bristolseagull
Well-known member
its basic criminal law, he didn't have the requisite mental element, therefore it isn't attempted murder.
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How the hell has this bloke got off this
- Thread starter Napper
- Start date
Cheeky Monkey
Well-known member
- Jul 17, 2003
- 23,868
Err I'd say the dumbell would probably qualify on that score wouldn't you?
sir danny cullip
New member
The mental element, not the physical element. It makes the decision by the jury even stranger. He was heard shouting 'die, die' at the kid during the incident and carried out saying it to himself afterwards. The jury obviously thought this wasn't sufficient evidence for the mental element of attempted murder.
Yes that's what the kids do all day instead of LISTENING to people...
Sure.
The jury did not have to judge on the GBH charge as he pleaded guilty to that, it was attempted murder and GBH with intent that they found him not guilty on.
Mr Harvey dragged the boy - a persistent troublemaker - into a cupboard and hit him about the head with a 3kg dumbbell shouting 'die, die, die'.
The attack fractured the teenager's skull.
And this was a man who had taken to sitting alone talking to himself, but his employers deemed it fit for him to carry on teaching in full posesssion of the facts that his mental state was fragile to say the least.
By December 2008, he said, he was feeling 'very negative and snappy'. He sought help after 'exploding' in separate incidents where two pupils were misbehaving. One had simply been chewing gum.
He recalled one occasion when he was out with his wife and a man looked at him as they passed in the street. 'I wanted to gouge his eyes out', the teacher told police.
That`ll certainly teach that kid to mess with a psychopathic teacher wont it ?
Cheeky Monkey
Well-known member
- Jul 17, 2003
- 23,868
sir danny cullip
New member
I think the jury got it wrong, it seems there was clear intent to murder especially given what he says but they decided not. Like I said earlier it's ironic because he's admitted GBH so had the kid died it would have been enough for a guilty verdict on a murder charge.
If the child had died - and there was a good chance of that after being repeatedly struck around the head with a 3kg dumbell - the teacher would have been tried for murder which would then have been plead bargained down to manslaughter because of diminished responsibility. He has done 8 months in stead of 6 years................ lucky lucky man.
sir albion
New member
This kid was nothing but trouble and it was only a matter of time before a teacher flipped.The right decision in this case
bhaexpress
New member
The problem stems from a lack of discipline. That should start in the home and the kids should know right and wrong by the time they get to school. So a teacher loses the plot and seriously injures a pupil. There's no excuse for either is there ?
Not thinking about what you're doing just acting on autopilot shows more intent than taking a moment to weigh up the outcome to a list of possible attacks?
Even if that kid is Jon Venables? I mean, I don't advocate vigilante justice, but would people have such a reaction to this teacher if the pupil had done to his son what Jon Venables did?
I'm not saying he did, just that perhaps there's a sweeping generalisation of "he's a kid, ergo completely innocent and inconceivable that he might have any responsibility for his actions, which were no doubt just a typical kid pushing his limits". No, I'm not saying anyone deserves a dumbbell to the head, but again, I'm not one for vigilante justice, I thought the guy who along with his brother chased down a burglar and beat him with a cricket bat until his skull fractured and he suffered severe brain damage went over the line of acceptability, but not everyone on here did, so clearly some people on here believe some people can deserve such beating.
Hi, you must be new here. This is NSC, any controversial incident such as this has a clear right or wrong answer, there is no "both were wrong", no "I can see both sides" etc. Choose a side and abuse people who disagree with you!
glasfryn
cleaning up cat sick
absolutely spot on
Knowing the Daily Mail as I do I will expect that they will find out everything about this boy which will include any previous misdemeanors. They`ve had 8 months to do their worst but at the moment all they have is ''quite troublesome''
Lets hope you lot on here who think the teacher is the best thing since Charles Bronson don`t have kids in school who are less than perfectly behaved and heaven help them if they are caught chewing gum.
Lets hope you lot on here who think the teacher is the best thing since Charles Bronson don`t have kids in school who are less than perfectly behaved and heaven help them if they are caught chewing gum.
How can you equate acting the fool in class with smashing a child`s skull in with a heavy metal object.
seagulls4ever
New member
- Oct 2, 2003
- 4,338
No an intention to cause GBH is required. He was cleared of this. Had the child died he would have been guilty of manslaughter.
