence of inappropriate extrapolation. Bravo.

Before I bother watching hours of documentary I want to look for clues about whether it is worth my while. As you know there is a mountain of 'information' out there and we don't all have your Special Skills ability to be able to separate truth from lies.

I'll have a look at the Al Jazeera reports now.....I hope they are as persuasive as you presumably regard them.

 

[Comrade Sam]

It's amazing how this misinformed bile still continues. The evidence of genuine anti semitism on the left was miniscule and those responsible should be dealt with, preferably with extreme violence. However, as the documentary clearly showed the vast accusations of anti semitism directed at the left was at those either supporting the Palestinian right to return and equality or condemning the actions of Israel. It was not a Zionist plot, it was a concerted effort to undermine the chances of a left wing government. The anti semitism row was just one of the tools used by both the right of the Labour Party, the media, Israeli lobbyists, the Tories and those threatened by a curbing of the powers of those who have (and still do) their wealthy faces in the trough. As a Jewish anti Zionist it was horrific to watch my local MP Stella Creasy constantly appearing on TV to throw baseless accusations of how Jews were treated in her local branch meetings, of which I attended all but one in three years. Also a branch dominated by left wing Jews. Not only was there no examples of anti semitism in those meetings, Israel was only on the agenda once - a motion to condemn the gunning down of peaceful protesters on the Right to Return March. Of the 70 members in the room only 2 voted against it and one of them claimed everyone killed was an armed member of Hamas. To avoid confrontation the motion was put forward and he made a long speech in reply, then it went straight to the vote and he stormed out. End of. To label Al Jazeera as a terrorist supporting news channel smacks of Daily Mail ignorance.

 

[Swansman]

All I said was that it doesn't bode well. And you regard that as evidence that I have a fetish for disregarding information? That is evidence of inappropriate extrapolation. Bravo.

Before I bother watching hours of documentary I want to look for clues about whether it is worth my while. As you know there is a mountain of 'information' out there and we don't all have your Special Skills ability to be able to separate truth from lies.

I'll have a look at the Al Jazeera reports now.....I hope they are as persuasive as you presumably regard them.

Is it a strategy you always use or is it just one you use when you want to keep your pre-determined views and stay in the comfort of your bubble?

For instance, do you avoid reading a New York Times article because of William L. Laurence? Or The Guardian for previously writing about Edward Snowden, who you apparently believe is a fraud/Putin tool, and his revealings?

 

[borat]

Thanks. Just checking them out. The news so far is not good:

"Bastani attracted controversy in November 2018 for his position on the poppy appeal, an annual fundraising campaign run by the Royal British Legion for veterans of the British armed forces. In an episode of Novara Media podcast "The Bastani Factor", Bastani described the poppy appeal as "racist" and "white supremacist" because, in his opinion, the appeal "has a kind of triumphalist militarism to it"."

This is weak, intellectually dishonest and irrelevant to the topic

 

[Swansman]

It's amazing how this misinformed bile still continues. The evidence of genuine anti semitism on the left was miniscule and those responsible should be dealt with, preferably with extreme violence. However, as the documentary clearly showed the vast accusations of anti semitism directed at the left was at those either supporting the Palestinian right to return and equality or condemning the actions of Israel. It was not a Zionist plot, it was a concerted effort to undermine the chances of a left wing government. The anti semitism row was just one of the tools used by both the right of the Labour Party, the media, Israeli lobbyists, the Tories and those threatened by a curbing of the powers of those who have (and still do) their wealthy faces in the trough. As a Jewish anti Zionist it was horrific to watch my local MP Stella Creasy constantly appearing on TV to throw baseless accusations of how Jews were treated in her local branch meetings, of which I attended all but one in three years. Also a branch dominated by left wing Jews. Not only was there no examples of anti semitism in those meetings, Israel was only on the agenda once - a motion to condemn the gunning down of peaceful protesters on the Right to Return March. Of the 70 members in the room only 2 voted against it and one of them claimed everyone killed was an armed member of Hamas. To avoid confrontation the motion was put forward and he made a long speech in reply, then it went straight to the vote and he stormed out. End of. To label Al Jazeera as a terrorist supporting news channel smacks of Daily Mail ignorance.

Great comment. Good enough to make [MENTION=21158]Weststander[/MENTION] and [MENTION=1200]Harry Wilson's tackle[/MENTION] and the others who are afraid of both reality & left-wing politics to completely ignore it.

Must be tiresome to be in your position. Keep up the good fight. Your country (like most) could need some people-friendly politics.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Anyone seen the new Al Jazeera documentary (3 parts) on the huge leak of Labour's internal files? Has some shocking revelations. The first episode includes sections on Brighton/Hove.

The second, shows how the Labour left were/are being targeted and smeared with various claims - mainly anti-semitism in order to remove or suspend them from the party. Under Starmer this includes over 50 leftwing Jews.

