Jeremy Corbyn.

[Theodoridi]

Someone needs to stand up for the vulnerable, the poor and working people, none of the other leadership candidates (with maybe the exception of Burnham, though I am slightly suspicious of his motives in trying to 'copy' Corbyn) do so currently. Cooper seems bitter that she hasn't been able to just walk into the job and is deluded if she thinks she's got a realistic chance of winning now (she also accuses her opponents of sexism if they criticise her or try to snap her out of her delusion). As for Kendall, she is an absolute careerist, piece of work who has, in interview with the BBC, said that the Labour party needs to stand up not just the poor and vulnerable but 'ordinary people' as well. Surely she can't seriously think that the poor and vulnerable aren't ordinary people? Burnham, who I mentioned earlier, would say anything he thinks will get him elected, which is why I am suspicious of whether or not he would actually fight for the things he has said he will if he was elected leader.

 

[cunning fergus]

Very good summarised speech from Corbyn on American influence over British and international affairs.

Indeed, and here's what the leader of the most capitalist country in the world has to say about Britiand and its relationship with the EU.........

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/jul/23/barack-obama-britain-remain-eu-world-more-prosperous

No doubt the interests of the British working class are right up there on his list of priorities.

The irony of the leader of the U.S. telling the people of Britain that it's people should accept taxation policies instituted on it by an unelected institution is absolutely incredible..........

He needs to understand more about his and this country's history.

 

[BLOCK F]

Yeah because this capitalist utopia we live in currently and you love so much works so well!

Pathetic response Plooks. I mean, socialism has been such a success throughout the world, hasn't it?
You fruitloops just don't live in the real world.

 

[Bakero]

I have to say I am enjoying watching the separatism of socialist ideology, we now have real socialists like [MENTION=12825]cunning fergus[/MENTION] , champagne socialists like [MENTION=409]Herr Tubthumper[/MENTION] and Bollinger Bolsheviks like [MENTION=7]Mustafa[/MENTION].

The 2017 referendum will be very interesting to see if the Corbyn movement will be really different as claimed and get behind unions and other socialist organisations and back a EU exit or will it revert back to New labour and Blairism and stick to the same old EU mantra.

This article caught my eye

http://www.capx.co/socialist-corbyn-supporters-are-living-in-an-anti-capitalist-fantasy-world/

If you want to know what Labour party members really think about the four leadership contenders, you could do a lot worse than ask readers of the Guardian newspaper.

That’s precisely what the Guardian did, carrying out a survey of its “core” readership, asking them who they support out of Jeremy Corbyn, Andy Burnham, Yvette Cooper and Liz Kendall. That poll found an extraordinary 51 per cent of those committed, long term readers chose Corbyn as their preferred candidate. The next highest scorer was Yvette Cooper with a measly seven per cent.

This is perhaps not staggering news – it is the Guardian, after all – but it does tell us something else about many Left-wing Labour supporters: they have taken leave of their senses.

I say that not because Jeremy Corbyn is a bad, stupid or incompetent man. He is none of those things. On the contrary, he is highly intelligent and very nice indeed.

But he is completely and utterly wrong about one thing and, unfortunately for his party and for the rest of the country, it’s rather a crucial thing: he is a socialist.
By that, I don’t mean that he wants more regulation of capitalism and more taxing of profits. I mean that he genuinely believes that a socialist economic system, with state control of the means of production, would deliver a fairer, more equal, richer and happier society that the existing capitalist system. And huge swathes of Labour supporters – Guardian readers and others – agree with him.

A Corbyn victory on September 12would represent not just a defeat for Blairism but the mass rejection of capitalism by large swathes of the Labour party.

This is not about the wide scale infiltration of the party by the Hard Left. Those claims simply don’t add up since, if you exclude the Greens and the SNP (and there’s no evidence their supporters are paying their £3 Labour joining fee in any large numbers), only a small number of people voted for the array of parties to the left of Labour.

There were 1,229 votes for the Communist Party – across the entire country – while the Socialist Labour Party managed 3,481 votes and Class War got 526. TUSC, the Trade Unionist and Socialist Coalition, managed to drum up 36,368 votes. But that still only makes a total of 40,504 votes for the Hard Left in May; 0.0008 per cent of a the 46 million-strong electorate.

