So pleased that the truth is out. Just to add, a workmate of mine was also there that day, and he's never been able to go to a match since because of the trauma. He is a Forest fan. So many victims...
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Hillsborough the search for the truth
- Thread starter pornomagboy
- Start date
So pleased that the truth is out. Just to add, a workmate of mine was also there that day, and he's never been able to go to a match since because of the trauma. He is a Forest fan. So many victims...
Kalimantan Gull
Well-known member
Interesting reading. Thanks to[MENTION=4251]ROSM[/MENTION] and [MENTION=459]Bwian[/MENTION] for the detail provided. What I still don't understand is why? Why the cover-up? I can guess at it I suppose, but from what I've read above it seems a police officer, believing the fans had tickets and wanting to avoid a crush outside, opened a gate in good faith. The design of the ground then led to a deadly crush in the central pen of the terrace, it seems the police officer was unlikely to know this, despite the wolves-spurs game 8 years earlier? (was this a home stand or away stand?)
So why, as soon as the tragedy unfolds, start covering up - denying ambulances on the pitch, taking blood samples? and was it the knowledge they had done this the reason the larger cover-up happened - changing statements etc.? or is it a larger political thing? perhaps this is all conjecture, but has anything come out today that covers this?
or was this in Taylor - which I haven't read ......... yet
So why, as soon as the tragedy unfolds, start covering up - denying ambulances on the pitch, taking blood samples? and was it the knowledge they had done this the reason the larger cover-up happened - changing statements etc.? or is it a larger political thing? perhaps this is all conjecture, but has anything come out today that covers this?
or was this in Taylor - which I haven't read ......... yet
BUTTERBALL
East Stand Brighton Boyz
History will show that the truth came out in the end.
clapham_gull
Legacy Fan
- Aug 20, 2003
- 25,854
The smear campaign worked very very well. The lies have been repeated time and again, even those contradicted by the Taylor report.
Serving politicians (most famously that bloke in charge of London) have been quite happy to reel them out over the years.
Even within the last few days on here, people have been quite happy to blame the fans.
Imagine yourself as a relation of one of the dead having to fight against that nonsense from mostly well meaning people who have swallowed the lies.
The campaigners are remarkable people.
I posted on another thread that my anger is directed at the cover up. That wrong doing has been going for over 20 years.
This is far from over, it's just begun.
Serving politicians (most famously that bloke in charge of London) have been quite happy to reel them out over the years.
Even within the last few days on here, people have been quite happy to blame the fans.
Imagine yourself as a relation of one of the dead having to fight against that nonsense from mostly well meaning people who have swallowed the lies.
The campaigners are remarkable people.
I posted on another thread that my anger is directed at the cover up. That wrong doing has been going for over 20 years.
This is far from over, it's just begun.
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Bwian
Kiss my (_!_)
- Jul 14, 2003
- 15,898
They had the will to clear their loved one's names. A 23 year battle showed great tenacity, belief in their cause and they had the courage to keep going when, at times it must have seemed like the rest of the country didn't believe them. I think they have done this country a massive favour-police corruption could be on its last legs.
The Large One
Who's Next?
Taylor spelled out the facts about the fans' behaviour, the police's behaviour, the emergency services and so on - and yesterday's report confirms them. That information has been in the public domain for 20 years, since the report was published, though some people, even up to yesterday, still wished to peddle the lies that the fans were in some way to blame.
Taylor didn't have access to the documents that the Indepdendent Panel had - no government minister was prepared to release them until Andy Burnham MP set the wheels in motion two years ago. They covered-up because they thought they could get away with covering it up. SYP arrogantly believed that Taylor would exonerate them.
That leads to a separate point - why did they believe they'd be exonerated? You also have to remember that political pressure from the Cabinet was brought to bear on Taylor for a quick and neat report. Taylor refused, and launched a thorough one.
It was the very same end where the 96 Liverpool fans were killed 8 years later. The same pen.
I'd like to point out I'm not putting blame on SWFC for this - the FA are ultimately in charge of allowing games to go ahead. I expect the police/local council/FA have a part in awarding safety certificates, or allowing games to go ahead without one.
JJ McClure
Go Jags
I can't help feeling slightly uncomfortable about the fact that the families are now pressing for criminal charges. They kept on saying that they were fighting for the truth. Now that 23 years later they have the truth they want to carry on and see people locked up. Isn't there a point when they should take solace in the fact that the truth has been told and just let the issue rest in peace with their loved ones.
I believe the campaign was for 'Justice for the 96', not 'Truth about the 96'. When you discover your loved ones have been killed needlessly due to operational failures, then find out that they could still be alive today if the people in charge had acted properly I doubt you'd call that 'justice'.
The Large One
Who's Next?
Govt: "It has now been established (albeit 20 years ago) that police negligence was to blame for this tragedy..."
JFT96: "Oh, OK. Thanks."
Can't quite see that ending there.
The Large One
Who's Next?
While you're right about the licensing authorities, I don't think Sheffield Wednesday should escape their portion of blame.
They knew that their ground wasn't up to required safety standards for a match of this type, and yet were still happy for it to go ahead - and for them to reap the financial rewards therein.
nwgull
Well-known member
Just been looking on Owlstalk (to check out their thoughts on Friday's game). Interesting that many on there don't accept that it's such a black and white situation with regard or blame. Also calling into question the independence of the committee. Certainly a different point of view anyway.
Chief Wiggum
New member
- Apr 30, 2009
- 518
Some interesting alternative views and comments on these blogs:
Liverpool Expects This Day Sick Justice!
Ambush Predator: s The New Black!
Liverpool Expects This Day Sick Justice!
Ambush Predator: s The New Black!
Just reading a lot of Sheff Wed fans on Twitter being outraged that their club has any kind of responsibility to shoulder in this whole affair, and shocked the club apologised yesterday. They are blaming the FA for hosting the game there and the Liverpool fans for turning up late and/or without tickets. I am pretty sure none of them have read the report from yesterday that clearly shows the safety issues at the ground were known, and that the club chose not to act on recommendations on improving the safety in order to save money and so that stand didn't have a valid safety certificate. I'm not sure if the FA knew this as well though?
Kalimantan Gull
Well-known member
I do get all that, I just question why the police felt the need to cover-up at all, what was driving that decision?
Twinkle Toes
Growing old disgracefully
There's none so blind as those who will not see.
Hillian1
( . ) ( . )
Oh what a tangled web we weave.
Twinkle Toes
Growing old disgracefully
The reasons will hopefully be fully revealed as the process of Justice continues.
The Large One
Who's Next?
Why does anyone cover up a catastrophic f***-up?
The possibility of criticism, prosecution, loss of job, loss of pension, prison - the list goes on.
Tooting Gull
Well-known member
- Jul 5, 2003
- 11,033
Agree with that. Of the various parties that have escaped a larger, and fairer, share of the public outrage for this tragedy, SWFC and the Sheff city council are right up there.
And I think truth and justice go together here. If you had it confirmed yesterday that your son/daughter/brother/sister/husband/wife could have survived if the police hadn't been refusing ambulances admittance saying there was fighting on the pitch, you'd take this further, and rightly so.