[Politics] Labour Files - 3 part Documentary

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Starmer is a safe choice for the establishment. He is actively moving the party a more big business funded model. He doesn't rock the boat when it comes to Israel and Saudi Arabia - two countries with appalling human rights and oppressive governments. He won't query US hegemony. He won't disrupt the energy companies or banking industries to any significant degree.

Let's not forget the man also lacks integrity and has large a problem with the truth. He has reneged/watered down on all his pledges that got him elected.

In summary big business or militiary industrial complex or the media would be happy with either Tory or current Labour as they maintain the status quo. Corbyn challenged this hence the ferocious onslaught against him.

Normally I exercise restraint, and my restrained reply to that is....

<sigh>

poppycock.

In the great circle of politics, at one minute to midnight you are two minutes from @mouldyboots in your hatred of the Labour Party. And I suspect Mouldy (who is reasoned, even if I disagree with him on politics) is closer to labour than you.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

This is the design of the story: hundreds of thousands of emails are leaked and they show that the right-wing of the party wanted to get rid of the left-wing. If the actions of Labour damages Labour, then maybe Labour deserves to be damaged, no? Or do you suggest that media etc. should do a blackout on issues because it would be inconvenient if they were revealed?

There's very little that indicates, from previous reigns, that the Labour party have any interest in (other than perhaps short-term) increasing equality.

While wealth distribution may have largely been the same looking at it from a strictly monetary perspective, assets are (or should be) included in the concept of wealth. What is publicly owned is also the assets of England, and hence the English people, particularly those who can not afford the private, market-steered options. If a party, like Labour did, does a lot of privatisation, it means your assets decrease. While this might punish everyone, it will strike harder on the poor, who can't afford a eg a private doctor and will have to go to the NHS, which got partially privatised (almost always meaning more expensive and with money, in the form of profit, going to private companies) under Labour rule.

A party which is pro-privatisation can never be a left-wing party, it can also never be a pro-equality party.

Politics is the art of the possible.

Staying true to a pure doctrine, come what may, election loss after loss, shyster tory after shyster tory, culminating in Johnson and now thick lizzie, is the art of cults.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Ok, so what is his take then? Why does he think the poppy is a white supremacy symbol? I thought my theory about the British military directly or indirectly killing millions of Africans and Asian was a pretty good theory, but apparently you think he had additional arguments? Keen to hear those.

Because he's an idiot? Because he loathes himself and his nation? Because he wishes Hitler had won? I don't know.

And I don't care.

 

[Swansman]

Because he's an idiot? Because he loathes himself and his nation? Because he wishes Hitler had won? I don't know.

And I don't care.

Maybe he just loaths the killing of people in Africa and Asia but otherwise think the nation is fine?

I've met British people who were pacifists and anti-imperialists and still quite proud over England and its culture.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Maybe he just loaths the killing of people in Africa and Asia but otherwise think the nation is fine?

I've met British people who were pacifists and anti-imperialists and still quite proud over England and its culture.

Alright. I'll stop squabbling. It's more fun to do that in a bar, with beers. I think his look is not a good look and I'll leave it at that.

Enjoy the rest of your evening

 

[clapham_gull]

Starmer is a safe choice for the establishment. He is actively moving the party a more big business funded model. He doesn't rock the boat when it comes to Israel and Saudi Arabia - two countries with appalling human rights and oppressive governments. He won't query US hegemony. He won't disrupt the energy companies or banking industries to any significant degree.

Let's not forget the man also lacks integrity and has large a problem with the truth. He has reneged/watered down on all his pledges that got him elected.

In summary big business or militiary industrial complex or the media would be happy with either Tory or current Labour as they maintain the status quo. Corbyn challenged this hence the ferocious onslaught against him.

He's also a relatively safe choice for the electorate which is what really matters and tonight Labour are 17% ahead in the polls.

I'm sure it's quite empowering to view the world as being "controlled" by the media and big business, but the reality is that the majority of people in this country are right of centre in their politics if some only a little bit so.

