Holroyd's Back

[BensGrandad]

Holroyd was training Sunday at the Falmer Sports Complex.

Bit late for the Brighton Marathon.

 

[BensGrandad]

They all chip in with goals though. If you'd looked at our squad at the beginning of the season would you have honestly envisaged where we are now with our collection of cast off's and freebies!

When Sandaza has come on and scored a goal or two against knackered defenders but Holroyd hasnt had a worthwhile shot yet. Would you say either is better than Tubbs of Crawley.

 

[severnside gull]

When Sandaza has come on and scored a goal or two against knackered defenders but Holroyd hasnt had a worthwhile shot yet. Would you say either is better than Tubbs of Crawley.

Dunno. Did Tubbs play in the Scottish Premier League for two seasons or score against Celtic/Rangers?

 

[BensGrandad]

Not sure but at least he can control the ball when it is at his feet

 

[Guy Fawkes]

Why oh why is Gus so keen to see the players 'not given a chance' this season to see what they can do in the final few games?. lsn't it already pretty obvious that pretty much ALL of these players will be surplus to requirements come the end of the season?. lf they cant make the team in League 1, they sure wont make it in the Championship. Plus, as earlier posts have said, wouldnt it be great to remain the only undefeated team in the entire league for the season?. Surely much more chance of achieving that goal with the current tried and tested players, than fielding a largely experimental line-up.
Yes l know the boys are tired, but l'm sure the little diddums can manage just six more games, with the carrot of winning the Champiionship at the end of them!.

That would be some achievement, especially given that we've already lost to Sheffield Wednesday, Hartlepool, Huddersfield, Bournemouth and MK Dons.


Poyet has already said he will give the fringe players a chance once promotion and the title are decided, Holroyd is young and did score a lot of goals before joining us (but at a lower level) once he gets 1 for us, he could find his form and prove his worth.

I don't get get this need of some so called fans to constantly write off some of our players before they have had a fair chance to prove themselves - how does this in any way shape or form help? - i just hope that if he does get a chance, he does well and proves the doubters wrong, just like the doubters were wrong about El-Abd. He is still one of our players and surely as fans we'd want to do all we can to help him (and other players present and future) to succeed here for the benefit of the team, getting on a players back and destroying his confidence is doing the exact opposite - so where is there any benefit to it?

Poyet originally saw something he liked with Holroyd, so how about giving him a chance while he is still one of our players and maybe he will surprise you.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Not sure but at least he can control the ball when it is at his feet

Clearly, Holroyd can. It is just that we haven't seen a great deal of him.

You know our manager, Gus Poyet, he has recalled Holroyd as he thinks he is worth a second look. Who are we to argue with that?

Granted, we are all entitled to our opinions of a player, but some people seem to be suggesting that Holroyd is completely devoid of talent or necessary attributes to be a footballer.

Can Holroyd really not control the ball?

 

[BensGrandad]

The lack of ball control is attributed to Sandaza the inability to have a shot at goal is attributed to Holroyd. Even a manager as good as Gus is allowed to make a mistake and signing Holroyd is his.

 

[severnside gull]

Not sure but at least he can control the ball when it is at his feet

Here you go BG - an extract from Fran Sandaza's Wiki entry

On 11 July 2008, Sandaza instead signed for Scottish Premier League side Dundee United,[2] making his league début exactly a month later.[3] After scoring three goals in pre-season, he scored his first competitive goal for the club in the 1–1 draw against Celtic on 17 August 2008.[4] In September, Sandaza scored his second and netted four times in the first half of November, including a double against eventual champions, Rangers. Injury halted Sandaza's progress towards the end of the year and he didn't score again until late February, scoring three more times in March. In his first season in Scotland, Sandaza scored ten league goals, with five coming against the Old Firm.


Last I saw Tubbs' career record comprised Salisbury City, a few games on loan for Bournemouth, and Crawley


You normally post with a degree of thought but to suggest that Tubbs is a better footballer...........................................

FWIW I have seen Tubbs be totally ineffectual and fail to get near to controlling the ball while I have also seen Sandaza hold and pass the ball with great effect. I have seen the opposite from both of course but then I am not in denial of the fact

 

[BensGrandad]

That looks pretty impressive but he hasnt really stood out for us and I wouldnt be sad to see him go.

 

[Guy Fawkes]

When Gus signed him he said about Holroyd

I am delighted to have completed the deal. Chris is an exciting young prospect and he is one for the future.

He has an excellent goalscoring record this season and has tremendous potential"

Its amazing how quick some 'fans' are to write off young players, they are not going to be the finished article straight away and will take time to learn and develop - you would have thought they would have learnt that lesson with El-Abd (how many years did it take him to get to the standard he is now and how many years agao were the doubters calling for him to be given the boot as 'not upto non-league standard' and would never be good enough.

I wonder how many other players there have been that we have missed out on fulfilling their potential at the Albion because of fans impatience - for example, had they not destroyed Craig Davies confidence and hadn't made it impossible for him to stay here (MK Dons away) he may have been banging in the goals for us instead of Chesterfield, but i guess the doubters got what they want rather than the club getting someone that could have benefitted us instead.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

That looks pretty impressive but he hasnt really stood out for us and I wouldnt be sad to see him go.

He hasn't really had a chance to do so. He wasn't fit when we signed him and he was recovering from surgery. Our other strikers have done exceedingly well, so it hasn't quite worked out thus far.

