[Albion] Green Party attempt to ban cars in Central Brighton

[MattBackHome]

FILTH and SCUM

 

[A1X]

But ironically, some of the numpties will believe they have done there bit by stopping cars going into Brighton centre, but still, emit carbon without blinking by the ton, while flying out several times a year.

"But ironically, some of the numpties who believe they one day will be able to fly in the air still travel the land by stagecoach and horse without blinking."

- Ye Olde Mouldy Boots, 1783

 

[Chicken Run]

I'm fed up with all this ninnying around so this is what's gonna happen:-

01.01.21

- Palace Pier to Montpelier Rd vehicle free except buses.
- Likewise Monty to Western, Western to North Street.
- Queens Road also buses only.
- The Lanes and North Laine car free between 8am and 6pm.
- The now obsolete NCP car park on the left of Queens Road to be made 'residents only'.

01.01.22
- Trolley bus/tram/monorail/waterslide loop build is complete.
- Buses removed from the city.

01.01.23
- The process begins again pushing up to Seven Dials.

Only this time everybody will be desperate for it to happen sooner because the f**kin idiots who currently can't look beyond the end of their noses will finally see the benefit.




I HAVE SPOKEN - MAKE IT SO.

What about Taxis? Will they be allowed in the bus only area?

 

[Stat Brother]

What about Taxis? Will they be allowed in the bus only area?

No.

 

[Easy 10]

I've long felt that a pedestrianised boulevard running from Brighton station all the way down Queens Road and West Street to the seafront would be a thing of wonder. Regenerate the whole shabby area (especially West St), encourage market stalls etc. It could be like our very own mini Las Ramblas.

Pie in the sky though I suppose.

 

[Hotchilidog]

I've long felt that a pedestrianised boulevard running from Brighton station all the way down Queens Road and West Street to the seafront would be a thing of wonder. Regenerate the whole shabby area (especially West St), encourage market stalls etc. It could be like our very own mini Las Ramblas.

Pie in the sky though I suppose.

This would be excellent and is definitely the sort of thing we should be looking at.

 

[Stat Brother]

I've long felt that a pedestrianised boulevard running from Brighton station all the way down Queens Road and West Street to the seafront would be a thing of wonder. Regenerate the whole shabby area (especially West St), encourage market stalls etc. It could be like our very own mini Las Ramblas.

Pie in the sky though I suppose.

The front of the station is an embarrassment to Brighton and Sussex.

Coming down from that there London town, with all it's noise, pollution, traffic and chaos.
You walk through the concourse and blammo

You're somewhere even worse.


The front of the station should be comparatively silent.
It should sell the city.
It should smell of sea air.
It should look attractive, engaging and fun.
The first thing you notice should be the sea.

Instead it:-

Pedestrian crossing beeping.
Engines running.
Cramped
Dangerous
Dirty.

 

[BBassic]

I don't get the eye rolling about wanting a car free city centre and then flying out for a holiday.

Use email?

https://carbonliteracy.com/the-carbon-cost-of-an-email/

Stream media?

https://www.dw.com/en/is-netflix-ba...ideo-contributes-to-climate-change/a-49556716

Own a smartphone?

https://www.lovefone.co.uk/blogs/news/how-much-co2-does-it-take-to-make-a-smartphone


Seems there isn't much we do, use or consume that isn't somehow producing a carbon footprint of some size.

We're all guilty of it to some degree, I suspect. Banning cars from a city centre is a small thing and is probably negatively offset somewhere else by something else like someone flying to Tenerife for a week or two away from their soul crushing job they have to work in order to feed their family but it's something, isn't it?

 

[Triggaaar]

It would be illegal if there wasn't

At the moment a disabled person can drive to town, and park reasonably centrally, for a short journey to their destination. If cars are banned, they will no longer be able to do this. It won't be illegal, but it will make accessing the centre of town much more difficult for some disabled people.

 

[Bold Seagull]

At the moment a disabled person can drive to town, and park reasonably centrally, for a short journey to their destination. If cars are banned, they will no longer be able to do this. It won't be illegal, but it will make accessing the centre of town much more difficult for some disabled people.

The flip side of that is it may make it easier. Given many current through streets may become dead ends, then there would be opportunities to actually increase disabled street parking allowing closer access than they currently can. The key is once you eliminate most of the traffic, then access to those that most need it can be made available.

If accessibility for disabled persons, pushchairs etc. is people's main concerns, then the current arrangements are nothing short of a disgrace in some areas. The negotiation of narrow pavements, high kerbs, tight spaces, crowded pinch points. As [MENTION=435]Stat Brother[/MENTION] above points out, the arrival to our city from the station with a 2m wide pavement on both sides is embarrassing. Accessibility could be one of the fundamental points for doing it.

 

[blue-shifted]

Sneering cynicism in itself does not add to carbon emissions, so you can give yourself a pat on the back for that one.

However people deserve some credit for being open to change. Your stance that anyone concerned about climate change should disavow themselves of all their worldly goods and live a life of meditation is at odds with your view that they would then be workshy spongers. Why do you feel the need to set the bar impossibly high for everyone else?

We are on a journey and it will be easier if people are open to change. No one can do everything in one giant step, so it needs to be a series of incremental changes.

Whenever you get these arguments you do encounter who can't supply any logical arguments which stand up to the slightest bit of scrutiny, but they will default to an attitude of I won't lift a finger to change my lifestyle until the people who are more passionate about it achieve perfection in their lifestyle ... which they know can't happen. We will all leave a carbon footprint.

