ISIS execute 13 football fans by firing squad

[pastafarian]

Just being pedantic, but Catholicism is not a religion. It is a denomination of the Christian Religion.

So Catholics are from the same religion as such fanatical hard-liners as the Quakers and the Salvation Army

If you want to be super pedantic christianity is not a religion,well according to Bill O`Reilly anyway

 

[Wilko]

Just to throw a spanner in the works of this thread but should our long term goal in humanity be to get people detached from religion as a whole (not just Muslims but all religions)? I am still absolutely staggered that any intelligent adult can believe utter, utter nonsense, and it is nonsense, it is actually laughable that anyone could believe it.

Someone posted that wonderful video of Hitchens saying 'Don't waste my time' in response to the idea that god (not using a capital G) spoke to prophets who all wrote down the words and ideas in perfect arabic. That is the basis for an entire faith. Laughable, just laughable.

 

[somerset]

Nah.

Bore off

 

[somerset]

In turn, I am sorry to disappoint you, but you are wrong.

I have been at a meeting this morning where a devout muslim for whom I have a great deal of respect shared in - in fact led - the condemnation of the things that ISIS and others do, and used those exact words: "These people are not Muslims."

Oh, if he said so it must be true,.......

 

[Gullys Cats]

****ing disgusting

 

[somerset]

.......Yet the media tried to frame it as Islam terrorism..

[MENTION=1313]BadFish[/MENTION] ........ no actually, if you were actually awake, and not distracted by mass cut and pastes to support your dull theories, you will have noticed that he himself framed it as Islamic Terrorism......... or is that fact swiftly swept under your rug of ignorance, in a vain and desperate attempt to point the finger elsewhere.

 

[somerset]

- I think religion still has a lot to offer us as human beings, especially if people can find useful symbolic and spiritual meaning from it.

..... I think that is what any reasonable person would hope for, but the sad reality is that even (arguably) the most benign and gentle of all major religions, Buddhism, has a very dark thread of religious violence and intolerance, especially against muslims.

I see religion like this,..... In the same way that football fans have allegiances and loyalty towards a particular team, and wear that shirt with pride..... religious people 'support' their particular choice of faith. As long as they don't push that faith/belief system in my face, or be overly critical/aggressive about my personal choices,.... then ce la vie,.... each to his own.

 

[cjd]

In turn, I am sorry to disappoint you, but you are wrong.

I have been at a meeting this morning where a devout muslim for whom I have a great deal of respect shared in - in fact led - the condemnation of the things that ISIS and others do, and used those exact words: "These people are not Muslims."

Oh...OK then. Believe what you want.

As far as I,m concerned your 'friend' is just another Muslim with his head stuck up his a**e with regard to reality.

Carry on.

 

[symyjym]

...........However, if the alternative to religion is atheism I think that could be just as harmful to society, if not more so - I think religion still has a lot to offer us as human beings.................

Completely disagree with this Mustafa. To accept our own mortality is a great thing, and it makes this one life even more precious than if it were made by God.

 

[Buzzer]

In turn, I am sorry to disappoint you, but you are wrong.

They quite clearly ARE Muslims. All the clues are there whether or not you and your friend choose to ignore them.

 

[carlzeiss]

Oh dear , apparently keeping pigeons is Un-Islamic and punishable by death .

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...eon-breeders-Iraq-deciding-Islamic-birds.html

 

[adub68]

A couple of observations that have not been widely reported

1. Al-Azhar University regarded by many as the highest scholarly institution in the sunni muslim religion recently ruled that while IS can be called terrorists they cannot be deemed heretics as only God can give this judgement ie nobody can rule on whether they are or are not at variance with the established religion.. This clarification was needed as the most senior imman of Nigeria had indicated that they should be deemed heretic's. One of the other justifications they gave for not being heretics was that they continued to be in compliance with Shahada ie to proclaim that Allah was the one God and Muhammad his prophet. You can find their "press release" on the internet in English

2 The recent speech from President Sisi of Egypt (granted himself not exactly the flag bearer of civilised behaviour) was an extraordinary (and potentially dangerous) intervention at the college of immans on New Year's day where he articulated what many non-Muslims (and I hope the vast majority of Muslims believe to be the issue). Translated extract below:

