[News] George Floyd trial

[FatSuperman]

I agree, but my point is, he was being arrested for a small felony, why the strong resistance which clearly contributed to his tragic death,

he clearly isn't claustrophobic as he was sitting behind the wheel of a vehicle when they arrested him.

None of that is relevant. Nor is his drug use. The only thing being asked is 'did this police officer kill this man through recklessness?'. Nobody is supposed to asking if George Floyd was a nice guy - that is entirely irrelevant. The police officer has effectively murdered someone.

 

[NooBHA]

I agree, but my point is, he was being arrested for a small felony, why the strong resistance which clearly contributed to his tragic death,

he clearly isn't claustrophobic as he was sitting behind the wheel of a vehicle when they arrested him.

I think we would all possibly agree. That claustrophobic or not. That doesn't make him exempt from arrest. Otherwise everyone would make the same claim and refuse to be arrested in anything but a stretch limousine.

No one disputes how the early part of the incident played out and the police were well within their rights to arrest him.

How he died and the actions which caused his death were intentional acts and that is why Chauvin should be found guilty of Murder. Although I just feel that at least one Juror will find him not guilty. Thus thwarting a murder conviction.

 

[Lyndhurst 14]

This case shares many similarities with the Eric Garner case in New York. He died as a result of a choke hold by the NYPD. Again the incident was caught on video. His crime was trying to sell cigarettes without tax stamps. The family settled on a civil lawsuit for $6 million against the state of New York but a grand jury did not indict the NYPD officer involved which led to mass demonstrations, the officer plans to sue for reinstatement .

 

[portlock seagull]

I find the entire America justice system plain weird. Kids aged 10 or less in orange jump suits shackled in court, disproportionate strength and ‘precautions’ used when making an arrest or even questioning, incarceration for minor traffic violations, sentences ‘lasting’ hundreds of years...! It’s so completely screwed up and way OTT, enough to stop me going there on holiday for several years now. Violence breeds violence and seem happy to live in such a society. Which is their prerogative. As it is mine not to visit it anymore.

 

[essbee1]

I will never, ever again go to the US. I was accused of robbery in New Orleans from a corner store...on the basis of, get this:
because I TOOK TOO LONG TO SELECT THE BEER I WANTED. That implied I was a thief.

A crazy, fuc**d up and very sad society.

 

[Easy 10]

Some maHOOsive generalisations there. I've been to NYC, Chicago, Minneapolis, Vegas and Orlando, and the most negative experience I had was when we walked out of an Irish pub/restaurant in Manhattan because of the attitude of the waitress when I grizzled because they served our starters and then turned up with our main barely 2 minutes later. Rolling eyes like it was MY fault. The main came back inevitably zapped to shit, but that was an exception.

In my experience I've found americans friendly and engaging, and their service staff second to none (except for that irish gaff). I'll happily go back once this covid shitstorm has passed.

 

[essbee1]

Some maHOOsive generalisations there. I've been to NYC, Chicago, Minneapolis, Vegas and Orlando, and the most negative experience I had was when we walked out of an Irish pub/restaurant in Manhattan because of the attitude of the waitress when I grizzled because they served our starters and then turned up with our main barely 2 minutes later. Rolling eyes like it was MY fault. The main came back inevitably zapped to shit, but that was an exception.

In my experience I've found americans friendly and engaging, and their service staff second to none (except for that irish gaff). I'll happily go back once this covid shitstorm has passed.

I've been to NY twice, New Orleans, Pittsburgh, Miami, Austin, San Francisco, Los Angeles (twice) and Kansas.

My general feeling is that the US people are generally fine, but there is a very, very sinister underlying issue with
people generally, and have had very bad experiences with the US police who are aggressive and do not listen.

 

[Lyndhurst 14]

I think police forces the world over do tend to attract a certain type, as do the military. The NYPD did have a bad reputation at one time, and there are still instances where they abuse the trust and power given to them. IMO the NYPD do a pretty good job under very trying circumstances. With the proliferation of camera phones some of that excess has been reigned in as they know there's a good chance of their actions being recorded. Also like the fact that they have a pretty good sense of humor, seen quite a few munching their doughnuts a la Chief Wiggum in the Simpsons

 

[Easy 10]

I've been to NY twice, New Orleans, Pittsburgh, Miami, Austin, San Francisco, Los Angeles (twice) and Kansas.

My general feeling is that the US people are generally fine, but there is a very, very sinister underlying issue with
people generally, and have had very bad experiences with the US police who are aggressive and do not listen.

OK, I'll relay MY experience with the MSP here then.

We were staying in Minneapolis, but getting a train down to Chicago early the next morning. The train station is in St Paul (the other side of the Mississippi). The Doris is a bit windy and wanted to find the station with a "trial run" the evening before just so we knew where we were going (yeah, I know), then have dinner somewhere in St Paul. So we find the station, and know where to go the next day. Then we just want to find a little downtown area in St Paul with some bars and restaurants, but found ourselves wandering aimlessly round these high-rise blocks and wide avenues with not much in sight.

So we clock some MSP cops on a street corner, with a patrol car. I mince over there as the dorky tourist and say "err, we're just looking for a downtown street with some bars and restaurants, can you tell us if there's somewhere around here like that ?". One of the cops steps off the car bumper and starts giving me directions like "walk two blocks down there, take a left then.....ah hell, get in the back of the car".