That's one of the reasons the Conservatives are so successful. Labour get in by moving to the centre and/or the Conservatives self imploding.

Once you get in power you can do as you damn well like if you get the votes through Parliament, but you have to persuade a mainly right of centre electorate first.

It wasn't the media that promised free broadband.

Starmer understands that, Corbyn with all his ideological stubbornness refused to acknowledge it.

That's why he is a brilliant, consistent and ethical campaigning local MP, but isn't a leader and it was a huge mistake of the membership to think he was.

He may have attracted millions of young voters as "something new", but unfortunately he resembled a 1970s throw back to not only those who vote Tory but millions who have historically voted them out.

As for "reneged/watered down on all his pledges that got him elected", well that's the same self entitled thinking that saw Liz Truss elected leader.

Personally I'd remove the Leader vote from members and leave it to the democratically elected MPs.

 

[wellquickwoody]

A documentary that will have no impact I'm afraid. Preaching for the choir, really.

Most people are afraid of this kind of information and will blindly reject it, as accepting it would cause a paradigm shift in their beliefs over multiple areas - which isn't pleasant.
People don't want it and will cognitively resort into denial.

Only the #5 post and I knew the thread would be a conspiracy hatchet job. Watched the first minute of the first episode and realised it was a bunch of hard left campaigners/Liverpool snout-in-trough councillors blaming outsiders for their woes. All made sense.

 

[CheeseRolls]

*Edit - Below was meant to reply to Harry Wilson's Tackles post.

A journalist for Novara media (a small outlet) highlighted it - one of the few outlets to mention it. The fact its not out there on every major outlet should be shocking but shows the British press is a monolith that has a clear agenda.

Democracy is/was subverted before our eyes and it doesnt seem worth a mention (as yet)

I watched part one.

A number of people here appeared to be trying anything possible to oust others from the party whom they didn't agree with and then complained loudly when the same treatment was returned to them in kind.
No one here was given the right of reply, which was telling and whilst I didn't know all the characters, I didn't recognise Peter Kyle as the devious establishment figure he was painted as.

Why is it that so many Jewish people and Ukrainians are so scathing of Saint Jeremy. Maybe just maybe he doesn't always get things right.

 

[clapham_gull]

You're definitely right that communism - England owning England - is not the mainstream view in the UK.
The neo-liberal idea of selling the entire country, making China, US, Russia and Saudi Arabia the owners of England, seems to be the most common view.

Neo Liberal definitely isn't a mainstream view either. Just the plan of a very few individuals who used Brexit as a cover to try and achieve it.

Not even a conspiracy theory, most of the main players wrote it all down. They just needed the EU out the way first and a number on the left like celebrity comedy panel member and union leader Mick Lynch helped enable it as well as encouraging his members to do so.

Thanks Mick.

The remain/leave argument is now a side issue. The real issue now is what those Neo-Liberals have decided to do with their blank piece of paper and whether their traditional supporters wise up.

 

[e77]

You want it to be that simple, and you want it to be the end.

Yes and yes. Thanks for asking.

 

[Hugo Rune]

Starmer is a safe choice for the establishment. He is actively moving the party a more big business funded model. He doesn't rock the boat when it comes to Israel and Saudi Arabia - two countries with appalling human rights and oppressive governments. He won't query US hegemony. He won't disrupt the energy companies or banking industries to any significant degree.

Let's not forget the man also lacks integrity and has large a problem with the truth. He has reneged/watered down on all his pledges that got him elected.

In summary big business or militiary industrial complex or the media would be happy with either Tory or current Labour as they maintain the status quo. Corbyn challenged this hence the ferocious onslaught against him.

You seem to be totally drunk on idealism with not a whiff of pragmatism.

People like you mean that we get governed by the likes of Johnson and Truss. You’ll always look to divide and split the Labour Party lusting after an ideologue leader that will never be elected.