Also how the Labour right and supporters of Israel tried to undermine Corbyn with false stories with which the media gladly ran and ran with. 23% of complaints on AS came from one man! He was not Jewish but wrote the emails using a Jewish name as pseudonym.

What I find most disturbing other than the Labour Party being corrupt and mendacious actively sabotaged their own chances but that this documentary has so far from what I can see no coverage amongst the main newspapers etc.

If anyone is are under illusion that we have a balanced, free and fair press this demonstrates this is in no way the case. Also shows how the Labour right, Tories and Israel supporters weaponised AS in the most disgusting way. A sickening and disgraceful episode in British Politics.

Second episode below.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5DTMF0MSXng&t=1223s

Not all British Jews oppose Corbyn. Er, that's it.

First several minutes is a load of people ranting. The provenance of the files is not validated. The vox pops are anecdotal. The narrative is rather odd – it suggested at one point that Jews were trying to undermine Corbyn. There are repeated tracts of film about the bad things that Israel has done. It is apparent after 12 minutes or so (it took a while) that the main text of the documentary is an attack on Israel. Importantly the ‘files’ that contain all the information about a labour party-led conspiracy, presumably run by Starmer, are not shown. What conspiracy? This is a load of old bollocks. Livingstone really did say Hitler was a Zionist. It really was embarrassing, and labour is certainly better off without these tossers. The documentary is rather a mess. No wonder it hasn’t resonated.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

It's amazing how this misinformed bile still continues. The evidence of genuine anti semitism on the left was miniscule and those responsible should be dealt with, preferably with extreme violence. However, as the documentary clearly showed the vast accusations of anti semitism directed at the left was at those either supporting the Palestinian right to return and equality or condemning the actions of Israel. It was not a Zionist plot, it was a concerted effort to undermine the chances of a left wing government. The anti semitism row was just one of the tools used by both the right of the Labour Party, the media, Israeli lobbyists, the Tories and those threatened by a curbing of the powers of those who have (and still do) their wealthy faces in the trough. As a Jewish anti Zionist it was horrific to watch my local MP Stella Creasy constantly appearing on TV to throw baseless accusations of how Jews were treated in her local branch meetings, of which I attended all but one in three years. Also a branch dominated by left wing Jews. Not only was there no examples of anti semitism in those meetings, Israel was only on the agenda once - a motion to condemn the gunning down of peaceful protesters on the Right to Return March. Of the 70 members in the room only 2 voted against it and one of them claimed everyone killed was an armed member of Hamas. To avoid confrontation the motion was put forward and he made a long speech in reply, then it went straight to the vote and he stormed out. End of. To label Al Jazeera as a terrorist supporting news channel smacks of Daily Mail ignorance.

By whom?

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

This is weak, intellectually dishonest and irrelevant to the topic

No it isn't.

 

[Weststander]

Not all British Jews oppose Corbyn. Er, that's it.

First several minutes is a load of people ranting. The provenance of the files is not validated. The vox pops are anecdotal. The narrative is rather odd – it suggested at one point that Jews were trying to undermine Corbyn. There are repeated tracts of film about the bad things that Israel has done. It is apparent after 12 minutes or so (it took a while) that the main text of the documentary is an attack on Israel. Importantly the ‘files’ that contain all the information about a labour party-led conspiracy, presumably run by Starmer, are not shown. What conspiracy? This is a load of old bollocks. Livingstone really did say Hitler was a Zionist. It really was embarrassing, and labour is certainly better off without these tossers. The documentary is rather a mess. No wonder it hasn’t resonated.

A renowned UK scientist (from the centre left) once told me that at his university, the people controlling his staff union forever just had one issue that focused their minds 365. Israel.

Without little interest in injustices on these isles, Putin, Orban, Erdogan, Trump/QAnon, the current genocide of Uyghurs.

What a strange mindset.

 

[Swansman]

No it isn't.

Claiming that a journalist is not credible, while covering an entirely unrelated topic, because they don't share your subjective love for some symbol of the British military, is an incredibly infantile and antiintellectual take.

And somehow I'm not surprised you are unable to see it yourself.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

This. Proven antisemitism.

https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/en/our-work/news/investigation-antisemitism-labour-party-finds-unlawful-acts-discrimination-and

Interesting how this becomes something now .... derailing New Labour's positive week?

Indeed.

I am immediately suspicious when I hear all the 'secret documents' stuff. Lots of it redacted with black lines, as if it has been stolen from the secret services. Why would the Labour party keep all these incriminating documents, and redact bits of them with black lines? No close ups of anything anyone can check. And surely journalistic errors - if The Labour Party has been running the conspiracy, how did it manage to do that during the Corbyn era? There was a reference in there that indicated the conspiracy started long before Corbyn came to become leader. And this was masterminded by Starmer? These claims, and the narrative they supposedly inform, are not credible.

Perhaps Hugh Trevor-Roper will be along soon to declare the documents genuine.

