How many will follow Coventry and QPR’s lead?

[Guinness Boy]

Partly. There are other reasons why he's a gammon hero, though.

There may be a case for the authorities to do what you suggest, but they haven't done so, perhaps because they feel it is not their call to tell players to not take the knee?

Would people be happier if only black players were allowed to do it? Or perhaps nobody allowed to do it and any who do being fined? What should the football authorities do - allow it or ban it?

Perhaps the authorities can say you can do it if you want be we don't really like it, and we aren't going to let the ref signal it with a whistle any more, so you'll have to sort of do it 'in your own time' during the warm up?

That way those who 'feel' the BLM trope (mostly black players) strongly can do their gesture, and the rest of us can jolly well get on with our lives.

Mmmmmmnnnnnnno. No matter how I look at it, I think the knee taking is good and should continue.

I ask a simple question: who could be offended or see it as counter productive for players to take the knee?

No one should be offended. I'm certainly not.

Is it counter productive? Yes, when the non-kneelers become heros.

That was two questions

I'm afraid it has to be all or nothing because of the practicalities of the game. You can't kick off with half the players kneeling and the other half not. And if it is every team, every game then it becomes as much a part of routine as a pint, Sussex by the Sea and warming up the keepers. And it gives succour to the odd idiot like the bloke who booed and turned his back at the Chelsea friendly.

I repeat. Racism needs real and direct action, not gestures.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Always scratch my head at the very idea that anybody outside of a police force needs reminding that Black Lives Matter. Reckon just about everybody worth knowing always just assumed that that was always the case anyways. On what sane grounds would it not be?

 

[Not Andy Naylor]

No one should be offended. I'm certainly not.

Is it counter productive? Yes, when the non-kneelers become heros.

That was two questions

I'm afraid it has to be all or nothing because of the practicalities of the game. You can't kick off with half the players kneeling and the other half not. And if it is every team, every game then it becomes as much a part of routine as a pint, Sussex by the Sea and warming up the keepers. And it gives succour to the odd idiot like the bloke who booed and turned his back at the Chelsea friendly.

I repeat. Racism needs real and direct action, not gestures.

QPR, of course, have taken real and direct action against racism in the past by appointing a black director of football in Les Ferdinand and Chris Ramsey as manager. So if they decide that taking the knee is a gesture they no longer feel they have to make then their opinion should probably be respected more than most. But I'd be interested to know whose decision it was.

 

[DJ NOBO]

The majority of football clubs do excellent community work, can’t really see the point Warburton is trying to make.

I think he’s frustrated excellent football community work gets lost in the mix, while the gesture of taking a knee has had Much publicity.
Perhaps he has a point.
The collective taking a knee was powerful at first but (as touched on above ) it has lost impact and is Possibly largely preaching to those who already find racism abhorrent.
Football community projects get closer to the real issues, the real problem people, which is not easy to do.
It must be frustrating for clubs when they usually go under the media radar.

 

[Lenny Rider]

Why does it bother you so much?

Up against what else is panning out in this country at the moment it doesn’t bother me, In the grand scheme of things it’s a gesture, what interested me was that one of the clubs involved Stadium is named after a victim of knife crime, so it was a bit of a ballsy call to go ahead and do it.

Watching Sky Sports and how they handled it, you would have thought the Queen had died.

But if the Albion don’t do it tomorrow I won’t be writing to the Argus in disgust. (Although I guess you might)

 

[Guinness Boy]

QPR, of course, have taken real and direct action against racism in the past by appointing a black director of football in Les Ferdinand and Chris Ramsey as manager. So if they decide that taking the knee is a gesture they no longer feel they have to make then their opinion should probably be respected more than most. But I'd be interested to know whose decision it was.

Yep.

I answered Harry's question out of curtesy and debate but really my dual points are this. Firstly, I do not want the Alt Right becoming the heroes and voice of protest. Secondly, football globally needs to put its house in order.

 

[Billy the Fish]

There was always going to be finger pointing and accusations at the first person or team to stop doing it.

That's probably why most are still doing it, they just don't want to be the first to stop despite how meaningless the gesture has become.

 

[The Wizard]

Anything that is universally followed through fear loses its meaning, because we know full well many footballers currently ‘bending the knee’ will not actually believe in it but are purely doing it through fear of consequences of not doing it. If you are ‘coerced’ into a gesture it loses all its meaning IMO. We all know, the first PL footballer who doesn’t kneel, will be abused to high heaven for it and will be labelled.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Up against what else is panning out in this country at the moment it doesn’t bother me, In the grand scheme of things it’s a gesture, what interested me was that one of the clubs involved Stadium is named after a victim of knife crime, so it was a bit of a ballsy call to go ahead and do it.