Pot noodles for everyone
New member
and you can't spell manslaughter without laughter.
Nottseagull
Well-known member
I wasn't really surprised something like this happened as we've had a big yob problem here for years, although the school is one of the better ones. Must admit I was quite shocked to hear the dumbbell was a 3kg one; I had presumed it was one of those little plastic coated ones that girls use to tone their arms! However, If you didn't click on the links, at least read this....every man has his breaking point.
The incident that landed him in court came after years of abuse.
On one occasion the brother of a pupil he had reprimanded turned up at his house to threaten him.
Trouble in the classroom led Harvey to attack
He was also assaulted by a student who pushed him into a bush when he confronted the pupil over the way he treated a female teacher.
On another occasion he was "shoved" by a disruptive pupil who had been put in his class after bad behaviour elsewhere.
The married father-of-two was was seen as anything but aggressive by nature.
From the local paper at the time of the incident Mansfield Chad: News, Sport, Jobs, Property, Cars, Entertainments More
The incident that landed him in court came after years of abuse.
On one occasion the brother of a pupil he had reprimanded turned up at his house to threaten him.
Trouble in the classroom led Harvey to attack
He was also assaulted by a student who pushed him into a bush when he confronted the pupil over the way he treated a female teacher.
On another occasion he was "shoved" by a disruptive pupil who had been put in his class after bad behaviour elsewhere.
The married father-of-two was was seen as anything but aggressive by nature.
From the local paper at the time of the incident Mansfield Chad: News, Sport, Jobs, Property, Cars, Entertainments More
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HampshireSeagulls
Moulding Generation Z
It's clear that many systems failed here - the education system, the teacher support system and the system which means that children believe they are beyond reproach at school and expect to behave as they feel with no consequences. Whilst battering them around the head with a barbell is at the slightly more extreme end of the scale, "empowering" the little shits has backfired to the point where schools are battlegrounds where the teachers are forced to fight with one hand behind their back. The kids can make unfounded allegations, the teachers are named and their careers are destroyed, all because they might have told little Johhny that actually he was not going to be a footballer/pop star/TV person because he was a talentless, brain dead little shit. They are not used to failing, not used to being told no, and expect it all given to them on a plate. I have kids now that "have" English O Levels. They clearly have the paper, but they cannot construct a sentence. When you ask why, they will tell you that the teacher sat them at the back of the room and told them what to write down. They admit to being awkward because the teacher would give in. They would not attend detention because Mummy and Daddy would march in and kick off. Discipline is what is needed, no matter what the rubber-backed educational welfare staff will tell you - without discipline we are destined to produce another generation of welfare spongers and subhuman troglodytes who cannot understand why no-one is knocking at their door to give them £40K a year jobs.
The teacher was goaded, they videoed it because they are clearly used to doing this with impunity - but they got a horror show. If he had meant to kill him, he would have killed him. He clearly has a mental issue and the smirking shit pulled the trigger which cost him a few brain cells that he could probably not afford to spare.
Don't rail against the teacher - sort the f***ing system out which lets brats like this goad a teacher, abuse the system, and then aim to exploit it on Youtube.
The teacher was goaded, they videoed it because they are clearly used to doing this with impunity - but they got a horror show. If he had meant to kill him, he would have killed him. He clearly has a mental issue and the smirking shit pulled the trigger which cost him a few brain cells that he could probably not afford to spare.
Don't rail against the teacher - sort the f***ing system out which lets brats like this goad a teacher, abuse the system, and then aim to exploit it on Youtube.
Was he a physics teacher? It happened at one of my schools. The physics teacher hit a pupil around the head with a chair leg. The pupil had the good sense to hit him back.
But in those days teachers were allowed to bully their prisoners.
But in those days teachers were allowed to bully their prisoners.
HampshireSeagulls
Moulding Generation Z
Bollocks - in what schools do you happen to have a spare "chair leg" around? Did he bring it in "just in case"? Was it lying around? Why would he have felt the need to hit a child with a chair leg? Palm of the hand is more likely, but that's not such an "interesting" story is it? If you hit someone around the head with a chair leg you would then need to disarm the person holding the chair leg to assault them back with it. Fabrication.
With an attitude like that you can see why there are issues in the classrooms. I bet you still call the police "pigs" as well don't you?