I'll guess this attitude comes from A) inherent resistance to change, B) refusal to acknowledge that they, as we all have, have been part of the problem, C) some desire to be seen as a Clarkson style "common sense for the common man" type, D) unwillingness to make modest lifestyle changes for the benefit of others E) don't get loads of attention so they've twigged the best way to get the reaction they don't get in their offline life is to go online and bait people on subjects they are passionate about. Environmentalism and the future of life on the planet is normally a happy hunting ground

 

[Bakero]

Boggles the mind that anybody is against a car-free city centre.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

I've long felt that a pedestrianised boulevard running from Brighton station all the way down Queens Road and West Street to the seafront would be a thing of wonder. Regenerate the whole shabby area (especially West St), encourage market stalls etc. It could be like our very own mini Las Ramblas.

Pie in the sky though I suppose.

I like this idea. Could be the first stage of a phased pedestrianisation. Has any feasibility work ever been done or is this all in the idea stage at the moment ? Not living locally anymore I don’t really follow it closely.

 

[blue-shifted]

I don't disagree with your overall sentiment that everyone needs to do their bit both for their own footprint, and their desire for larger politically led changes.

However, improving Brighton city centre is worth more than just the consideration of emissions. It will make it a more desirable place to visit, enable easier access improving wheelchair/pushchair accessibility. It will add the necessary improvements to the retail experience to keep it relevant against online competition.

The death of the high street will happen if the high street doesn't change and evolve. The facts and figures are there from European cities that have done the same thing and their economic data before and after.

Excellent point. This isn't primarily a question of air quality, the environment or transport. It's a question of how can we insulate our city from losing the shops, pubs and restaurants in our town centre which in the days of deliveroo, amazon and stay at home and watch TV culture. Every bit of evidence from the shops which have closed down is that the primary reason they have done so is that they failed to offer any sort of shopper experience, in other words they offered nothing which couldn't be got online. The same principle surely applies when scaled up to a town. We (The city of Brighton and Hove) are competing with other destinations of a daily basis for football. More importantly we're also competing with the lure of the sofa and the remote control.

We have to offer a pleasant environment for young and old and for families. At the moment we're failing on a number of simple measures, people have spoken, quite rightly about cleanliness and homelessness and some obviously left behind parts of the city and I expect my councillors and MP's to be working as hard as possible to tackle these issues. But taking cars away from the city centre is the single biggest thing we could do to increase the pleasantness of the town

 

[Chicken Run]

No.

Why what’s the difference?

 

[Easy 10]

I like this idea. Could be the first stage of a phased pedestrianisation. Has any feasibility work ever been done or is this all in the idea stage at the moment ? Not living locally anymore I don’t really follow it closely.

Not to my knowledge, its just a thought I've long held but I doubt if I'm the only person its occurred to.

 

[Stat Brother]

Why what’s the difference?

If you need the difference between a bus and a taxi explained to you, this thread probably isn't for you.

 

[blue-shifted]

Boggles the mind that anybody is against a car-free city centre.

Well yes but I think we can look at recent history and conclude that what is sensible and has widespread agreement on a chat site won't always play well at a ballot box.

Us saying it makes sense is one thing, finding the politicians willing to stake their careers and campaign on the detail of it is another. Greens got voted out of a majority pretty quickly. There's (incredibly as it sounds) huge hostility to anything seen as environmental

 

[Brovion]

I don't get the eye rolling about wanting a car free city centre and then flying out for a holiday.

Use email?

https://carbonliteracy.com/the-carbon-cost-of-an-email/

Stream media?

https://www.dw.com/en/is-netflix-ba...ideo-contributes-to-climate-change/a-49556716

Own a smartphone?

https://www.lovefone.co.uk/blogs/news/how-much-co2-does-it-take-to-make-a-smartphone


Seems there isn't much we do, use or consume that isn't somehow producing a carbon footprint of some size.

We're all guilty of it to some degree, I suspect. Banning cars from a city centre is a small thing and is probably negatively offset somewhere else by something else like someone flying to Tenerife for a week or two away from their soul crushing job they have to work in order to feed their family but it's something, isn't it?

TBH, for me the 'climate' argument is (almost) irrelevant in this case. As you say any global environmental benefit we gain from banning cars in Brighton city centre can easily be undone by other choices we make. What is undoubtedly true though is that banning cars, indeed banning anything with wheels, will make Brighton a MUCH more pleasant place to walk round. Will it be disastrous for the city? Well as I said on the Valley Gardens thread that well-known ultra-left wing Sussex hotbed of progressive Green Socialism, Chichester, has had a car-free centre since the 1960s and it's been fine. Ditto many ,many other towns and cities in the UK.

Try it, and if it is a colossal failure (especially without P 'n' R) then we can think again.

 

[blue-shifted]

TBH, for me the 'climate' argument is (almost) irrelevant in this case. As you say any global environmental benefit we gain from banning cars in Brighton city centre can easily be undone by other choices we make. What is undoubtedly true though is that banning cars, indeed banning anything with wheels, will make Brighton a MUCH more pleasant place to walk round. Will it be disastrous for the city? Well as I said on the Valley Gardens thread that well-known ultra-left wing Sussex hotbed of progressive Green Socialism, Chichester, has had a car-free centre since the 1960s and it's been fine. Ditto many ,many other towns and cities in the UK.

Try it, and if it is a colossal failure (especially without P 'n' R) then we can think again.

You banning everything with wheels? Even 2 wheels?

You can probably expect a response