[Albion] Hughton supporters

[Gritt23]

When you look at it like that it is astounding, and to think Leicester only won it 3 years ago with 23 wins.

Interesting to know how the possession stats relate to say La Liga or the Bundesliga (not expecting you to hunt these out). Whether the game as a whole is evolving in similar ways, or whether specifically the PL.

You almost have to feel sorry for Liverpool this season.

I don't have access to those stats, but I'd guess they are similar across the main Leagues in Europe, although I would perhaps doubt the Budeslisga, as purely from a casual viewers perspective,.that League always looks a little more open, competitive and more of a throwback than some of the others.

 

[Steve in Japan]

Well...lets always be honest....if you like lets put it in terms you might see unzen like at Southampton and their history of chop and change over the last three years.
And the rock bottom you mention..no where near it in all honesty

Thats the So'ton that's 10th in the form table (last 10 games) vs our 18th? The same So'ton that have offloaded £300m of talent and still have better players than us? Hmmm.

Rock bottom in PL terms must surely be the 2nd half v Bournemouth, or the 10 pissed strangers vs NUFC in the first half. I mean, genuinely, how much worse can we get......

I am starting to think this CH job-for-life thing is a bit of a CULT.

 

[Justice]

After we won promotion if anyone had said first two seasons you wont ever be in the bottom three we all would of taken it. One dodgy half a season out of the last three and idiots calling for a major change? Even seen Wagner mentioned a man who couldn’t mentally handle the pressure when things went against him. Reality check needed.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Thats the So'ton that's 10th in the form table (last 10 games) vs our 18th? The same So'ton that have offloaded £300m of talent and still have better players than us? Hmmm.

Rock bottom in PL terms must surely be the 2nd half v Bournemouth, or the 10 pissed strangers vs NUFC in the first half. I mean, genuinely, how much worse can we get......

I am starting to think this CH job-for-life thing is a bit of a CULT.

Using the form table for the last ten games is a desperate way to put forward your agenda. Fortunately Tony Bloom looks at the club in terms of five and ten years.

 

[Gritt23]

Thats the So'ton that's 10th in the form table (last 10 games) vs our 18th? The same So'ton that have offloaded £300m of talent and still have better players than us? Hmmm.

Rock bottom in PL terms must surely be the 2nd half v Bournemouth, or the 10 pissed strangers vs NUFC in the first half. I mean, genuinely, how much worse can we get......

I am starting to think this CH job-for-life thing is a bit of a CULT.

All I need to know is that I don't want to go down the "Southampton route" if that means you have to endure 10 months of Mark Hughes. Eek.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Past experience is the only basis we have for predicting the future, and the past experiences tell me that we have rarely seen managers come our way that are better than the one we have now. My "stupid" (don't appreciate that) question merely demonstrates that fact, as does everyone's inability to answer it.

I'd love to know where you "50/50" comes from in terms of whether the impact of a managerial change is positive or negative. Or did I misread what you were saying there? I may have done, as I am of course liable to ask stupid questions and presumable be equally stupid at understanding others.

I discussed with someone at the Newcastle home game. They had seen some University study or some such, that analysed a huge amount of data in looking at performance for one manager, then the performance data for a replacement, and the uplift on average from a managerial change was quantified as something like 7 - 8% improvement in performance.

Clearly that would involve many having a drop in performance, while others having a greater improvement. When you consider the vast majority of managerial changes are through poor performance, the uplift is far less than people might expect. Certainly not a finger in the air 50/50.

 

[Steve in Japan]

All I need to know is that I don't want to go down the "Southampton route" if that means you have to endure 10 months of Mark Hughes. Eek.

Which is fair enough

 

[symyjym]

After we won promotion if anyone had said first two seasons you wont ever be in the bottom three we all would of taken it. One dodgy half a season out of the last three and idiots calling for a major change? Even seen Wagner mentioned a man who couldn’t mentally handle the pressure when things went against him. Reality check needed.

Yep all the other teams around us have suffered relegation worries at various parts of the season bar us. Even up until now we have had the luxury of such a large gap it has been more of a concern regarding our performance than a worry about relegation. If the relegation battle goes to the last day it will probably be the only day of real worry that we will have over two seasons.