Is there a secret crowd of Hard Left devotees living in Britain who have never bothered to vote before but have now been so moved by the prospect of a Corbyn victory that they are signing up to join the Labour party en masse in order to vote for him as the next Labour leader?

No, the votes for Jeremy Corbyn aren’t coming from trouble-makers outside the Labour party, they are coming from existing members. And that suggests something far more worrying: there are still many thousands of Labour party members who are fully signed up to the vision of a socialist utopia.
Thousands of perfectly sensible, educated people holding down often well paid, responsible jobs, who genuinely believe that capitalism is the great evil of our time and that the answer to all of our country’s ills is socialism.

Thousands of Guardian-reading middle class professionals who think that capitalism – the only economic system humans have ever come up with which is proven to deliver wealth to the masses – has failed. They aren’t voting for Corbyn as a joke, or because they don’t care if he wins or not, they are voting for him as a kind of “revolution by proxy” from their smart homes in Islington and Hampstead or from their quaint holiday homes in Tuscany.

The Labour leadership contest has revealed that, in 21st century Britain, as elsewhere in Europe, there are plenty of apparently sane people who genuinely believe – despite all the evidence to the contrary – that capitalism is bad.

Forget that capitalism has brought a rise in living standards for the majority of people on this planet over the past century that goes far beyond the wildest dreams of the most evangelical Victorian benefactor. Forget that not a single state where socialism has been attempted has managed to deliver anything but abject poverty and misery to their people.
And forget too that not a single socialist country has managed to bring even a semblance of real equality to its people. Indeed, ignore the fact that the people of these socialist utopias are so ecstatically happy with socialism that they are forbidden from voting for any alternative and are often forcibly prevented from leaving.

Proper socialism was tried in Russia, in Eastern Europe, in China, in Yugoslavia, and in Cuba. And it failed.

Regardless of all that, the prospect of electing a committed socialist to the leadership of the Labour Party is clearly too good a prospect for some to ignore.

This Labour leadership contest, then, is not so much a battle between the left and right of the Labour party, but a battle between socialism and capitalism or, as it should more accurately be termed: fantasy and reality. In the end, reality will be the victor. Because, whether the Guardian readers who are voting for Corbyn like it or not, most of us in Britain don’t want to live in a socialist utopia. We prefer to live in the real world.

Social democracy isn't Soviet Communism.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Indeed, and here's what the leader of the most capitalist country in the world has to say about Britiand and its relationship with the EU.........

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/jul/23/barack-obama-britain-remain-eu-world-more-prosperous

No doubt the interests of the British working class are right up there on his list of priorities.

The irony of the leader of the U.S. telling the people of Britain that it's people should accept taxation policies instituted on it by an unelected institution is absolutely incredible..........

He needs to understand more about his and this country's history.

Yeah, the bloody Harvard educated idiot. What does he know that Cunning Fergus and his search engine doesn't?

 

[cunning fergus]

Yeah, the bloody Harvard educated idiot. What does he know that Cunning Fergus and his search engine doesn't?

I reckon he knows the difference between socialism and capitalism?

Which is why as a capitalist, and leader of the most capitalist country in the world he wants the UK in the EU.

Next question Margaret.

 

[Stat Brother]

How can anybody take this man seriously?




What the F*** has he done to that stem.

 

[Horton's halftime iceberg]

Amsterdamer

 

[Titanic]

Whatever the result... the new labour leader has a massive job as they hit a new five year low:

ComRes/DailyMail poll: Con 42 +2, Lab 28 -1, Lib Dem 8, UKIP 9 -4, Other 14 +3

 

[cunning fergus]

The right-wing press getting more desperate by the day

Corbyn will be cheered by racists and terrorists

...in response to Corbyn's unprecedented and ever increasing popularity, although they are still in denial about that

Not just the right wing press, Polly Toynbee in today's Guardian is sticking the boot In because he won't appeal to Tory votes, unlike Yvette Cooper.

So there it is, people like Polly who consider themselves as lefties, actually aren't.

They are just anti Tory shills, who when given the opportunity to embrace socialism actually don't want it because they want someone more "electable".

People like Polly are worse than Tories.

 

[beorhthelm]

Whatever the result... the new labour leader has a massive job as they hit a new five year low:

ComRes/DailyMail poll: Con 42 +2, Lab 28 -1, Lib Dem 8, UKIP 9 -4, Other 14 +3

but Corbyn has unprecedented and ever increasing popularity, so that doesnt make any sense.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

People like Polly are worse than Tories.