"I am referring here to the religious clerics. We have to think hard about what we are facing—and I have, in fact, addressed this topic a couple of times before. It’s inconceivable that the thinking that we hold most sacred should cause the entire umma [Islamic world] to be a source of anxiety, danger, killing and destruction for the rest of the world. Impossible!
That thinking—I am not saying “religion” but “thinking”—that corpus of texts and ideas that we have sacralized over the years, to the point that departing from them has become almost impossible, is antagonizing the entire world. It’s antagonizing the entire world!
Is it possible that 1.6 billion people [Muslims] should want to kill the rest of the world’s inhabitants—that is 7 billion—so that they themselves may live? Impossible!
I am saying these words here at Al Azhar, before this assembly of scholars and ulema—Allah Almighty be witness to your truth on Judgment Day concerning that which I’m talking about now.
All this that I am telling you, you cannot feel it if you remain trapped within this mindset. You need to step outside of yourselves to be able to observe it and reflect on it from a more enlightened perspective.
I say and repeat again that we are in need of a religious revolution. You, imams, are responsible before Allah. The entire world, I say it again, the entire world is waiting for your next move . . . because this umma/nation/Islamic world is being torn, it is being destroyed, it is being lost—and it is being lost by our own hands.

3. The difference between not obeying the commandment "thou shalt not kill" and an islamist interpretation that says "thou shall kill" are two different very different issues!

 

[BadFish]

[MENTION=1313]BadFish[/MENTION] ........ no actually, if you were actually awake, and not distracted by mass cut and pastes to support your dull theories, you will have noticed that he himself framed it as Islamic Terrorism......... or is that fact swiftly swept under your rug of ignorance, in a vain and desperate attempt to point the finger elsewhere.

Well if a man with mental health issues said it was, then it must have been. He couldn't even get the words right on his flag.

 

[somerset]

Well if a man with mental health issues said it was, then it must have been. He couldn't even get the words right on his flag.

You see, in your rush to excuse terrorism, you can't even get that right. His flag didn't have the wrong wording, it was simply another Islamic flag....... this he realised, and was thus asking for an IS flag, seeing that he was a Sunni convert keen to die a martyr for his cause.

 

[NooBHA]

I think there should be a full press ban on reporting such atrocities as carried out by ISIS and all removed from internet sites as soon as possible with no mention of them. Then perhaps when they have no public forum then they might become less frequent. Although I know it won't stop them.

The problem is that Western Governments need them to be shown as well so that they can drum up public support to go in and attack who they want in these regions.

I have no answer to this problem and neither do Governments and I fear it will go on and on. The world we live in is a wonderful world for some people and a nightmare for some others but that has been the same for thousands of years. It is no more or no less barbaric than the times of the Greek or Roman Empires. Or for that matter when the French, British, Dutch, Spanish and Portuguese Colonist raped and pillaged other parts or the world for its wealth.

We all want it to end but it won't and we can only hope that we never personally come up against the barbarity of it all

 

[BadFish]

You see, in your rush to excuse terrorism, you can't even get that right. His flag didn't have the wrong wording, it was simply another Islamic flag....... this he realised, and was thus asking for an IS flag, seeing that he was a Sunni convert keen to die a martyr for his cause.

"Excuse terrorism" oh dear, oh dear. Now we are into NSC by numbers I will disengage as any useful discussion is getting lost in nitpicking and points scoring.

 

[Wilko]

I would agree that anyone who takes any of the holy books literally ( apart from the kama sutra) is most probably a little naive to say the least. However, if the alternative to religion is atheism I think that could be just as harmful to society, if not more so - I think religion still has a lot to offer us as human beings, especially if people can find useful symbolic and spiritual meaning from it. Afterall, we still understand so very little about the universe, particularly the great problems such as whether there is a God or not, so to reject religion completely, considering the role it has played in human history, would be just as naive as following it "religiously".

I think the key approach that we should be taking onto all religions is to accept, tolerate, educate and ultimately moderate & modernise - while at the same time learning from it ourselves.

I do not see what religion can offer at all, if we are going to mention good ethics, morals, charity, be kind to each other etc then all of these can easily be achieved without religion.

 

[Yoda]

Oh dear , apparently keeping pigeons is Un-Islamic and punishable by death .

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...eon-breeders-Iraq-deciding-Islamic-birds.html

What will it mean for Chicken farmers then? After all, they are keeping and breading birds.

 

[somerset]

"Excuse terrorism" oh dear, oh dear. Now we are into NSC by numbers I will disengage as any useful discussion is getting lost in nitpicking and points scoring.

Indeed you did,... you simply excused his actions as those of a raving lunatic who had mental health issues,..... I say he was motivated by IS ideology, which is religious in its nature.

 

[symyjym]

I do not see what religion can offer at all, if we are going to mention good ethics, morals, charity, be kind to each other etc then all of these can easily be achieved without religion.

Yep religion defers accountability, of our actions in this one life, to only being judged by God in the next.

To accept our own mortality makes this one life more precious instead of all this second chance after death fabrication, so maybe without God our species will evolve and appreciate our place in the universe more.