Sunderland suffered everyday in the bottom 3 for four or five seasons. We've had none of that.

 

[LamieRobertson]

Thats the So'ton that's 10th in the form table (last 10 games) vs our 18th? The same So'ton that have offloaded £300m of talent and still have better players than us? Hmmm.

Rock bottom in PL terms must surely be the 2nd half v Bournemouth, or the 10 pissed strangers vs NUFC in the first half. I mean, genuinely, how much worse can we get......

I am starting to think this CH job-for-life thing is a bit of a CULT.

That’s the same Southampton that despite going through countless managers over the past three years still have had relegation battles ....and are still only three points ahead of us in the table....you can spin it anyway you like lol

Oh and who said job for life....none of us here..still wouldn’t fit in with your rant would it

 

[LamieRobertson]

I don't think anyone with half a brain doubts Hughton as a manager? I think where we disagree is over what we do now? What we cannot do for me at least is assume we will keep getting away with surviving with him as manager and with this budget because performances and results are in decline that is clear. So the question is do we make a change if and obviously only if we can recruit someone with a different philosophy a decent track record who might offer a way forward?

Alternatively, does TB choose to loosen the purse strings? If so Hughton should possibly get the chance to see what he can do with the new budget but even then I would like to see changes to the backroom staff. It's become a bit stale and the level of results and performances must be concerning the board as much as the fans?

What we do now is avoid relegation,because that will dictate what happens in the future purely on monetary grounds

 

[Icy Gull]

We are stuck with him/blessed to have him as manager.

We’ll have to live with it

 

[Weststander]

We are stuck with him/blessed to have him as manager.

We’ll have to live with it

Love your NSC signature. Toto Wolff is a legend, and a good guy.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

All I need to know is that I don't want to go down the "Southampton route" if that means you have to endure 10 months of Mark Hughes. Eek.

Not forgetting that Southampton only stayed up at Swansea's expense on the last day of the season, last year. Funnily enough, they got to an FA cup semi final too.

 

[Seasidesage]

What we do now is avoid relegation,because that will dictate what happens in the future purely on monetary grounds

I don't think anyone other than a certified lunatic would advocate making a change now. I am assuming we will stay up too. If that comes to pass then tough decisions need to be made IMO. As stated that doesn't have to be the sacking of Hughton although I think it should be considered, but significant changes need to be made or we will go down next season, again IMO.

 

[Jolly Red Giant]

I think there’s some re-writing of history going on with our second half vs Newcastle. We were better, but hardly playing exciting attacking football. We scored with our one shot on goal. It just feels like a new dawn because we’ve been so abysmal for months. The key for me is to look at similar clubs we might emulate - Watford have established themselves over years but were never as defensive as us. Newcastle bought Almiron who seemed to transform them (if he played Saturday I think we’d have lost). Bournemouth have played exciting football since thy come up. Of course all also pay higher average wages than we do which, unfortunately, I think has to be part of the answer (as well as changing the manager).

Watford has Deeney scoring 13 and Ighalo scoring 15 in their first season - they finished 13th. The following season they finished 17th - losing their last six games. Deeney scored 10 and Inghalo scored 1 (he was injured). In 2017-2018 they had four players who scored a combined 23 goals - they were 4th after 8 games but steadily declined after that. This season two strikers have scored 11 each and several others who chipped in between 4-7 goals. Since they were promoted they have spent over £170million on transfers.

Newcastle scored very few goals their first season up - and 'ground' out some 1-0 wins and a lot of draws.This season they have two strikers scoring more than 10 goals. The big difference this season is Newcastle have got results from the teams in the bottom half of the PL. Having Rondon has made a difference.

Bournemouth struggled bigtime their first season up and ended 16th - a three game win streak in March saved them. Wilson only played 13 games that season. The following season the were comfortable because King scored 16 goals and two other strikers got 6 each - Wilson also spent some of that season injured. In 2017-2018 the strikers got 25 goals between them and Fraser kicked in another 7 from midfield. And this season Wilson and King have kicked in 26 goals. Bournemouth spent £77million this season - and £160million since they were promoted.