And it has triggered the confirmation bias of all the usual suspects on here. Who knew? They haven't read the secret documents, yet they believe in the conspiracy. All I did was express skepticism, and they come flying in, boots first! Grow up, lads, please.

 

[borat]

Not all British Jews oppose Corbyn. Er, that's it.

First several minutes is a load of people ranting. The provenance of the files is not validated. The vox pops are anecdotal. The narrative is rather odd – it suggested at one point that Jews were trying to undermine Corbyn. There are repeated tracts of film about the bad things that Israel has done. It is apparent after 12 minutes or so (it took a while) that the main text of the documentary is an attack on Israel. Importantly the ‘files’ that contain all the information about a labour party-led conspiracy, presumably run by Starmer, are not shown. What conspiracy? This is a load of old bollocks. Livingstone really did say Hitler was a Zionist. It really was embarrassing, and labour is certainly better off without these tossers. The documentary is rather a mess. No wonder it hasn’t resonated.

If thats what you you took from the doc then I suggest that Cbeebies might be an easier watch for you

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Claiming that a journalist is not credible, while covering an entirely unrelated topic, because they don't share your subjective love for some symbol of the British military, is an incredibly infantile and antiintellectual take.

And somehow I'm not surprised you are unable to see it yourself.

You make too many assumptions. I pasted that text because the man has made a vile attack on Remembrance day. That certainly undermines his integrity and attests to an agenda. I personally do not attend Remembrance services as I'm an ashiest, and I rarely buy a poppy. But I respect those for whom Remembrance resonates. This prick just sneers at it and accuses it of racism. The fact that doesn't bother you is concerning.

 

[Pevenseagull]

Indeed.

I am immediately suspicious when I hear all the 'secret documents' stuff. Lots of it redacted with black lines, as if it has been stolen from the secret services. Why would the Labour party keep all these incriminating documents, and redact bits of them with black lines? No close ups of anything anyone can check. And surely journalistic errors - if The Labour Party has been running the conspiracy, how did it manage to do that during the Corbyn era? There was a reference in there that indicated the conspiracy started long before Corbyn came to become leader. And this was masterminded by Starmer? These claims, and the narrative they supposedly inform, are not credible.

Perhaps Hugh Trevor-Roper will be along soon to declare the documents genuine.

And it has triggered the confirmation bias of all the usual suspects on here. Who knew? They haven't read the secret documents, yet they believe in the conspiracy. All I did was express skepticism, and they come flying in, boots first! Grow up, lads, please.

One of the letters on the Ali J site has ..... the outgoing mayor, REDACTED. Which is thorough.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

If thats what you you took from the doc then I suggest that Cbeebies might be an easier watch for you

Good luck with you campaign to unseat Starmer. I am guessing you're not a secret tory, but instead a hard left type. No compromise with the electrorate and all that. But if anyone takes any notice of this conspiracy nonsense, it won't direct voters to vote for whatever hard left party you support. The votes will go to the Tories. Haven't you worked that out?

However, unless the UK mainstream starts reporting on this story, nobody will know. Presumably you think that the BBC, ITV and Sky are all part of a conspiracy to protect the labour party from left wing attacks, hence the conspiracy of silence?

I think it's you who need to spend more time with children's television, mate. Jackanory would be a great place to start

 

[Machiavelli]

It's amazing how this misinformed bile still continues. The evidence of genuine anti semitism on the left was miniscule and those responsible should be dealt with, preferably with extreme violence. However, as the documentary clearly showed the vast accusations of anti semitism directed at the left was at those either supporting the Palestinian right to return and equality or condemning the actions of Israel. It was not a Zionist plot, it was a concerted effort to undermine the chances of a left wing government. The anti semitism row was just one of the tools used by both the right of the Labour Party, the media, Israeli lobbyists, the Tories and those threatened by a curbing of the powers of those who have (and still do) their wealthy faces in the trough. As a Jewish anti Zionist it was horrific to watch my local MP Stella Creasy constantly appearing on TV to throw baseless accusations of how Jews were treated in her local branch meetings, of which I attended all but one in three years. Also a branch dominated by left wing Jews. Not only was there no examples of anti semitism in those meetings, Israel was only on the agenda once - a motion to condemn the gunning down of peaceful protesters on the Right to Return March. Of the 70 members in the room only 2 voted against it and one of them claimed everyone killed was an armed member of Hamas. To avoid confrontation the motion was put forward and he made a long speech in reply, then it went straight to the vote and he stormed out. End of. To label Al Jazeera as a terrorist supporting news channel smacks of Daily Mail ignorance.

I'm pro-Palestine and deeply sceptical of Israel. Despite that, I won't be watching this. And it was Corbyn's failure to do anything about this narrative, alongside other dreadful 'leadership' decisions, that led to the failure of a Labour government.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

One of the letters on the Ali J site has ..... the outgoing mayor, REDACTED. Which is thorough.

Thank god. We wouldn't want that information leaked!