Corbyn was never a leader. He didn’t have the skills. And his legacy is being beaten by Boris bloody Johnson. I will never forgive him or those elements of the Labour Party that allowed Johnson, the worst Prime Minster in the history of Britain, to be elected by being so profoundly unelectable themselves.

 

[Swansman]

You seem to be totally drunk on idealism with not a whiff of pragmatism.

People like you mean that we get governed by the likes of Johnson and Truss. You’ll always look to divide and split the Labour Party lusting after an ideologue leader that will never be elected.

Corbyn was never a leader. He didn’t have the skills. And his legacy is being beaten by Boris bloody Johnson. I will never forgive him or those elements of the Labour Party that allowed Johnson, the worst Prime Minster in the history of Britain, to be elected by being so profoundly unelectable themselves.

No actually people like you and the others in this thread who accept ANYTHING except real left-wing politics are the reason why you end up with people like Johnson and Truss.

 

[London Irish]

Have watched the first 2 episodes and as yet nothing has surprised me. Just nice to see evidence of what many of us suspected at the time.

Yes it's very good, but none of it is especially new, the gist has been reported before in Left media and all of us who went through the active attempts to sabotage a Labour government between 2015 and 2019 lived this crap every day.

Actual members of the Labour Party in powerful positions who hated progressive ideas just shitting on every attempt to get Labour elected. It was a shocking perversion of democracy but you go up against the Establishment (and these people are that) and they will use everything to destroy you.

A side comment, the bits about Brighton in the documentaries are perhaps the most superfluous, while designed to illustrate how a culture of rightwing bullying is rampant in the party, it's a complicated issue and not all the abuse that was detailed came from Labour Party members and that might not have been clear to the average viewer

 

[borat]

The third episode is out

Shows evidence of a hierarchy of racism. Black and brown members subject to secret surveillance and their underage children.

Disgusting to see and outrageous that this doc has still not been covered by major outlets.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-cHBQf5z_M

 

[Swansman]

The third episode is out

Shows evidence of a hierarchy of racism. Black and brown members subject to secret surveillance and their underage children.

Disgusting to see and outrageous that this doc has still not been covered by major outlets.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-cHBQf5z_M

500 gigabyte of emails leaked from a big political party in the UK.

Reveals a ****load of dirt.

Not a mention from mainstream media.

"There's no conspiracy"

 

[London Irish]

500 gigabyte of emails leaked from a big political party in the UK.

Reveals a ****load of dirt.

Not a mention from mainstream media.

"There's no conspiracy"

I sort of agreed with your orginal comment that this would not break through to the mainstream (I realise lobby journalists operate as a kind of a cartel with rightist and centrist biases and are just not interested in any stories where the victims are leftwing) but with all the legal injunctions flying around to delay the programme being aired, I wonder if there might be a risk of some kind of Streisand effect

 

[CheeseRolls]

Maybe one reason this is not of interest to the broader media?
https://unherd.com/2022/09/the-last-days-of-jeremy-corbyn/

 

[Live by the sea]

Maybe one reason this is not of interest to the broader media?
https://unherd.com/2022/09/the-last-days-of-jeremy-corbyn/

Good article, sums Labour up under Corbyn very well . Corbyn views and his supporters might go down well in some South American country but not here in the UK . The public here are far more Sophisticated to fall for all that revolution nonsense . Extreme left wingers always looking for someone else to blame for their own failings .

Keir is sensible and centre middle and that’s what’s needed now .

 

[clapham_gull]

Maybe one reason this is not of interest to the broader media?
https://unherd.com/2022/09/the-last-days-of-jeremy-corbyn/

ouch

 

[London Irish]

Maybe one reason this is not of interest to the broader media?
https://unherd.com/2022/09/the-last-days-of-jeremy-corbyn/

That's a piece by a rightwing journalist on Unherd, a rightwing blog site. If your point is that sums up the biases of the UK media, then I totally agree!