Now you can point the finger and say that Brighton should be doing what these three clubs are doing - but all of them have what Brighton doesn't have - goalscorers - and two of them. And Watford and Bournemouth have spent a significant amount of money consolidating their position in the PL - and even then they have periods when they are under pressure.

Hughton's teams have traditionally played attacking football - but when you are in trouble you have to grind out the results. You can't bake a cake without the right ingredients - and some ingredients are still missing.

 

[Justice]

CH must be raging about AJ if my recruitment team identified him as record signing I would lose it. The guy is nowhere near Knockhaert’s levels. This season has been a bit of a cluster f&@k.

 

[sussex_guy2k2]

Past experience is the only basis we have for predicting the future, and the past experiences tell me that we have rarely seen managers come our way that are better than the one we have now. My "stupid" (don't appreciate that) question merely demonstrates that fact, as does everyone's inability to answer it.

I'd love to know where you "50/50" comes from in terms of whether the impact of a managerial change is positive or negative. Or did I misread what you were saying there? I may have done, as I am of course liable to ask stupid questions and presumable be equally stupid at understanding others.

Okay, let me ask you a few different questions. How many managers out there are better than Hughton right now? How many managers out there are right now are better at developing players? How many are likely to play a more attacking style of football whilst also keeping us in this league? How many are likely to jump at the chance of managing us? I'd wager the answer of "quite a few" to each of those questions. But to suggest, as you have done, that we can't get better because we've never had a manager before who has got us into the Premier League (circa 1992), is utterly ludicrous logic, thus making the question quite a silly one.

The 50/50 is basic mathematics. You suggested that the risk was high that a manager swap would lead to worse results based on our past experiences as a club, and many that have made a similar argument have suggested many other examples of clubs that have changed manager and got worse. But similarly, there are just as many examples of clubs switching managers and getting better. We as supporters have no idea who the club would look to get to replace CH, if indeed they did want to, therefore it's really difficult to suggest either way whether the odds of improvement post-managerial change would be either better or worse than 50/50.

 

[LamieRobertson]

I don't think anyone other than a certified lunatic would advocate making a change now. I am assuming we will stay up too. If that comes to pass then tough decisions need to be made IMO. As stated that doesn't have to be the sacking of Hughton although I think it should be considered, but significant changes need to be made or we will go down next season, again IMO.

Don’t disagree that this summer there needs to be significant work done ..I have spotted a few of that which you mention

 

[Eric Youngs Contact Lense]

Okay, let me ask you a few different questions. How many managers out there are better than Hughton right now? How many managers out there are right now are better at developing players? How many are likely to play a more attacking style of football whilst also keeping us in this league? How many are likely to jump at the chance of managing us? I'd wager the answer of "quite a few" to each of those questions.
You may be right.. but I can't think of any who would make me feel comfortable with the gamble right now and are realistcially available. Who do you have in mind?

 

[Gritt23]

Okay, let me ask you a few different questions. How many managers out there are better than Hughton right now? How many managers out there are right now are better at developing players? How many are likely to play a more attacking style of football whilst also keeping us in this league? How many are likely to jump at the chance of managing us? I'd wager the answer of "quite a few" to each of those questions. But to suggest, as you have done, that we can't get better because we've never had a manager before who has got us into the Premier League (circa 1992), is utterly ludicrous logic, thus making the question quite a silly one.

The 50/50 is basic mathematics. You suggested that the risk was high that a manager swap would lead to worse results based on our past experiences as a club, and many that have made a similar argument have suggested many other examples of clubs that have changed manager and got worse. But similarly, there are just as many examples of clubs switching managers and getting better. We as supporters have no idea who the club would look to get to replace CH, if indeed they did want to, therefore it's really difficult to suggest either way whether the odds of improvement post-managerial change would be either better or worse than 50/50.

Oh my goodness, you never know who you're talking to, and I didn't realise I was talking to someone who has a 1992 cut-off when it comes to football. We have been in the top flight before, football did exist before 1992, it wasn't some sort of rule change that stopped us picking up the ball and running with it, that happened in 1992. The league just rebranded itself. I may just leave this here.

... and btw way saying "50/50 is basic mathematics" doesn't really support your point at all.