Come on, she's not that selfish and nasty.

 

[Horton's halftime iceberg]

Really good, Labour leader hustings on the radio this morning, all of them have become very rounded after speaking at hundreds, some with a bit more substance, and some just I will make a really really really good leader. Does not start until 8 and a half minutes in

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b069xw2v

I love the news night film clip above, really sums up the grassroots support he is attracting which could transform the party back to its own union roots.

 

[Pantani]

but Corbyn has unprecedented and ever increasing popularity, so that doesnt make any sense.

Of course it does. Corbyn isn't leader yet. Any party under going a leadership election will drop in popularity, those people who are saying they won't vote Labour are as much criticising Cooper, Burnham and Kendall as they are Corbyn.

The criticism that Corbyn is getting from the Tory's on here and in the media (as well as the more centrist members of his own party) is very interesting. A lot seem to have forgotten that Corbyn's first job is to represent the opinions of the people who are voting for him (his constituents and Labour members). Most Labour supporters want more left wing policies from their party, and not to be told what they should think so 'their' party can get elected. That is why Corbyn is winning. It makes literally no difference (at this point) whether he can get elected. Unfortunately, the political elite in this country are too obsessed with winning at all costs, and not necessarily with their principles. Corbyn is winning because we actually think we can believe what he says.

 

[Horton's halftime iceberg]

Of course it does. Corbyn isn't leader yet. Any party under going a leadership election will drop in popularity, those people who are saying they won't vote Labour are as much criticising Cooper, Burnham and Kendall as they are Corbyn.

The criticism that Corbyn is getting from the Tory's on here and in the media (as well as the more centrist members of his own party) is very interesting. A lot seem to have forgotten that Corbyn's first job is to represent the opinions of the people who are voting for him (his constituents and Labour members). Most Labour supporters want more left wing policies from their party, and not to be told what they should think so 'their' party can get elected. That is why Corbyn is winning. It makes literally no difference (at this point) whether he can get elected. Unfortunately, the political elite in this country are too obsessed with winning at all costs, and not necessarily with their principles. Corbyn is winning because we actually think we can believe what he says.

Corbyn was probably considered to he centre of the party before New Labour took it over to the right of politics, so the fact he is seen as a raving left winger by some in the press shows how far that right wing politics have become the norm that he is seen as new or radical

 

[cunning fergus]

Come on, she's not that selfish and nasty.

On the contrary, it is only her sense of selfishness that has compelled her to write the column she has today arguing for Cooper as oppose to Corbyn.

She understands genuine socialism would end neo liberalism, a point she often complains about (eg austerity policies championed by Osbourne) yet Cooper would not end them, whereas Corbyn would.

In contrast Toynbee is prepared to accept EU austerity programmes because they are for the greater good of the EU project.......she's prepared to let the poor in the Greece starve.

That is why she, and people like you are not socialists, you are at the liberal end of the Tory party, masquerading as ersatz socialists.

Selfishness and nastiness personified.

 

[Bakero]

Corbyn was probably considered to he centre of the party before New Labour took it over to the right of politics, so the fact he is seen as a raving left winger by some in the press shows how far that right wing politics have become the norm that he is seen as new or radical

Very true. Historically speaking, Corbyn's policy are far from radical. Through the 50s and 60s top rate tax was 90%.

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

you are at the liberal end of the Tory party

Selfishness and nastiness personified.

How selfish and nasty must be the right-wing end of the Tory party ?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

On the contrary, it is only her sense of selfishness that has compelled her to write the column she has today arguing for Cooper as oppose to Corbyn.

She understands genuine socialism would end neo liberalism, a point she often complains about (eg austerity policies championed by Osbourne) yet Cooper would not end them, whereas Corbyn would.

In contrast Toynbee is prepared to accept EU austerity programmes because they are for the greater good of the EU project.......she's prepared to let the poor in the Greece starve.

That is why she, and people like you are not socialists, you are at the liberal end of the Tory party, masquerading as ersatz socialists.

Selfishness and nastiness personified.

Your argument reminds me of that "where's the missing pound" maths puzzle.

Yes of course, I'm a Tory. Well done.

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

Your argument reminds me of that "where's the missing pound" maths puzzle.

Yes of course, I'm a Tory. Well done.

By this sort of analysis, that's you and me both, squire.

Quite hilarious.