Watching Sky Sports and how they handled it, you would have thought the Queen had died.

But if the Albion don’t do it tomorrow I won’t be writing to the Argus in disgust. (Although I guess you might)

You really need to stop channeling your inner Arthur Mullard [MENTION=17322]Lenny Rider[/MENTION] (and please don't send me a PM on this one cos it won't be acknowledged)

 

[Napper]

I think everyone is over it now. It's all a bit meaningless being instructed to do it now.

The BLM movement has been cheapened from what it originally was and is actually working against what it intended. I think the over riding feeling amongst most people is it is all a bit tedious now.

Probably get grief for that but thats the view im getting from lots of different places ( and not all my social circle )

 

[dingodan]

The Declaration of Independence did indeed espouse noble ideals but I don't think I need to point out the elephant in the cotton field.

It's fair to point that out, but it was certainly far more complicated than noble ideas but empty words.

This is worth a read on the details, the originators of the DoI wanted to deal with the issue, but trying to bring together disparate states and be united for a war which they knew was coming meant that they had be mindful of how to change the slavery situation and at what pace. It would not be fair at all to say that their deeds revealed that they didn't really believe their words, which I think some people believe. It was way more complicated than that.

https://www.ushistory.org/declaration//lessonplan/slavery.html

"In a sense we have come to our nation's capital to cash a check. When the architects of our republic wrote the magnificent words of the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence, they were signing a promissory note to which every American was to fall heir. This note was a promise that all men, yes, black men as well as white men, would be guaranteed the unalienable rights of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness."

— from Martin Luther King Jr's I have a Dream speech, August 28, 1963

 

[drew]

I tend to take the view that if it is done out of routine it does become meaningless because, at best it is just a gesture. The reporting should be on what is or isn't being done to end racism in various organisations/societies. There have been massive steps forward in the last 50 years and further advancement is still necessary, particularly in the Police forces of the USA! Taking the knee would become more significant if it was then at major events with global audiences such as the big cup finals, internationals etc.

 

[W3 BHA]

The Declaration of Independence did indeed espouse noble ideals but I don't think I need to point out the elephant in the cotton field.

Or on the Reservations....

 

[wellquickwoody]

Why does it bother you so much?

Obviously bothers you as much.

 

[father_and_son]

I thought it had now become a permanent thing and is just part of the match day routine?

Not taking it has forced it backinto the news. The danger was always it would lose its impact if every team/player did it at every game.

Both clubs should ensure they do it at their next games to continue to gain headlines.

 

[Horton's halftime iceberg]

I am glad both Portsmouth and Albion took a knee on Thursday and Sussex CCC before innings as well. I have no idea why people believe the cause and campaign are over. Say their names.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fumaCsQ9wKw

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

No one should be offended. I'm certainly not.

Is it counter productive? Yes, when the non-kneelers become heros.

That was two questions

I'm afraid it has to be all or nothing because of the practicalities of the game. You can't kick off with half the players kneeling and the other half not. And if it is every team, every game then it becomes as much a part of routine as a pint, Sussex by the Sea and warming up the keepers. And it gives succour to the odd idiot like the bloke who booed and turned his back at the Chelsea friendly.

I repeat. Racism needs real and direct action, not gestures.

I agree with all that, albeit I don't mind if it becomes part of the routine. There are enough gammon getting exercised about it that it won't be forgotten.

Anyway, it is what it is. The sunshine becons.

 

[Sheebo]

Time to stop it imo - the message has been more than received. Just time for actions and a very big minority to change. Job done as far as taking the knee is concerned.

 

[Monkey Man]

How long before someone is injured taking the knee?

I suspect I'd be running a serious risk of it.

 

[Wardy's twin]

Not sure what it is delivering at this point. The action has become repetitive and robotic, real action needs to be taken to address racism e.g. the recent cases of the Black MP and the Black British athletes have disappeared off the horizon but were clearly down to the belief that if the person is black and driving a posh car then they must have stolen it.

It also begs the question why don't all businesses do the same as part of their day that would get the message across a much wider audience and be more telling by the response to it.

A bigger issue though which is being totally ignored is the environment and that will negatively affect everyone.