So we got a lift from this MSP cop in the back of his police car (all black wire grills and plastic bucket seats), and he's telling us about all the equipment in there. And He drops us off in a street that was EXACTLY what we were looking for. There's a phrase that refers to "Minnesota Nice", and that particular officer displayed it in spades. He took the time to drive us there, and was utterly charming and affable throughout.

The few bad apples get the coverage and really do colour peoples perceptions. And I guess thats just how it is the world over.

 

[The Clamp]

I find the entire America justice system plain weird. Kids aged 10 or less in orange jump suits shackled in court, disproportionate strength and ‘precautions’ used when making an arrest or even questioning, incarceration for minor traffic violations, sentences ‘lasting’ hundreds of years...! It’s so completely screwed up and way OTT, enough to stop me going there on holiday for several years now. Violence breeds violence and seem happy to live in such a society. Which is their prerogative. As it is mine not to visit it anymore.

The industrial prison complex/private prison industry in the US requires inmates to make a profit and to keep free prison labour serving big business, making them a profit. They lobby government to create a legal system that is almost impossible to get out of once they have you. And they lobby government to make it very, very easy to be put into that system. Throw in a force of steroid amped, untouchable police officers to bring in the slaves and it’s a solid system that unfortunately works very well.
It’s not 100 % about racism. It’s not about getting drugs off the streets. It’s not about crime and punishment. It’s about profit.

 

[Easy 10]

The industrial prison complex/private prison industry in the US requires inmates to make a profit and to keep free prison labour serving big business, making them a profit. They lobby government to create a legal system that is almost impossible to get out of once they have you. And they lobby government to make it very, very easy to be put into that system. Throw in a force of steroid amped, untouchable police officers to bring in the slaves and it’s a solid system that unfortunately works very well.
It’s not 100 % about racism. It’s not about getting drugs off the streets. It’s not about crime and punishment. It’s about profit.

Sorry, but I call bobbins.

In California it costs, on average, over $81,000 a year per inmate to keep them incarcerated https://lao.ca.gov/PolicyAreas/CJ/6_cj_inmatecost

What evidence is there that it is actually PROFITABLE for the US to have people locked up ?

 

[StonehamPark]

I like Americans for the most part.
Spent many months there and met loads of people.

I've lived in Canada for almost 4 years now, and find Americans more genuine and open than Canadians. Though the humour is definitely a turn off.

 

[The Clamp]

Sorry, but I call bobbins.

In California it costs, on average, over $81,000 a year per inmate to keep them incarcerated https://lao.ca.gov/PolicyAreas/CJ/6_cj_inmatecost

What evidence is there that it is actually PROFITABLE for the US to have people locked up ?

This explains it better than I ever could;

https://www.investopedia.com/articles/investing/062215/business-model-private-prisons.asp

 

[Easy 10]

This explains it better than I ever could;

https://www.investopedia.com/articles/investing/062215/business-model-private-prisons.asp

198,000, or less than 9% of the entire inmate population, are in private prisons. And as the report states, some of these inmates still cost more than a public federal prison would cost.

So again. I call bobbins.

 

[The Clamp]

198,000, or less than 9% of the entire inmate population, are in private prisons. And as the report states, some of these inmates still cost more than a public federal prison would cost.

So again. I call bobbins.

9% at the moment. However since 2000 they have grown in number by 77% and that figure is continuing to grow. The cost of prisoners is how they profit. Prisoners as profit. It's an upward trend.

 

[neilbard]

I think we would all possibly agree. That claustrophobic or not. That doesn't make him exempt from arrest. Otherwise everyone would make the same claim and refuse to be arrested in anything but a stretch limousine.

No one disputes how the early part of the incident played out and the police were well within their rights to arrest him.

How he died and the actions which caused his death were intentional acts and that is why Chauvin should be found guilty of Murder. Although I just feel that at least one Juror will find him not guilty. Thus thwarting a murder conviction.

I'm not disagreeing with you, but some on here have the officer guilty before he's had a fair trial, otherwise lets just have no laws and let the lynch mobs and vigilante's rule, very dangerous territory.

 

[neilbard]

None of that is relevant. Nor is his drug use. The only thing being asked is 'did this police officer kill this man through recklessness?'. Nobody is supposed to asking if George Floyd was a nice guy - that is entirely irrelevant. The police officer has effectively murdered someone.

Agreed, but this is why we have trials to decide.

 

[Baldseagull]

Sorry, but I call bobbins.

In California it costs, on average, over $81,000 a year per inmate to keep them incarcerated https://lao.ca.gov/PolicyAreas/CJ/6_cj_inmatecost

What evidence is there that it is actually PROFITABLE for the US to have people locked up ?

I think you missed his point, it is profitable to the companies that run the prisons, and profitable for the companies that use the cheap labour, not necessarily great for the tax payer.

 

[Baldseagull]

198,000, or less than 9% of the entire inmate population, are in private prisons. And as the report states, some of these inmates still cost more than a public federal prison would cost.

So again. I call bobbins.

Not sure if it is still available on netflix, but have a look for a documentary called "13th".

 

[Baldseagull]

I'm not disagreeing with you, but some on here have the officer guilty before he's had a fair trial, otherwise lets just have no laws and let the lynch mobs and vigilante's rule, very dangerous territory.

It is difficult to imagine he is innocent of any crime, given I have seen him kneeling on the guys neck until, and after, he stopped breathing, but I am not wanting him lynched. I do expect him to be found guilty of some charge or other, whether that is murder, manslaughter, or some other charge, it can't be lawful to do what we all have witnessed.