Sandaza has played an important role when he has played for us. I'm thinking the winner vs Oldham to put us top, the equaliser against FC United and the sheer panic he caused when he came on and set up Bridcutt for the winner against Carlisle.

 

[Guy Fawkes]

When Sandaza has come on and scored a goal or two against knackered defenders but Holroyd hasnt had a worthwhile shot yet. Would you say either is better than Tubbs of Crawley.

Pretty hard for Holroyd to do that here when he has been out on loan, he might have score a fair few goals had he played for us this season given the improved creativity in the side - if he comes back into the side, and we are still creating lots of chances then i would think he would start scoring but a few minutes as a sub here and there isnt exactly going to show a player in their best light is it?

And to repeat for the slow witted out there, he is young and still developing, he was brought in as a prospect and as one for the future, something you conveniently like to ignore in your criticism of players - He was never going to be the finished article when he first joined, our attack (and whole team) has done well this season which has limited Holroyds chances and which is probably why he went out on loan, to get games and experience - not because the manager was keen to get rid of him.

If Poyet gives him a chance and he does well and / or gets a new contract, i hope he won't have to put up with too many idiots like you who like to slag off our own players and dont give them time to prove themselves.

Wonder who many games it will take before you start slagging of Agdestein, what if he doesnt score in his first, second or third appearance - will you be calling for his head too? or will you be more leanient in your assessment of him?

 

[severnside gull]

Don't worry BG. I am sure you will get the chance to bounce this thread as I am sure that, with promotion, we will see a considerable (greater than most expect) degree of tidying-up in the squad and I would be mildly surprised if the likes of Holroyd and Sandaza were with us in the Championship. However, I think the point that others have made is excellent. We are all too quick as fans to turn our back on a player if we percieve that they haven't been the success we expected whether or not they have truly had a chance. Craig Davies is a classic recent example and now we have Sandaza and Holroyd who have barely made it into double figures for a place in the starting line up between them. Sandaza clearly does have something - his pedigree suggests it and as BOF points out he has made some tellng contributions coming off the bench. At the same time Gus admits that Holroyd may not suit our style of play (or that we fail to adapt to his) and in the back of my mind I think that just maybe that is indicative of a managerial weakness in that there isn't always an alternative when the passing game falls down. I do appreciate that he is not so young but he could still learn and develop with the right coaching - whether that will be here I suspect not but then you can never say never in football. What counts I think is that neither deserve to just be written off as "no talents".

The point about Agdestein sums it up nicely. How quickly will he be consigned to the scrapheap if he fails to deliver almost instantly? After all, there have been plenty this season who would already have discarded 14 goal Ashley Barnes as being not good enough and the current clamour to give Murray a new contract is nothing compared to the noise of those insisting we get rid of him through the first two years of his contract .

 

[Spider]

Don't worry BG. I am sure you will get the chance to bounce this thread as I am sure that, with promotion, we will see a considerable (greater than most expect) degree of tidying-up in the squad and I would be mildly surprised if the likes of Holroyd and Sandaza were with us in the Championship. However, I think the point that others have made is excellent. We are all too quick as fans to turn our back on a player if we percieve that they haven't been the success we expected whether or not they have truly had a chance. Craig Davies is a classic recent example and now we have Sandaza and Holroyd who have barely made it into double figures for a place in the starting line up between them. Sandaza clearly does have something - his pedigree suggests it and as BOF points out he has made some tellng contributions coming off the bench. .

I agree with this in some cases, but I'm not sure about Davies. Didn't he play about 14 games, scoring just 1 (very lucky) goal on his debut and otherwise looking shite. If you are writing off a player after a couple of games it would be stupid, but at the same time how long are fans supposed to wait before they actually see some indication of a player being decent. At the time we were desperate for goals, it's inevitable that fans become impatient, but at some point that impatience must become justified and I'd say that after half a season with us it's fair to say so if you honestly don't think a player is good enough.

As for Holroyd, I'm not exactly booing him, and I would hope any negative comments I make on here aren't seriously going to dent his confidence, I just simply don't think he is, or ever will be, good enough for us.

 

[Seagull on the wing]

We have had players which we could've signed/or were on the books but did'nt keep and they went on to be top scorers,Hayter,Davies and most of all Ian Wright

 

[Return of the Rev]

WELCOME BACK TUNA!!!!!!!! SOMEHOW I THINK THE GANGLY CREATURE STILL HAS A PART TO PLAY BEFORE THIS TALE IS OVER

 

[joker]

Oh dear, can we not just sum all of this up with the simple but oh so true statement "in Gus we trust" after all he is our manager and let's face, he's not doing a bad job is he.

 

[libra-gully]

I can't help thinking that we are as guilty as the next club, at being too quick to condemn young talent. Sometimes lads take a while to develope but in today's short term world they are never given the time to prove their worth.

Exactly how many games has Holroyd started and yet he is condemned as 'no good', by the Albion faithfull.

Somebody thought Jake Robinson was not good enough for this division, and yet this season he has played for Shrewbury, and now Torquay, both who are in the play off positions to come up to this division. Maybe now he has found his true level, but who knows?

Today we have given eight young lads a scholarship. How many of those will we ever see in an Albion shirt at Falmer. For the sake of everyone concerned, and the financial investment, I hope that several will make it, but will they?

It would be good to bounce this on a few years to see.